Magneride feels floaty

[Norm Peterson]

The reason for lowering tire pressures for the track is because you're going to be working them a whole lot harder and they will heat up more and gain more pressure. If you're fussier and a bit more experienced, you would target a particular hot pressure (or pressures), once you find out what that/those pressures might be that make the car work the best. And after the day is done and the tires have had a chance to completely cool down, what you measure then will be the correct starting pressures, at least for that and similar ambient temperatures.

It's common in everyday driving for tires to gain 2 or 3 psi, and it's a very safe bet that the OEMs have taken that into consideration for their (32 psi in this case) tire pressure recommendations. A track session can easily add 5 or more psi.

I've found that staggering tire pressures a bit can help overall behavior. On a 32 psi all-around OE recommendation, for a FE/RWD car with its OE 'square' tire and wheel setup, I'd run 3 or 4 psi more up front (cold) than out back, with the front tires 2 or 3 psi above the 32.


Everything I've read about MagneRide tells me that it's supposed to provide a very good ride in 'Normal'. I suppose it could feel too soft if you're expecting a firm-ish ride.


Norm

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[Gregs24]

Everything I've read about MagneRide tells me that it's supposed to provide a very good ride in 'Normal'. I suppose it could feel too soft if you're expecting a firm-ish ride.


Norm

Magneride is compliant, but never floaty as per OP. Norm is correct in that with standard damping you would have a very form ride with an equivalent level of control.

 

[Vlad Soare]

The Sport and Track suspension modes are supposed to make the ride harsher and to reduce body roll. Presumably more in Sport than in Normal, and more in Track than in Sport.
But do they really?
I drove around an empty roundabout at a highish speed in all modes, and the car was leaning outwards exactly the same every time. OK, maybe an electronic device measuring the precise angle of the body could have proved that it wasn't actually 'exactly' the same, but I certainly could not feel any difference.

I once drove a rally car which felt as if it had no suspension at all. In a corner you would feel the entire car rotate around you in a perfectly horizontal plane. It was an awesome sensation. I expected the Track mode to come close to that, but it doesn't really seem to.

So what exactly am I supposed to feel when switching MagneRide from Normal to Sport, then from Sport to Track? Possibly a harsher ride on less than perfect tarmac, but what else?

 

[WD Pro]

If my logic is correct, MR can’t control total body roll resulting from extended periods of sideways G, but it can control the time it takes to reach the maximum travel for any given force. It can’t increase spring rate and it can’t increase anti roll bar stiffness - it can only increase / decrease compression and rebound damping.

It’s ability to control comfort, body movement and roll during bumps and fast transitions is greatly increased compared to a fixed damper, but even the hardest damper will still allow compression, it just takes longer to become compressed.

I would be interested in other views on this subject - I’m interested to learn

WD

 

[Vlad Soare]

I see. So you may feel a difference when entering or leaving a corner sharply, but not necessarily during the corner itself. That makes sense.

It can’t increase spring rate and it can’t increase anti roll bar stiffness - it can only increase / decrease compression and rebound damping.

It can't increase spring rate, but what if it increased the concentration and position (and whatever else it can change) of the iron filings inside the shock to such an extent that the shock became stiffer than the spring? Spring rate would then become irrelevant, since the shock would be so stiff that it wouldn't allow the spring to compress regardless of how soft it may be.
But maybe I'm naïve and don't have a good understanding of how these active shocks work internally.

 

[WD Pro]

It will still make a difference mid corner as it is still controlling / altering the compression and rebound when compared to a normal fixed damper.

Whilst it may be possible to increase the fluid viscosity so it acts almost like a solid mass (can it do that ?), why would you want to do that ? It would be like having zero suspension movement, the car would then skip and bounce loosing contact and traction very easily etc.

Remember that the fluid in the damper is incompressible and it doesn’t respond like a spring, it offers a variable resistance to passing though the damper internals.

WD

 

[Vlad Soare]

It will still make a difference mid corner as it is still controlling / altering the compression and rebound when compared to a normal fixed damper.

Yes, if you run over bumps, but I was talking just about body roll due to high lateral G.

Whilst it may be possible to increase the fluid viscosity so it acts almost like a solid mass (can it do that ?), why would you want to do that ? It would be like having zero suspension movement, the car would then skip and bounce loosing contact and traction very easily etc.

Indeed, on a poor road. But on perfectly smooth tarmac I imagine it would be nice to go round a corner without any body roll, like a Formula 1 car.

 

[Gregs24]

Yes, if you run over bumps, but I was talking just about body roll due to high lateral G.


Indeed, on a poor road. But on perfectly smooth tarmac I imagine it would be nice to go round a corner without any body roll, like a Formula 1 car.

I'm not sure whether the Magneride dampers have any active anti roll feature in their control systems but that is not their primary function anyway (ARB does that) There are cars with interconnected dampers for anti roll such as McLaren use, which has no ARB's. You can have really stiff springs and dampers to stop roll but the penalty is horrible ride quality, hence why ARB's are used in most cars.

Zero roll is actually not desirable as it is very disconcerting. The Citroen Xantia Activa could be set to zero roll but was never used that way as drivers didn't like it. Even F1 cars have a roll moment, although the 1992 active ride Williams FW14b could be setup for this to be effectively zero by increasing the suspension ride height on one side to counteract tyre compression (remember F1 wheels are only 13" with relatively high sidewalls). It was never raced this way as Mansell and Patrese disliked the feeling.

 

[shogun32]

The Sport and Track suspension modes are supposed to make the ride harsher and to reduce body roll. Presumably more in Sport than in Normal, and more in Track than in Sport.
But do they really?
I drove around an empty roundabout at a highish speed in all modes, and the car was leaning outwards exactly the same every time. OK, maybe an electronic device measuring the precise angle of the body could have proved that it wasn't actually 'exactly' the same, but I certainly could not feel any difference.

Ford's MR programming is not particularly good for starters.

A car will tilt as far as needed for the spring to come to an equilibrium with the added weight. All the damper does is alter the rate of change. Ie in a 180deg bend of sufficient length the car will eventually get to the balance point even if you've got the viscosity turned way up.

'harshness' is just crap-tastic programming by the damping team. What should happen between luxury and track modes is the baseline slow-speed compression should get stiffer (viscosity, aka voltage goes up) but high-speed comp should change only modestly- square edged bumps that previously disappear should now register a modest thump (aka slight delay in dropping the voltage/viscosity vs tour mode). Rebound for track will also be modestly higher. The MR viscosity cycle time should be sufficiently responsive to get very, very good results but piston design comes into play as well.

 

[Arknsawchuck]

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This may just be me feeling paranoid but i feel like my suspension in my GT feels very loose when driving my car...it DOES have magneride which ive never had before so maybe having it in normal mode makes it feel very floaty especially in the back. the only thing i can compare it to is if your driving an old classic car when you hit a bump and your whole ass end feels like its swaying around. could there be something wrong with the suspension or is this just how magneride works in normal mode? feel a little concerned for when im at really high speeds and the floatingness feels even worse. please let me know what you guys think!

[/QUOTE
I know what you mean, although floaty might not be the best word. Maybe softer and less planted. I have a PP2 with magnaride and I spend 90% of my time in sport. I only use normal when doing interstate travel or long easy going rides. I dont really care for how normal feels. I just don't feel connected to the car like I do in sport or track. Although I find track just a little to stiff for daily stuff. Its taken a while for me to get used to magnaride, like you I came from old muscle cars where you felt everything.

 

[TeeLew]

I'm busy at the moment, but I have some to add here. A 'floaty' feeling was not my feeling, even with stock springs & Magneride. I felt like street/highway driving was particularly nice.

 

[Hack]

Ok guys sorry for not messaging back to all of you, i didnt get any notifications...to answer everyones questions:

im going to inflate the tires to 32 psi.

i had a 2018 non pp/mr car but since then i bought a 2020 pp/mr car

i checked the suspension, no shipping blocks and i believe the picture that you guys are seeing makes the car look taller it sits lower in my garage.

I never have had the car in sport+ until yesterday and i will say the whole attitude of the car changed alot the steering stiffens up quite a bit, bumpier ride, and my feel if floating is damn near non existant.

i have dug deep in other threads and peope say that in normal mode it feels like a non pp/mr car so maybe thats what im feeling

i will say that in normal mode i barely feel any bumps at all so i believe its doing its job

hopefully i answered all of the questions and please shoot me anymore advice or feedback if theres anything else that jumps out at you i want to make sure this car is performing perfectly lol thanks for all the help!

It makes sense to me that a magneride PP1 Mustang would feel a little floaty in normal mode, but I'm surprised it's more floaty than a non-PP car. I doubt anything is wrong with your brand new car, though. If something were wrong you would hear a clunking sound associated with a loose suspension component.

Hopefully between the different modes you can get the suspension to do what you want.

One other thing to consider is to me certain tires feel floaty/squishy and they allow the car to move around too much (or at least more than I personally prefer). Every year when I switch from my summer performance tires to the winter snow tires it's annoying getting used to that feeling again. Also if you are still using the summer tires in cool weather they won't grip as well.

I wouldn't recommend you use track mode on the street, especially in cool weather. I'm cautious using track mode even on track.

 

[BlueHPP]

I have the Ecoboost HPP/HP car with magneride. Normal should feel slightly soft. A quick check to see if the magneride is working is to find a bumpy road. Drive over it in normal, then sport then track at the same speed. I know in my car there is a noticeable difference in each mode.

 

[RichBrew]

Can't take the credit for that. All I know about Mustangs I know from these forums. I waited nine months for the car to arrive, during which there was nothing for me to do than read about it.

What drive mode? Any mods? My rear suspension seemed off, till I added Steeda stop the hop starter. I also switched to Pedders lowering springs, and ran in sport+ almost exclusively for 2 years. Recently, I decided to try normal on the Hwy for MPG, and by comparison to Sport+ it feels floaty, but super comfy. Keep in mind that these things are built for the lowest common denominator, and most folks who don’t really understand sports cars, even though they want one for looks or whatever, still want cushy suspension. If the stock springs are a little floaty, get some steeda or pedders springs, or if you want it really planted, the stiffest springs for MR are the FP springs. If you get them in the track pack with sway bar, they also have a new MR calibration.

 

[Fly2High]

What drive mode? Any mods? My rear suspension seemed off, till I added Steeda stop the hop starter. I also switched to Pedders lowering springs, and ran in sport+ almost exclusively for 2 years. Recently, I decided to try normal on the Hwy for MPG, and by comparison to Sport+ it feels floaty, but super comfy. Keep in mind that these things are built for the lowest common denominator, and most folks who don’t really understand sports cars, even though they want one for looks or whatever, still want cushy suspension. If the stock springs are a little floaty, get some steeda or pedders springs, or if you want it really planted, the stiffest springs for MR are the FP springs. If you get them in the track pack with sway bar, they also have a new MR calibration.

I wonder if what you felt about the PP1 ride, the engineers at Ford also felt which is why the used their own time to come up with the PP2. Not only did they include the Magnaride but added stiffer springs, stiffer sway bars, different tire offset and wider wheels/tires and different calibrations on the Magnaride, braking, ABS, traction control and more downforce.

I wonder if, when they came up with the new setup, should they have done what they did and offered it as a new package or should it have replaced the PP1. Maybe they should have offered two wheel tire packages but maybe most of the tuning and suspension bits should have found its way into the PP1, even if they had to charge a bit more for it. It might have removed the need to improve your PP1 (and others who have) for a better setup altogether.

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