BBQ tick - another attempt to understand

[NastyPumpkin]

What kinda powder is this where did you buy it?

It's super fine pure Carbon. (Look at above post)

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[stangman638]

You have a before and after video?

 

[stangman638]

https://www.digitaldipstick.com/single-post/2017/07/24/Effects-of-Oil-Cavitation

interesting read, the air bubbles act as jack hammers on the bearings...

 

[accel]

It's super fine pure Carbon. (Look at above post)

Scientifically oil plus carbon = nano-lubricant.

I found this on the diesel forums, interesting read and I’m not sure what to take away from this carbon research. Carbon wears metal faster when ZDDP is present yet somehow is a good friction when no ZDDP is present. Can anyone make more sense of this research paper?

My impression from article above is that carbon powder is very delicate matter. You add just enough and it reduces friction, you add a little more than that and it becomes abrasive.

Also, there are interactions with other additives like zddp (zinc replacement?)

Carbon is primarily friction modified, not directly mentioned in connection with oil bubbling.

 

[GT Pony]

My BBQ Tick is solved!! It's 100% CAVITATION!

Today I added a tea-spoon of extremely fine carbon powder to 1/2 quart of oil & mix. Drove it 10 miles & my tick is GONE! So, far.

Why doesn't all 5.0's have the tick or one is worse than another? My guess, build tolerance stack-up from engine to engine could have something to do with it.

Nano carbon particles are probably acting as cushions between metal parts - same with an additive like Cera Tec. If it's a parts build tolerance stack-up then it's a mechanical clearance issue, not an oil cavitation issue. Engines and journal bearings have been made for over 100 years, yet the Coyote is the only engine in the world that has ticking noises from oil cavitation problems? I don't buy the cavitation theory.

 

[accel]

Nano carbon particles are probably acting as cushions between metal parts - same with an additive like Cera Tec. If it's a parts build tolerance stack-up then it's a mechanical clearance issue, not an oil cavitation issue. Engines and journal bearings have been made for over 100 years, yet the Coyote is the only engine in the world that has ticking noises from oil cavitation problems? I don't buy the cavitation theory.

I think their theory - bubbling is causing accelerated bearing wear.

 

[Condor1970]

Instead of cavitation, how does he know it's not piston slap?

If you add carbon particles to the oil, it could also temporarily fill in tiny abnormalities in the cylinder wall to cushion and quiet down the slap.

 

[accel]

Instead of cavitation, how does he know it's not piston slap?

If you add carbon particles to the oil, it could also temporarily fill in tiny abnormalities in the cylinder wall to cushion and quiet down the slap.

According to pdf above carbon may also wear parts if added more than necessary.

As far as bubbling - I did noot find any scientific info on carbon particles preventing that.

As dae as piston slap vs rod bearing - I think those knocks should sound differently.

 

[GT Pony]

I think their theory - bubbling is causing accelerated bearing wear.

Why would oil bubble and cavitate in the Coyote and not in 1000 other different engine designs? Ford can't be that inept in the engine design department.

 

[stangman638]

Im not dumping carbon into my engine, try a different oil maybe.

 

[stangman638]

Why would oil bubble and cavitate in the Coyote and not in 1000 other different engine designs? Ford can't be that inept in the engine design department.

It makes a little sense, remember that tsb they put out on the trucks saying the typewriter noise was how the oil was interacting with the bearings? maybe they just left out the part of it doing damage over time to the bearings lol

 

[accel]

Im not dumping carbon into my engine, try a different oil maybe.

Yeah... if there was at least one official oil additive that contained carbon, it would be possible to try that.

 

[accel]

Why would oil bubble and cavitate in the Coyote and not in 1000 other different engine designs? Ford can't be that inept in the engine design department.

Yes, all very weird. But link in this thread https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/bbq-typewriter-and-bubbles.111410/ has interesting and easy to read info.

If you accept theory of bubbles then it makes it easier to understand why one oil fixes tick for some and not for others.

Also, if that's the case and one decides to go to dealership and the fix is replacement - it is better option to replace the whole engine and not just the short block.

 

[Condor1970]

Yeah... if there was at least one official oil additive that contained carbon, it would be possible to try that.

I don't believe you will find any additive with lots of added carbon.

Carbon is actually a contaminant. It may at some very specific percentage provide some sort of nano-particle lubrication. But overall, it is not good to have in your engine. Carbon naturally and continuously builds up over time in your engine oil, due to fuel burning and other contaminants in the air. It may be part of the reason the ticking stops for some cars as the oil gets older. The particulate contaminants may actually provide some physical cushioning of the parts. However, it also will cause some wear to the parts, as carbon is not really a mineral that will provide lubricity. If you purposely add carbon at the beginning of an oil change, the amount of total carbon will start at a high level, and continue to rise as the oil ages, far beyond what you want in your engine. Liquid Moly, or Boron would do a much better job of lubricating and cushioning without the potential of causing harm.

Stangman68 has it right. Even if someone experiments and achieves some results, I really don't recommend purposely adding carbon to your oil.

 

[NastyPumpkin]

Adding a teaspoon of carbon is really nothing in 10 quarts (2.5 gallons). I plan on running it for a 1000 miles, dump and then put Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 5W-30.
I will see what happens.

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