Do you regret choosing your power adder?

[Wolfys11]

Lol....not that anyone cares but my control-systems friend and I are trying to see how far a "simpler" fuel system can be pushed on E85 and high boost. As of now, the setup is a single DW400 pump at 22 volts and DW95 injectors running E85. It's a Whipple GenV 3.0 car currently on a 3.0" pulley (18 psi boost) and has some system overhead even in cooler temps. Trying to balance the port injector and fuel pump duty cycles now, which will result in more fuel available still. This setup relies on modification of the fuel pressure feedback control loop.

22 volts? Damn
I hear people crying about 16 or even 18, is 22 volts going to hold up reliably for a while in a dw400?

Sponsored

 

[Wolfys11]

According to Paul walker neither Centri or PD is the best. It's infact "NOS..two of the bigs ones" obviously is best.

I can only add dry humor when the topic becomes to complex for me.

I have a Centri and love it. I picked it in part because the install seemed more straight forward, and partly because low-end power was less.

Tons of power and grip down low always seemed to cost me lots of money in repairs "your differential center pin is fused inside, we needed to use the plasma cutter and four tips just to cut it out" *gasp*

Thats one of the main reasons i went with centri, running minimal suspension, rear end, and transmission mods to still be able to use high power without breaking everything or getting 1500whp rated parts everywhere

 

[robvas]

Thats one of the main reasons i went with centri, running minimal suspension, rear end, and transmission mods to still be able to use high power without breaking everything or getting 1500whp rated parts everywhere

You know you can still control a PD with your foot right?

 

[Wolfys11]

You know you can still control a PD with your foot right?

Because i want to be modulating in the 20-50% throttle input to drive my car everywhere always until 60mph?
I know i could do that, and to a degree it would be fun to “drive” the car like this, but im also not a fan of a car that if i tap the gas too much, il be in a wall. My current setup with stock all seasons allows me to spin barely here and there but ultimately i have a manual that i can blast through first gear controllably, and hardly spin second. Then once i get to e85 power levels, itl spin everywhere and il be doing throttle modulation with a centri, it will just be way easier than a whipple on e85 as it will be way less touchy

 

[robvas]

You've never driven a PD car if you think you can only give it 20-50% throttle before it opens a gate to hell

 

[Milktasd]

here is that video where ole dude was able to go boost by gear with a whipple.

 

[shogun32]

You've never driven a PD car if you think you can only give it 20-50% throttle before it opens a gate to hell

So only 10-30pct then before the portal opens?

I drove ZL1 6mt. And it was completely tame and comfy to drive around town. There just was more torque everywhere at any small throttle. I would hope a 3.0pd on coyote would be same.

 

[GL95]

I'm not proud of what I spent my money on! it's a bloody waste tbh, I've suggested a system that I didn't buy, purely on design and working principle.

If you want evidence of my intellectual competence, I'm an aircraft engineer, studded aeronautics and qualified as an engines airframe engineer. I studied combustion from external to gas turbines in the ministry of defence. As hobbies, I've raced Moto X and karts until 16 where I went in to mini stocks and classic thunder after. I've built my own engines since about 13.
I do my own work on all my cars/bikes including the Mustang so thick as mince really, I don't understand any mechanical principles especially reading data logs!

Once the weather turns better here, I will do a data log with VCM scanner, used it to remotely map the car when I fitted the charger. Not that I need to prove anything as the laws of physics are what they are.

And just to point out that superchargers were developed originally for Aircraft, mostly by the British, french and Germans. Then they got used for racing on Bentley blower's. A centrifugal supercharger was fitted to the merlin engine in the spitfire. Google it, you will see the rolls Royce merlin supercharger is an almost identical design to the vortech/ Paxton units. There's a very good reason the new Formula 1 cars have a centrifugal compressor electric turbo unit and not a twin screw/ roots style and it's not because they don't know what their doing.

Send McLaren your data log Engineermike, might be next year's winning car?

Why do Canadians call A&P mechanics engineers? Its very misleading and a false title

 

[engineermike]

22 volts? Damn
I hear people crying about 16 or even 18, is 22 volts going to hold up reliably for a while in a dw400?

According to FordMuscle, DW "approved" them to be run at 20 volts intermittent, and a FordNXT article showed where they ran one to 22 volts. We did bench testing at 22 volts for a minute at a time, give or take, and it lived while remaining cool. We did the same test on one OEM pump and fried it within seconds. FWIW the DW400 motor is much larger than OEM so it can likely handle more heat.

 

[engineermike]

here is that video where ole dude was able to go boost by gear with a whipple.

He's a member of the site and fellow collaborator.

 

[Zrussian13]

22 volts? Damn
I hear people crying about 16 or even 18, is 22 volts going to hold up reliably for a while in a dw400?

The dw400 is rated at 18v so it should be fine for the life of the pump and handle 22v for a decent amount of time. I've been running a vmp bap on my stock pump for 40k miles now because my variable jms crapped out and I've had no issues since switching.

 

[Wolfys11]

So only 10-30pct then before the portal opens?

I drove ZL1 6mt. And it was completely tame and comfy to drive around town. There just was more torque everywhere at any small throttle. I would hope a 3.0pd on coyote would be same.

Zl1 is stock tuned to be drivable, which most tuners tune for power, not a stock style drivability, as well as zl1 makes not a whole lot of power stock

 

[Zrussian13]

Thats one of the main reasons i went with centri, running minimal suspension, rear end, and transmission mods to still be able to use high power without breaking everything or getting 1500whp rated parts everywhere

Are you talking about at the track or on the street? I don't track my car but on the street with twins I can go balls out or modulate the pedal with no issues. I have bilstein shocks and irs braces on an otherwise stock pp1 suspension. Might be a different story on the strip but on the street I can floor it and spin or feather and modulate or floor it and hook in our lovely hot summers. Doesn't matter either way. Everything is holding up at 97k miles so far. That's at any boost level between 6-13lbs.

 

[Wolfys11]

Are you talking about at the track or on the street? I don't track my car but on the street with twins I can go balls out or modulate the pedal with no issues. I have bilstein shocks and irs braces on an otherwise stock pp1 suspension. Might be a different story on the strip but on the street I can floor it and spin or feather and modulate or floor it and hook in our lovely hot summers. Doesn't matter either way. Everything is holding up at 97k miles so far. That's at any boost level between 6-13lbs.

Street, as i dont have tracks in ny to go to
I also talk about in wintertime, as i drive year round in all weathers
Turbos are a little easier to modulate than pd, but ultimately i would LOVE a hellion twin top mount kit, but its double the price for the same boost/power levels id be on end game

 

[engineermike]

A tuner "can" set the throttle response up to be however you want. You can even give a PD blower the same boost curve as a centrif if you like. Just for fun, on the left is a stock 2020 GT500 and the right is a stock 2019 GT.

Identical up to 39% pedal. If you want the entire table except for 90% to be like a stock GT, you can. I just don't like the "switch" effect that has, which takes away your ability to pedal it at high torques. I prefer the engine to act like it has 700 cid when driving at part throttle, but that's just me.

Now, whether or not your tuner "will" set this up to your preference is a different story.

Sponsored