Aluminator Failure

schmeky

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Tick . . . Tick . . . Tick . . . BOOM!





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stang17

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All I can say is damn…
Hope everything ends up working for you. I’m curious as to why play “Russian Roulette” with a concoctions such as boostane & pump gas. It’s probable that you could have mixed it wrong, but I hope not.

Do you still have your original motor? This could’ve been backup/spare
I can assure you that I had no intentions of playing Russian Roulette lol. After snapping the crank and destroying the entire stock motor while still owing a considerable amount of money on the car(my one and only car), I wanted to build and tune the car to be stronger than stock, thus why I invested in an aluminator and MFP crank support.

Prior to using PBD, I had always ran octane booster as a safe guard against the possibility of getting a tank of bad gas, not primarily for any increased power output.

Before I even loaded the very first PBD tune I had emailed PBD my data logs from the pulls I made while on the whipple tune where I was seeing upwards of 19.5 timing without any significant knock and guardian wanting to add 1-2 more timing.

I had specifically asked for a safe 93 octane tune to use year round and asked if they can offer something that would still be be reliable at the track when using 96 octane. Rob even hooked me up with several different versions of the 96 tune that had alternate levels of power for 1st gear to help me with my 60 ft since I no longer had the flight control settings of whipple tune.

I always made sure to keep the boostane stored properly and to make sure none of the bottles were expired.

Ok maybe I was given too much timing, but the car wasn't showing any knock after the 1st series of revisions. Im assuming that's why they felt comfortable giving me as much timing as they did. I wouldn't think they would ever turn off the knock sensors and I'm sure they didn't. I belive the just desensitized them slightly by 10%, but maybe that was just enough.

Its certainly possible the head gasket failed at the power level I was at and which overtime landed itself to the problems with the rings, etc.

I have my nguage set to monitor knock with the warning lights. So how else was I supposed to know something going wrong if I wasn't seeing any knock.

Regardless, just wanted to post up here as I have been transparent with my car build and experience since day 1. I'm hoping my experience with running octane booster and the amount of timing I was serves as a warning for the next guy.

This forum is a source for info and data; not a place to bitch or drag someone's name through the dirt.

I still plan on working with PBD as they have always been quick to respond to any questions I had and would reccomend them to anyone looking for a custom tune ( maybe not octane booster though)

I'm just looking forward and concentrating on the positives. The engine is salvageable and hopefully won't cost me more than 2-3 grand to be built even stronger with ARP studs and cometic gaskets, by a very well established builder, Holbrook Racing engines.

My wife hasn't murdered me or filed for divorce.
 

LSchicago

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I can assure you that I had no intentions of playing Russian Roulette lol. After snapping the crank and destroying the entire stock motor while still owing a considerable amount of money on the car(my one and only car), I wanted to build and tune the car to be stronger than stock, thus why I invested in an aluminator and MFP crank support.

Prior to using PBD, I had always ran octane booster as a safe guard against the possibility of getting a tank of bad gas, not primarily for any increased power output.

Before I even loaded the very first PBD tune I had emailed PBD my data logs from the pulls I made while on the whipple tune where I was seeing upwards of 19.5 timing without any significant knock and guardian wanting to add 1-2 more timing.

I had specifically asked for a safe 93 octane tune to use year round and asked if they can offer something that would still be be reliable at the track when using 96 octane. Rob even hooked me up with several different versions of the 96 tune that had alternate levels of power for 1st gear to help me with my 60 ft since I no longer had the flight control settings of whipple tune.

I always made sure to keep the boostane stored properly and to make sure none of the bottles were expired.

Ok maybe I was given too much timing, but the car wasn't showing any knock after the 1st series of revisions. Im assuming that's why they felt comfortable giving me as much timing as they did. I wouldn't think they would ever turn off the knock sensors and I'm sure they didn't. I belive the just desensitized them slightly by 10%, but maybe that was just enough.

Its certainly possible the head gasket failed at the power level I was at and which overtime landed itself to the problems with the rings, etc.

I have my nguage set to monitor knock with the warning lights. So how else was I supposed to know something going wrong if I wasn't seeing any knock.

Regardless, just wanted to post up here as I have been transparent with my car build and experience since day 1. I'm hoping my experience with running octane booster and the amount of timing I was serves as a warning for the next guy.

This forum is a source for info and data; not a place to bitch or drag someone's name through the dirt.

I still plan on working with PBD as they have always been quick to respond to any questions I had and would reccomend them to anyone looking for a custom tune ( maybe not octane booster though)

I'm just looking forward and concentrating on the positives. The engine is salvageable and hopefully won't cost me more than 2-3 grand to be built even stronger with ARP studs and cometic gaskets, by a very well established builder, Holbrook Racing engines.

My wife hasn't murdered me or filed for divorce.
It can be argued, but there really isn't a safe 800RWHP 93 tune. 800RWHP on E85? Yes. On 93 I wouldn't want to push a 93 tune over 750RW, and that is more than my comfort level. I'm still questioning my desire to go to 850RW on E85 with a full fuel system reliably. I may just leave mine at the 800RW E85 level.
 

K4fxd

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My only suggestion is to get an actual in person dyno tune.

If you still want to use PBD that is fine, just make sure they tune it on their dyno or do a live remote.

Personally I wouldn't use them or Lund.
 

WildHorse

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Your never ending bashing of tuners is pretty sickening.
So PALM BEACH DYNO gives him a 21.5 degrees on 96 octane and I'm supposed to do what ? Suck his junk in joy ? Rob AKA Mr PBD shoulda known better or said to the OP want more ? Run 100 octane minimum, and I'll give you a tune for it. What he (Rob) did was so beyond asinine it's 'sickening'.
 
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Cory S

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I can’t imagine any tuner would shut off the knock sensors without the owners permission.
He’s done it before. MANY times. He was known for it back in the early days, and some habits are hard to break.
 

huntiez

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my tuner wont let me run more then 21 degrees in timing and im on e85 80 percent even installed a gm e85 sensor to track e content but im at 17psi on a pc fully built motor i took out my stock motor but yeah stock headbolts and thats much timing on pump is no way man lund tuned my first motor and it wasnt their fault just in cali so 91 with boostane wasnt enough to stock the
motor from going
 

bluebeastsrt

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He’s done it before. MANY times. He was known for it back in the early days, and some habits are hard to break.
That’s a lawsuit waiting to happen. The way this usually plays out is. You run a log and email it back. They say you got knock. You say ok I’ll take care of it. After you crawl around the car or spend a ton of money on things you think will fix the knock problem. You send another log. They say you still got knock! And at some point everyone comes to the conclusion that it’s false. At that point they say……would you like me to dial the knock sensors way back or shut them off completely? But Your not going to make me believe they shut them off without the owners knowledge. And I promise they keep all email correspondence to cover their asses.
 

bluebeastsrt

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You guys on here are a trip. You all want to make stupid horse power. (On stupid set ups) And then wanna blame the tuners when your shit blows. Spend the coin up front. Buy a proper return fuel system. (Don't think 1 pump & a BAP is proper for 800whp!) Run the proper fuel! (E85 or race fuel) And if you have a knock issue. Think long and hard before you tell the tuner to turn em off! I’m not trying to kick the OP when he’s down but go back and read some old posts. He’s asked about fuel or fuel systems etc.
 
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WildHorse

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Well then, lets see if the OP said he ASKED PBD to turn off the KS, or give him 21.5 degrees on 96 octane. I'll be the first to admit I'm wrong if that's the case. I'm sure this whole thread got back to ROB already.
 

BlackandBlue

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This has devolved into a garbage thread. We will never know what went down. We can speculate all day but all we really know is knock happened and OP lost his engine. Could have been 10 different things. Horsepower is expensive and unfortunately OP has learned that the hard way.

OP already said leave it alone. Best of luck with the rebuild.
 
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stang17

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I never once asked to have knock sensors desensitized or was asked permission to have them desensitized.
 

bluebeastsrt

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I never once asked to have knock sensors desensitized or was asked permission to have them desensitized.
But your willing to go back and use the same tuning company in the future?Come-on!
 

jweggy

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But the consensus is I was given too much timing for 96 octane and that the knock sensors were desensitized to the point where the cpu wasn't detecting actual knock or pulling timing and thus why motor started to take a shit after only a few thousand miles.

I still plan on working with PBD in the future once my engine is repaired, just disappointed how things panned out.

I bought the car new from the dealer which they gave me a 3yr warranty. I snap the crank literally 8 days after my 3 years were up. Fair play, but got held holding the bag of what to do as I still owed money on the car. FWIW I paid $54k for 2017 fully loaded PP car with all options less adaptive cruise and recaros(i wanted cooled seats), the whipple, magnaflow comp cat back, lowering springs, and steeda stop the hop kit all wrapped into the financing.

Work had been offering overtime for the past 3 years non stop and I was making decent extra money, so I splurged for the aluminator, and remainder of parts in my signature.

Then COVID happens and all overtime was taken away, which limited how much I can chip away at my balance.

Now this happens and it just sucks. Im hoping that Holbrook can get me back together for a reasonable price as I'm about to beat my credit card into submission lol.

It is what it is.

I appreciate everyone's input.

Sorry this is happening. I hope things turn around for you !
 

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