Fix front end "floaty" feeling?

[MEAN427]

I've read thru this thread and am going to throw this out there. I ordered a 2016 PP that came with 19" staggered wheels with 255 F and 275 R tires. Car drove and felt great driving on our crappy roads in Central Ca. About 2 months later I updated to MMR M350 19X10 wheels all around with 275 tires. No other changes at that time. The car was a bit scary at first to drive. It felt floaty and would 'wander' around. After some research, I came to find out all this was all due to the wider front tires. Wider front tires tend to cause trammeling (following the minute contours in the road surface, steering the car left and right), I wonder if what you are feeling as " floaty/loose feel " might be trammeling... Since the wheels, I also installed the 4 pt bmr lower front brace and a set of coilovers to lower the car a bit, also has all the factory PP braces and the car still trammels. It is something you get used to...

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[Nagare]

trammeling (following the minute contours in the road surface, steering the car left and right)

not the meaning of that word at all. What you're looking for is tramlining which could be a result of the wider wheels, but also the quality of the tire.

 

[MEAN427]

Opps, didn't spell it correctly, thank you for correcting , but "tramlining" could be what the op is feeling. Tirerack defines it as " when directional control is disrupted by the vehicle's tendency to follow the longitudinal ruts and/or grooves in the road. ... " This can be described as a floaty feeling.

 

[Norm Peterson]

Unless OP has changed wheels and tires, I wouldn't expect tramlining to be an issue with a base-suspension car (OP did say it was an A6 car, so it wouldn't have come off the production line with even Perf Pack (1) wheels & tires.

I suppose the lowering could be partly at fault for bumpsteer reasons, though with only a 1" drop I wouldn't expect bumpsteer to be a problem. Failure to get a good alignment afterward, maybe.


Norm

 

[Norm Peterson]

Unless OP has changed wheels and tires, I wouldn't expect tramlining to be an issue with a base-suspension car (OP did say it was an A6 car, so it wouldn't have come off the production line with even Perf Pack (1) wheels & tires.

I suppose the lowering could be partly at fault for bumpsteer reasons, though with only a 1" drop I wouldn't expect bumpsteer to be a problem. Failure to get a good alignment afterward, maybe.


Norm

 

[HoustonGT]

Unless OP has changed wheels and tires, I wouldn't expect tramlining to be an issue with a base-suspension car (OP did say it was an A6 car, so it wouldn't have come off the production line with even Perf Pack (1) wheels & tires.

I suppose the lowering could be partly at fault for bumpsteer reasons, though with only a 1" drop I wouldn't expect bumpsteer to be a problem. Failure to get a good alignment afterward, maybe.


Norm

I have 20 TSW bathurst wheels and am running 275/35r20 and 305/30r20. A guy that does lots 9f lowered mustangs did my alignment.

 

[i4gains]

Hey, my 2015 A6 premium GT has a floaty/loose feel on the front end when steering. Already lowered 1", using steeda proaction shocks/struts and have the rear end buttoned up already (BMR lockout, vert links, subframe alignment kit).

What's the best fix for a "tighter" feel for front end?

I recently had this feeling. Im lowered on coils alignment obviously done. Recently i got new rear tires and the difference in tread from front to rear made my car feel that exact way. i have new front tires, same brand and size

 

[HoustonGT]

Why did you go with the 2 point brace versus the 4 point brace? I'll probably start with a brace and see if i need more mods after feelung what it does for steering.

 

[HoustonGT]

Here's an $80 part that will help: https://www.steeda.com/steeda-s550-ultralite-2-point-g-trac-brace-555-5533.html. This single item "woke up" the steering feel in my Mustang and destroyed the numbness that can be perceived as floaty-ness. A four-point brace is also available.

I am, however, still surprised you're still experiencing a floaty feel at all with the modifications you have (strut tower or not) along with the excellent tires in a blazing climate. Do you feel the floaty feeling at all speeds? Either way, I would look into the following (from free to expensive):

- Double-check your steering shaft torx screws are torqued to spec (22n/m I believe)
- Look at your alignment sheet and see if your front toe settings are off
- Try flipping through the steering feel options to see if a particular setting helps
- Ensure your bumpstops are trimmed or the correct stack was installed
- Call-up Steeda and look into the roll-center and bumpsteer kit as Bmac mentioned
- Install a front splitter (if the floaty-ness is felt at highway speeds)
- Consider lighter wheels / front brake rotors

- Mike

Curious as to why you went with the 2 point versus 4 point brace?

 

[Roadway 5.0]

Curious as to why you went with the 2 point versus 4 point brace?

I like the simplicity and the stoutness of the 2-point; that and the price tag is unbeatable.

 

[Norm Peterson]

I have 20 TSW bathurst wheels and am running 275/25r20 and 305/30r20. A guy that does lots 9f lowered mustangs did my alignment.

275/25-20 is way too small of a tire for either end of a S550 but especially for the front (they're Nitto Invos, right?) . . . undersized by something like 9 Load Index numbers. If you're running 32 psi in them like I suspect is the number on your door sticker, it's a little like running OE tires at about 12 psi underinflated (i.e. down around 20 psi). But you can't buy all that back with higher inflation pressure - XL tires aren't load-rated past 42 psi and you'd need 44 or so. As a side note, I really hope your TSW wheels aren't only 8.5" or 9" wide.

If I've guessed right with Invos, it probably means something when a tire mfr lists "luxury" ahead of "sport" in their description of a tire model's mission.


Norm

 

[HoustonGT]

275/25-20 is way too small of a tire for either end of a S550 but especially for the front (they're Nitto Invos, right?) . . . undersized by something like 9 Load Index numbers. If you're running 32 psi in them like I suspect is the number on your door sticker, it's a little like running OE tires at about 12 psi underinflated (i.e. down around 20 psi). But you can't buy all that back with higher inflation pressure - XL tires aren't load-rated past 42 psi and you'd need 44 or so. As a side note, I really hope your TSW wheels aren't only 8.5" or 9" wide.

If I've guessed right with Invos, it probably means something when a tire mfr lists "luxury" ahead of "sport" in their description of a tire model's mission.


Norm

Norm- sorry, my bad. The 25 is a typo, they are 275/35r20 conti ECS with 1,000 miles. Had same issue with G2's i just replaced. The wheels are 9.5" up front and 10.5" in rear.

 

[TheLion]

I've read thru this thread and am going to throw this out there. I ordered a 2016 PP that came with 19" staggered wheels with 255 F and 275 R tires. Car drove and felt great driving on our crappy roads in Central Ca. About 2 months later I updated to MMR M350 19X10 wheels all around with 275 tires. No other changes at that time. The car was a bit scary at first to drive. It felt floaty and would 'wander' around. After some research, I came to find out all this was all due to the wider front tires. Wider front tires tend to cause trammeling (following the minute contours in the road surface, steering the car left and right), I wonder if what you are feeling as " floaty/loose feel " might be trammeling... Since the wheels, I also installed the 4 pt bmr lower front brace and a set of coilovers to lower the car a bit, also has all the factory PP braces and the car still trammels. It is something you get used to...

It's not the width increase of the front tires per say that causes tramlining. It's the increase in scrub radius that causes increased sensitivity. There's a plus and minus to that. The upside is that for track or smooth roads, you have better feedback as to what the car is doing. The down side is that on rough, particularly grooved roads, it can cause the car to pull left or right until the tire settles in the groove.

I get no substantial tram-lining with stock PP wheels, however the car definitively has better feedback and stability with my RTR Tech 7's which have an aggressive +33mm offset (stock front's are +45, so about 1 cm less, stock rears have +52). Offset has to be increased in the front to fit wider wheels to avoid clearance issues with the struts. So it's give and take. I believe factory PP wheels are set up to have nearly 0 scrub radius to give the car a neutral balance. Negative scrub makes the car numb and I think VW or BMR did that on one model generation and never did it again due to all the negative reviews on handling numbness.

Running positive scrub will increase tram-lining on any car. That's one of the things that the Focus RS is known for in factory form as being overly sensitive to tram-lining (that and it's fairly rough ride). Same thing with the Camaro SS 1LE track package. They provide more feedback for track applications but tram-line on typical roadways which your average joe isn't willing to tollerate, especially if they don't do spirited driving or track their cars.

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