Sponsored

Factory theft resistance?

ZeroTX

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2021
Threads
20
Messages
496
Reaction score
531
Location
Texas
First Name
ZERO
Vehicle(s)
2022 Mustang GT
How resistant are these cars to theft attempts? Please hold off on the "if anyone really wants your car they can find a way" posts. Thanks. I hear you. Move along. That is not the topic of this post. We know that. Thanks Einstein.

Now, someone who actually knows how the theft prevention in these cars works and its effectiveness, please speak up and let us know! One thing I am glad about is that I park my car in the garage at night, because I do know that one theft method is to essentially boost the key fob signal (the fob located inside your house) and instantly start the vehicle. I've seen it done w/ Ford Super Duty trucks w/ push-button start.

So let's leave that one out of the equation. If I park the car outside, within signal range, I'll put the key fob into a metal safe, so that method won't work. So again, not concerned w/ that method of theft. What about others? Assume they have no key fob and no way to "boost" your key fob's signal from a distance. How easy can they be started?

Another method seen in Europe is they plug a 'device' into the OBD2 port which essentially reprograms the car's security and then starts the engine. This takes about 2-3 minutes from what I've read. I believe that this method has been used a lot more in the U.S. than we are actually aware of. On my F150, I have a metal lock over the OBD2 port to slow down any thief trying to use this method to start it. Wonder if this method works on the Mustang? Maybe I need to order a locking plate for it as well... ?

Thanks for any helpful information. Again, please no 'if they really want it they can find a way...' posts. We know. Thank you kind genius, sir. Let's move on to the actual topic.
Sponsored

 
Last edited:
OP
OP
ZeroTX

ZeroTX

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2021
Threads
20
Messages
496
Reaction score
531
Location
Texas
First Name
ZERO
Vehicle(s)
2022 Mustang GT

Cobra Jet

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2015
Threads
705
Messages
16,235
Reaction score
17,947
Location
NJ
Vehicle(s)
2018 EB Prem. w/PP and 94 Mustang Cobra
Put a kill switch inline with the battery - turn off, car isn't going to start.

Put a kill switch at fuel pump harness, turn off, car isn't going to start.

I mean I could go on and on - it's not rocket science to figure out how to think outside of a larger box than any thief on the planet.

If the car is outside where it's accessible - driveway, street or parking lot, use of a drop and grab wrecker is most common - they're literally gone within minutes of making the hook up. Plus, you tell me how many people (anywhere) are going to interrupt a tow job... not many.

Just because many vehicles today rely on new technology, old school switch interrupters still work on ANY vehicle.
 

Sponsored

moby4dick

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 21, 2021
Threads
16
Messages
177
Reaction score
128
Location
New York
First Name
Michael
Vehicle(s)
2018 GT350R
I used to have a 1992 covertable 5.0 and to run the car you had to have the cigarette lighter depressed. The normal 12V lead was removed and the wires to the fuel pump were through the lighter. Just put the lighter in your pocket and the car was going nowhere.
So you had push to start back in 1992? Cool…
 

KingKona

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2022
Threads
12
Messages
2,907
Reaction score
2,827
Location
Virginia
First Name
Shlomo
Vehicle(s)
2019 GT
Well.....if someone wants it, they're going to get it.

The point to that is.....park it in your garage, and forget about it. That's what insurance is for. It's nothing you can effect, so there's no use in worrying about it.
 

Jaymar

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2018
Threads
2
Messages
968
Reaction score
1,126
Location
Portland, OR
First Name
Jaymar
Vehicle(s)
2022 GT/CS - Rapid Red
Well, you are actually answering your own question with the topic you are animatedly refusing to address. I have a fair amount of experience in automotive security systems but from 20 years ago. Back then chip immobilizers were starting to gain widespread traction from most of the OEMs and they were highly effective. There are always the legends of signal scanners cloning keys and magic black boxes that reprogram the cars which have roots in truth but are more esoteric and rarer than believed. The same technology is what is in use now more or less. A vast majority of stolen cars are tow offs, stolen key scenarios and car jackings. Of the rest, the gone out of the driveway scenario, an exceptionally large amount of those are generally suspected to be insurance fraud that can't be proven. That leaves a small few thefts that are subject to the defensive measures that you are discussing. And even then, the people that resort to those methods aren't idiots, they are very mechanically inclined individuals that are just as good at bypassing measures as you are at coming up with them. A simple kill switch like the lighter trick can be found and bypassed rather easily but it may just make it not worth the time for someone. Or it may piss them off and make them decide to get back at you by trashing the car instead. My point is this, don't invest too much time and effort into coming up with contraptions that are only marginally effective at defending against a percent of a percent scenario. Especially if you have to interrupt and potentially disrupt the integrity of a critical system like a fuel pump or something.
 

Buldawg76

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 11, 2022
Threads
3
Messages
712
Reaction score
518
Location
Alabama,USA
First Name
Mike
Vehicle(s)
2020 Mustang Ecoboost, Rapid Red Premium
Put a kill switch inline with the battery - turn off, car isn't going to start.

Put a kill switch at fuel pump harness, turn off, car isn't going to start.

I mean I could go on and on - it's not rocket science to figure out how to think outside of a larger box than any thief on the planet.

If the car is outside where it's accessible - driveway, street or parking lot, use of a drop and grab wrecker is most common - they're literally gone within minutes of making the hook up. Plus, you tell me how many people (anywhere) are going to interrupt a tow job... not many.

Just because many vehicles today rely on new technology, old school switch interrupters still work on ANY vehicle.
Only issue with battery kill switch is wouldn't you lose all retained memory functions as well as battery state learned memory. Fuel pump disconnect would work for sure.

The best method is one that takes the thief more time to steal your car then they are willing to spend trying to do so.

Dogs that bark at the slightest sounds work very well to make thieves pick an easier vehicle.

Wrong end of barrel pointed at them also works quite well. There is always a gun within arms reach at my home.

BD
 

Sponsored

ORRadtech

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2019
Threads
21
Messages
2,490
Reaction score
2,188
Location
Atlanta, Georgia
First Name
Dave
Vehicle(s)
18 Mustang EcoBoost convertible, 14 Ford Fusion SE
Put a kill switch inline with the battery - turn off, car isn't going to start.

Put a kill switch at fuel pump harness, turn off, car isn't going to start.

I mean I could go on and on - it's not rocket science to figure out how to think outside of a larger box than any thief on the planet.

If the car is outside where it's accessible - driveway, street or parking lot, use of a drop and grab wrecker is most common - they're literally gone within minutes of making the hook up. Plus, you tell me how many people (anywhere) are going to interrupt a tow job... not many.

Just because many vehicles today rely on new technology, old school switch interrupters still work on ANY vehicle.
All those things will help the car from disappearing. It also means that any failed theft attempt will probably leave access damage to the door, window or whatever. So maybe it doesn't get stolen but it's still going to suffer damage.
IMO, the only thing that might work is one of those big steering wheel locks like the old Club. It's obvious from the outside and hopefully enough of an aggravation to prompt the thief to just move on.

Well.....if someone wants it, they're going to get it.

The point to that is.....park it in your garage, and forget about it. That's what insurance is for. It's nothing you can effect, so there's no use in worrying about it.
This is pretty much my thought. I don't keep anything much in the car that I'd miss. The most "valuable" thing is an ancient ipod that stays plugged into the console.
I drive a convertible so I assume at some point it will be broken into. If that happens I'm sure the car alarm will go off and be obnoxious for a few minutes. I'm also sure it will be ignored. by any passer-bys. So I just keep good insurance on it and if it disappears I'll replace it.
 

Louk

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2018
Threads
44
Messages
625
Reaction score
412
Location
America
First Name
Lou
Vehicle(s)
F90 M5, 2022 TRX
We put a ravelco plug in our trx, too many stories of them being stolen in less than 5 min.
can someone eventually defeat the ravelco, yes but it would take several hours of undoing all of the spaghetti wiring they do.That is all time a thief is not going to waste. Shy of someone bringing a flatbed I feel pretty safe with that. I have not thought of putting one in the mustang though.
 

Johnnybee

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2018
Threads
5
Messages
888
Reaction score
619
Location
Canada
Vehicle(s)
2018 convertible
Here in Canada, the top 10 stolen vehicle list is basically trucks and SUVs, not a car in sight (nor our Rogue), so I figure the Mustang is not much of a target (plus it’s in the garage). We apparently have more issues with break-ins into vehicles in our neighborhood than whole vehicle thefts, which are possibly more aggravating because they may cause far more damage to the vehicle getting in than the value of the change and music thumb drive they take.
 
OP
OP
ZeroTX

ZeroTX

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2021
Threads
20
Messages
496
Reaction score
531
Location
Texas
First Name
ZERO
Vehicle(s)
2022 Mustang GT
Well.....if someone wants it, they're going to get it.
Literally said twice I'm not interested in replies like this. Move along.

To the others, I'm a seasoned car enthusiast. I'm 100% aware of various theft deterrent and prevention techniques.

MY QUESTION WASN'T ABOUT THAT

My question is on the effectiveness of the FACTORY set-up and, really, I wanted someone who knows the technical side of how this specific car works.

Other replies unnecessary.
 
OP
OP
ZeroTX

ZeroTX

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2021
Threads
20
Messages
496
Reaction score
531
Location
Texas
First Name
ZERO
Vehicle(s)
2022 Mustang GT
There are always the legends of signal scanners cloning keys and magic black boxes that reprogram the cars which have roots in truth but are more esoteric and rarer than believed.
While I agree that the majority of thieves are fairly pedestrian and not nearly sophisticated enough to do things like scanners/key cloning -- MANY professional thief rings are doing precisely those things.

Furthermore, there are a variety of very vehicle-specific methods of theft. Some vehicles are stolen because of demand for the vehicle. Others are stolen, because the thief/thief ring has a specific and easy method to steal that specific model and it is low hanging fruit.

Example: 2014-18 Silverado 1500's. In Texas, this is the MOST stolen vehicle that exists. Not 2019's.... not 2013's... 2014-2018. How are they doing it? Well, let's think it through. They have some sort of chip immobilizer, right? So the ECM needs to see the right chip code in order to start. Ok. Change the ECM. They have working ECMs. They pop the hood, swap in an ECM they brought with them and start the truck. Takes just a couple of minutes. This is fairly easy on these models because something like 85-90% of them were built with 5.3L V8s and there's a good chance a 5.3L ECM will actually run a 6.2L, too.

F150's are stolen too, right? But not at nearly the same rate. Why? Because F150's 2015+ have 5 different engine options, and two different generations of most of those (which aren't interchangeable from an ECM standpoint). Looking at an F150, most people cannot tell which engine it is. So that's not low hanging fruit.

A vast majority of stolen cars are tow offs, stolen key scenarios and car jackings.
So, like do you have any data to show that? That's my experience, nor that of most locals. There are DEFINITELY tow-off scenarios, and those are usually going to involve professional car thief rings who are targeting specific make/model/year of car, either due to the 'market' for that model, parts value (chop shops), or a 'customer' order for something specific. A friend of mine was in a professional car thief ring back in his late teens. He was their lackey, basically, doing the dirty work, but nonetheless, they were going after specifically "ordered" cars, usually exotics. In those days, they started them and drove them. In the modern era, most are probably, as you said, taken by tow.

But the MAJORITY of stolen car? No, Absolutely not, man. My dad had two trucks stolen in a single year, from two different locations, by two different methods, and neither method was tow-off, stolen key, or car-jacking. Also not insurance scam, considering the first truck was brand new with paper plates and after the insurance screwed him over, he had to buy an older higher mileage one with the scraps they paid him. First truck stolen from his home, 40ft from his bed. OnStar notified him on his phone, but by the time he got outside, they were already backing out. Camera footage shows a thief being dropped off by a white Suburban, quickly enters the truck and it's running within about 90 seconds, along with disabling the OnStar (which only worked long enough to send a notification). The likely method was OBD2 programming.

One addendum here: -- regarding your assertion about tow-offs... You're right, rarely would someone (especially a by-stander) interfere with a tow truck towing someone. BUT, they would most definitely SEE them doing it. Where are all the videos of suspicious tow-offs? I mean, the internet is abound with 100's of billions of videos of every useless thing happening everywhere...from cell phone cameras, to Ring doorbell cams, to home cameras, to dash cams. They're everywhere. Where are all these car-thief-tow videos?

The second stolen truck from my dad was an amateur and occurred in a hotel parking lot (not at home). Dad had put an aftermarket GPS tracker on it. They found the truck at some thief's house, mangled. He had completely trashed everything in the dash and under the hood, as it was clear he had used the "pop in an other ECM" trick. The police are so inept they couldn't even find the guy. Knocking on the door, some kid answers and said it is his "cousin" and he wasn't home. They never did any other investigation on it. Insurance fraud by my dad? Nope. Unfortunately, he had missed an insurance payment by 3 days and was not covered. He took a total loss, personally, and was so mentally scarred by the back-to-back thefts that he bought a cheesy Dodge SUV to avoid drawing thieves' attention.

Of the rest, the gone out of the driveway scenario, an exceptionally large amount of those are generally suspected to be insurance fraud that can't be proven.
Data? Source? While I admit my evidence is anecdotal, I actually have a lot of it. A neighbor's vehicle was stolen on camera. A new F250 diesel (push-button start). Camera footage shows the thief walking up, touching the door (which unlocked it), and driving off in under 15 seconds. No way that he did anything mechanical. He 100% had boosted the key fob signal, from the fob located just inside the house -- most homes that would be directly by the front door. It was also the second F250 stolen from the same driveway by the same method. Hopefully the owner figures out a way to stop this (e.g. put the fob in a RF-proof box, install something aftermarket, etc.).

Thanks for the conversation... Unfortunately still no one yet has specifically addressed the theft-resistance of a stock 2015-22 Mustang. I will assume that's because no one knows.
Sponsored

 
Last edited:
 




Top