Single top mount turbo - Supporting mods

[Timbuck]

Nope. No debate from me , I never said a single will spool faster , but in some cases will get very close with a simpler , and in most cases cheaper set up.
I do believe a property set up single could end up with a boost/CFM curve that would lay between a PD and a centry.
and besides that , I love the sound of a single even at part throttle.

i 3d printed a full size , pulsar G42-1200 to see where/how it would fit. Perfect for 750/800hp set up Also pulsar 77/82 would work very well on a coyote allowing for a bit more exhaust flow to keep valve float at bay.

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[NGOT8R]

I was considering going the CX racing route. But I don't know enough about turbos to completely plan out the whole kit. Hellion keeps calling my attention. Was really set on ESS, but for the price of a G3X with G4 IC your already on the toes of Hellion prices. Big single is a good way to go. I just don't want to mess with a/c lines or wire tucking.

How much power are you looking to make?

I agree that all of the kits, whether SC or turbos are very expensive. I hate the idea of a wire tuck too, but rest assured, I will do whatever is required to facilitate the install. I do hope I can get by without having to do anything to the AC lines though.

 

[Wolfys11]

Nope. No debate from me , I never said a single will spool faster , but in some cases will get very close with a simpler , and in most cases cheaper set up.
I do believe a property set up single could end up with a boost/CFM curve that would lay between a PD and a centry.
and besides that , I love the sound of a single even at part throttle.

i 3d printed a full size , pulsar G42-1200 to see where/how it would fit. Perfect for 750/800hp set up Also pulsar 77/82 would work very well on a coyote allowing for a bit more exhaust flow to keep valve float at bay.

I will agree here, well suited single turbo to the motor will get fairly close to a twin turbo setup in terms of lag

 

[shogun32]

given the 10speed coolers and such, why wouldn't half of a Hellion bottom-mount work? Why does one need to reach for 14+ PSI when 8 is more than plenty? Tires going up in smoke is not accelerating nor fast. Is there a major problem driving the turbo just off the one bank instead of trying to pipe both?

 

[WildHorse]

Go twin turbo. A single pipe from the turbo back under the engine to connect to the catback.. have fun with that. You could buy the exhaust kit, but BL exhaust is $3k.

Also, everything I've seen BL is an absolute koont to install.

Honestly for me there would be no debate. Twins.

 

[robvas]

given the 10speed coolers and such, why wouldn't half of a Hellion bottom-mount work? Why does one need to reach for 14+ PSI when 8 is more than plenty? Tires going up in smoke is not accelerating nor fast. Is there a major problem driving the turbo just off the one bank instead of trying to pipe both?

I would imagine the cylinders would not fill equally in that setup

 

[Cordero1]

How much power are you looking to make?

I agree that all of the kits, whether SC or turbos are very expensive. I hate the idea of a wire tuck too, but rest assured, I will do whatever is required to facilitate the install. I do hope I can get by without having to do anything to the AC lines though.

I'll be shooting for 700s on pump e85. If I had a better Ford dealer near me I wouldn't have issue with the a/c line. But having to deal with them is such a pain low mount is the way to go for me.

 

[Wolfys11]

given the 10speed coolers and such, why wouldn't half of a Hellion bottom-mount work? Why does one need to reach for 14+ PSI when 8 is more than plenty? Tires going up in smoke is not accelerating nor fast. Is there a major problem driving the turbo just off the one bank instead of trying to pipe both?

Unless were talking about a kit im unknown to, i think all the major brand single turbos run all 8 to one and then to turbo

running half cylinders to boost is absolutely a terrible idea, ruins balance hugely and puts only half the motors cylinders to higher back pressure, and the other 4 to much higher flow, motor wont last long under such conditions

 

[Angrey]

If you're bent on big single, why not just go with a centri? Either kit will get you to where you're trying to go and the centri is light years simpler and markedly cheaper. No backpressure issues to consider, no oiling or location issues to worry about. Much smoother power delivery. Did I mention price? You can even over spin it and blow off the top end so you can increase low end torque if you like. Seems for your power goals and your concerns that centri would be a better fit.

 

[NGOT8R]

If you're bent on big single, why not just go with a centri? Either kit will get you to where you're trying to go and the centri is light years simpler and markedly cheaper. No backpressure issues to consider, no oiling or location issues to worry about. Much smoother power delivery. Did I mention price? You can even over spin it and blow off the top end so you can increase low end torque if you like. Seems for your power goals and your concerns that centri would be a better fit.

I’ve actually already committed to going with the single turbo. One really big thing that drew me toward the single was eliminating the full exhaust system and replacing it with the bumper exhaust exit.

I won’t argue that the pricing is higher for a turbo car than the centri, however, purchasing everything in stages is a lot easier for me to manage instead of one large purchase up front. It also gives me plenty of time to do more research and learn more about turbos.

 

[robvas]

Turbo = more power and a much better curve

 

[engineermike]

Just a few random thoughts…

For pump gas coyotes, I love turbos. You gain 50-150 hp right off the top due to the better overall energy management. When [true] pump gas sc systems top out around 750, the turbos can hit 850 at the same boost level. Furthermore, with superchargers and pump gas MBT is somewhere in the 21-23 deg range. With turbos it’s a bit lower, like 19 or lower. I believe this is due to the additional exhaust heat at low timing leading to less drive pressure required. So if you’re limited to 16 deg you’re much closer to mbt with a turbo setup.

That said, I work behind the scenes with a shop that had a car with a common 2.65 (not Roush). They wanted more so converted to hellion using their smallest turbos. The car picked up 100-150 at the same boost level. But, it seemed to hit a wall that we believe to be caused by exhaust valve float. The car wouldn’t build boost on the line and then hit the tires too hard so the track times weren’t awesome. They eventually swapped back to a supercharger (Whipple 3.8), made the same power as the turbos, but got better response.

Tuning is also something to keep in mind. The coyote PCM was never intended to operate an engine with variable “throttle inlet pressure” nor exhaust pressure. These things can more or less be masked in the tune but if you look at an ecoboost it accounts for both. What would be cool is to implement an ecoboost strategy on a turbo gen3 coyote but that’s a bit of a science project.

 

[80FoxCoupe]

Thanks for the reply Jake.

My power goals are as follows:

- 850 whp on 93 fuel
- 900-950 (if it can be done safely on E85)
- 750 whp with boost, plus a 75 hp shot of nitrous on E85, since I already have nitrous on the car and don’t want to remove it.

I prefer a single turbo because it has less components and will also provide more room for tweaks, if plumbing has to be altered to fit around other components installed on the car such as my external transmission fluid pump. A twin bottom mount setup would likely interfere with supply and return lines attached to the tranny.

Don't be a glutton for punishment. Just get a blower. Any blower.

 

[Wolfys11]

Just a few random thoughts…

For pump gas coyotes, I love turbos. You gain 50-150 hp right off the top due to the better overall energy management. When [true] pump gas sc systems top out around 750, the turbos can hit 850 at the same boost level. Furthermore, with superchargers and pump gas MBT is somewhere in the 21-23 deg range. With turbos it’s a bit lower, like 19 or lower. I believe this is due to the additional exhaust heat at low timing leading to less drive pressure required. So if you’re limited to 16 deg you’re much closer to mbt with a turbo setup.

That said, I work behind the scenes with a shop that had a car with a common 2.65 (not Roush). They wanted more so converted to hellion using their smallest turbos. The car picked up 100-150 at the same boost level. But, it seemed to hit a wall that we believe to be caused by exhaust valve float. The car wouldn’t build boost on the line and then hit the tires too hard so the track times weren’t awesome. They eventually swapped back to a supercharger (Whipple 3.8), made the same power as the turbos, but got better response.

Tuning is also something to keep in mind. The coyote PCM was never intended to operate an engine with variable “throttle inlet pressure” nor exhaust pressure. These things can more or less be masked in the tune but if you look at an ecoboost it accounts for both. What would be cool is to implement an ecoboost strategy on a turbo gen3 coyote but that’s a bit of a science project.

Very interesting

A bit off topic, but for pd setups, is the whipple generally treated as “the best”? I know roush is the worst, ive never seen anyone clarify if a vmp odin, or otherwise is better or worse

 

[NGOT8R]

Don't be a glutton for punishment. Just get a blower. Any blower.

It’s too late to turn back now! I’ve already reached V1-Rotate and pulled back on the controls to get the project airborne, lol. I just received the hot side piping today. The welds are phenomenal. Here are a few pics that I took of the piping during inspection.

Cold side piping.

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