Cracked Cylinders

[Mach VII]

An update on the situation.

*Attached the dealership diagnostic.

As many suggested, I pulled the car out from Galpin Ford.

I took the car to Upland ford and they suggested I do a crank relearn - this unfortunately did not solve the issue. Drove the car mildly hard and all was fine. However, once under heavy load, 2nd gear WOT uphill, the check engine light flashed again.

I ordered a coil which is still on its way and ordered 8 spark plugs.

Upland ford thinks the next steps should be checking the wiring / inspecting coils.

I know others have commented that the scoring on my cylinders look mild / nothing of concern - not trying to be argumentative here. But just feeling conflicted from multiple other mechanics saying the scoring looks fairly deep and they thought it was cause for concern. Not a concern in the sense of that is what is causing the misfire / saying the engine will blow up tomorrow. But saying scoring will likely worsen and lead to engine failure.

Is this report from gallon or Upland? If the 2nd dealership confirms scoring I do not understand why you are not pursuing a warranty claim?

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[robvas]

Wouldn't be surprised if warranty says they won't cover it because it was caused by oil debris or something

Either way, the pictures he posted aren't to be concerned about. The crosshatching looks fine. compression is fine. It's not causing the misfire.

It'd be different if the walls had a big wide spot where the piston was rubbing, it had lower compression, blah blah blah

Tis but a scratch.

 

[sk47]

I know others have commented that the scoring on my cylinders look mild / nothing of concern - not trying to be argumentative here. But just feeling conflicted from multiple other mechanics saying the scoring looks fairly deep and they thought it was cause for concern. Not a concern in the sense of that is what is causing the misfire / saying the engine will blow up tomorrow. But saying scoring will likely worsen and lead to engine failure.

Hello; First- Scoring at any level is not good. Had you posted the images of the scoring before purchase I and likely many others would have advised you to not buy the car. But it is now your car, so the question becomes do you try to live with the scoring or spend big bucks to replace the engine.
Some key bits of information are not yet known by me. A main bit would be a compression test of all the cylinders. If you have presented such then I missed it. A compression test might give a clue about the severity of the scoring. Low compression in a scored cylinder can mean too much blowby air getting past the scratches.
NOTE- Low compression can be caused by other things such as a bad valve seat. Such is why another thread follower asked you for images of the valves & top of the pistons.
NOTE #2- Problem diagnosis is conflicting for all of us often. The sure way to know the seriousness of the scoring is to start tearing down the engine. That is difficult work if you cn do it yourself or very expensive if you hire it done.
SECOND - The scoring is a real problem. The scoring will likely get worse. Eventually could become bad enough to be a major problem. Yes, light scoring can be lived with. Maybe lived with for a very long time.
You may wind up carrying a few quarts of engine oil around all the time. Even now I suggest a routine of checking the oil level before every cold start. If possible park in the same spot and check the oil when the engine is cold.
I cannot tell from the pictures for sure about the scoring. As another mentioned a way to check is to see if the scoring catches a fingernail. You cannot get a finger to it without a tear down at least to head removal level.
My guess, a guess I do not have confidence in, is the scoring looks light. Why? because of the visible crosshatching.

THIRD - The scoring will allow some blowby. Especially at high RPM's and heavy engine loads.

Last- Not clear how far with non-tear down testing you are willing to go to. If the scoring is on your mind, I still suggest a compression test, a leak down test and getting images of the valves in the heads & images of the tops of the pistons. An oil analysis could prove valuable within the realm of considering an engine replacement

 

[sk47]

Hello; Three things have stood out, to me, over the course of the two threads. One being the cylinder images. Another being the stratified fuel image. Another being the drive with you and a mechanic. Specifically, that the mechanic appeared to say you are overrevving the engine.

My current WAG of which there is low confidence is the scoring is not causing the high RPM's missing.
I asked before about how much fresh fuel you have run thru the engine. To put another way have you removed the old fuel???

This last comment is not for the OP. I assume without knowing for sure that a factory Ford tune will have some sort of rev limiter built in. if so could it be that rev limiter is throwing an engine light & the random misfire code????
If my trusted mechanic told me something I would listen to him/her.

 

[robvas]

Hello; Three things have stood out, to me, over the course of the two threads. One being the cylinder images. Another being the stratified fuel image. Another being the drive with you and a mechanic. Specifically, that the mechanic appeared to say you are overrevving the engine.

This last comment is not for the OP. I assume without knowing for sure that a factory Ford tune will have some sort of rev limiter built in. if so could it be that rev limiter is throwing an engine light & the random misfire code????
If my trusted mechanic told me something I would listen to him/her.

On one hand, I believe that mechanic correctly diagnosed the bad coil. On the other hand I don't know why he would say the GT350 engine isn't meant to be revved high.

Also, you can sit and bang the car off the limiter for two minutes straight and the misfire light isn't going to come on.

 

[sk47]

On one hand, I believe that mechanic correctly diagnosed the bad coil. On the other hand I don't know why he would say the GT350 engine isn't meant to be revved high.

Also, you can sit and bang the car off the limiter for two minutes straight and the misfire light isn't going to come on.

Hello; In my younger days I ran engines to the redline often. As I got older and after some costly repairs, I tend to stay a bit below redline. Since I drive on public roads turns out staying a few RPMs below maximum does not make a difference.
I recall driving onto the interstate out of Frankfort KY back in 2000. My car at the time had a 7000 RPM red line. I ran it to the line most every weekend just because I liked the sound and the idea of doing such. Now I keep the engine my replacement car a couple hundred RPM below and still enjoy myself and might lose a half second.
I cannot answer your mechanic question. For sure a 350 owner can hammer the engine to the max. No argument from me on that. Since I am guessing it may be the mechanic was talking about the wisdom of pushing hard when the engine is throwing lights and misfire codes????

I appreciate the rev limiter answer. Such is what I expected. Thanks

 

[Inthehighdesert]

Interesting. You yourself state you don’t think the “scoring” is the issue, then take a shot at anybody that has one of these cars for not supporting the “scoring” is an issue. One of the biggest issue’s with stuff like this is having a hundred different opinions, or in this case much much higher. The hard reality is in todays world most techs at dealerships don’t know how to do proper diagnostic techniques or they simply don’t want to do them because its simply not in there interestest(pay side) to do so. Easier to print some bs on a ticket and send it. Unfortunately I think the op is stuck in that scenario. I’ll leave alone very very few techs, even Master Techs, have actually ever built or really been around or inside an actual assembly. It’s also a little funny people are going to go with ya scoring bad, needs engine, and yet the misfire(electrical), which is the start of all this hasn’t been remedied. So in reality they could replace the long block, and the op drives off and has the exact same code get spit out right after.

Sounds like you’re doing the right things. I don’t think the code is from the scoring, but I’d keep an eye on the scoring issue, can’t be great. I saw your other thread too, and on Reddit. I mean, I’d take it with a grain of salt it’s mostly 350 owners telling you it’s no worries. They will defend that motor to death, and turn a blind eye to the obvious, even with its well documented reliability issues.

 

[Mach 307]

Interesting. You yourself state you don’t think the “scoring” is the issue, then take a shot at anybody that has one of these cars for not supporting the “scoring” is an issue. One of the biggest issue’s with stuff like this is having a hundred different opinions, or in this case much much higher. The hard reality is in todays world most techs at dealerships don’t know how to do proper diagnostic techniques or they simply don’t want to do them do them because its simply not in there interestest(pay side) to do them. Easier to print some ba on a ticket and send it. Unfortunately I think the op is stuck in that scenario. I’ll leave alone very very few techs, even Master Techs, have actually ever built or really be around or inside an actual assembly.

Not what I said at all. I’m saying the scoring isn’t causing the current CEL, but it will likely eventually be an issue and the 350 owners telling you that it’s never going to be, I’d take with a grain of salt. I’m not trying to come at anybody, I just notice a trend. Which I get it, if I owned a certain car that had a reputation of unreliability, I’d probably defend it too at times.

 

[robvas]

Yes, and no?

 

[honeybadger]

did I miss whether or not a leak down test was performed?

compression test is way too quick and dirty to do anything other than tell you that you dont have a hole in the cylinder. If leak test is good and the oil doesn't have bearing material in it, there's no way I'd tear down the engine. I'd focus on electrical and fuel.

What do the spark plugs look like? a lot of blowby will have black plugs

 

[gilbenja]

did I miss whether or not a leak down test was performed?

compression test is way too quick and dirty to do anything other than tell you that you dont have a hole in the cylinder. If leak test is good and the oil doesn't have bearing material in it, there's no way I'd tear down the engine. I'd focus on electrical and fuel.

What do the spark plugs look like? a lot of blowby will have black plugs

Can't find a trusted mechanic near me to perform the leak down. Was supposed to go to upland ford today but they said I'd have to leave the car and I had no ride back. Trying to get a leak down test done this weekend. Seems like every shop I call is backed up and im tied up during the weekdays.

 

[gilbenja]

Can't find a trusted mechanic near me to perform the leak down. Was supposed to go to upland ford today but they said I'd have to leave the car and I had no ride back. Trying to get a leak down test done this weekend. Seems like every shop I call is backed up and im tied up during the weekdays.

from the looks of the diag report from the first dealer, they did not perform a leak down test. just the compression

 

[sk47]

Yes, and no?

Hello; I see such as well.
Is the HD7: power balance test a compression test?

 

[sk47]

from the looks of the diag report from the first dealer, they did not perform a leak down test. just the compression

Hello; I understand your frustration about finding a mechanic. The general thing I hear is such is common most places. Stories i read say Ford has good paying positions for trained "techs" but are having a hard time filling the positions. Shops are covered up and you will have to get in line.

A compression test and a leak down test are not hard to do yourself. The equipment is not too difficult to use. You have to pull the spark plugs and screw the test tool into the spark plug holes.

 

[Mike Pfeifer]

Hello; I understand your frustration about finding a mechanic. The general thing I hear is such is common most places. Stories i read say Ford has good paying positions for trained "techs" but are having a hard time filling the positions. Shops are covered up and you will have to get in line.

A compression test and a leak down test are not hard to do yourself. The equipment is not too difficult to use. You have to pull the spark plugs and screw the test tool into the spark plug holes.

I’d like to see some evidence that ford has good paying tech jobs. One that anyone on this forum would consider a good deal.

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