Transmission Tuning (advanced tech)

[Robottrainer]

Flash it, it might solve the problem.

Can't hurt.

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[Qcman17]

As for the sensors. You would think the adaptive learning would see the 4th 5th flair up and move to another table. It doesn't seem to do that. Contrary to what people think, I don't think the adaptive learning adapts to your driving style. I think it's suppose to adapt and correct things like what I'm experiencing.

By the way, in normal mode the shifts are flawless. The throttle response and short shifts suck!

Agreed on this. There is no way this trans is adapting to my driving habits. Realistically, it couldn't when it does so much random shit itself. It also doesn't seem to adapt to correct its own quirks as you note too. And same for mine smooth in normal but flat pedal response and skip shifts and short shifts suck.

I had the dealer shop foreman out in mine a few weeks ago with me. He is also a trans specialist, and one thing he noted was this trans tends to behave a bit oddly in any of the gears that can be skipped. But I pointed out that my quirks are in Sport etc. where the gears don't skip and he conceded that. He also told me there is no further hardware he can throw at it currently after the valve body was overhauled. So I don't know, I'm kind of tired of complaining about it and still have a bit under 3 years of warranty left so will see.

 

[K4fxd]

So I don't know, I'm kind of tired of complaining about it and still have a bit under 3 years of warranty left so will see.

In many ways I wish I had a gen 3, better ecu, DI, slightly more power, but I am 100% glad I have the 6R80. My left leg won't let me daily a stick so it has to be auto.

 

[Robottrainer]

Can't hurt.

So late last night I learned a few things. Roush's servers are open 24/7 to serve you. The vouchers are good a few months at least, the refresh is straight forward. The end of the line function is kinda cool, except it isn't like it when you don't do the misfire learn when you don't need it.

I flashed the latest revision. It's main update was cold misfiring. I immediately noticed a smoother cold warm up fast idle. Upon driving it looks like they fixed the stupid high oil pressure I was getting after the second stop when starting out. It took me 1/2 hour to get the trans up operating temps to do the drive cycle.

Upon completion, normal shifts smooth. Then for Sport mode. The short power drop between 1st and second is back. Seems it's what it does after a KAM reset. It goes away after a bit. So far the 4th to 5th shift is sharp. 3 to 4 was flaring a bit for the first few shifts then settled out. Overall the shifts are quick and firm and not as obnoxious as they were. I'm gardedly optimistic. It's was either a bad tune or bad upload. We'll see how much life was shaved off the trans after all this.

I think my plan now is to get the PCMtek software and play around with the fan thresholds. Thanks everyone for you help!

Agreed on this. There is no way this trans is adapting to my driving habits. Realistically, it couldn't when it does so much random shit itself. It also doesn't seem to adapt to correct its own quirks as you note too. And same for mine smooth in normal but flat pedal response and skip shifts and short shifts suck.

I had the dealer shop foreman out in mine a few weeks ago with me. He is also a trans specialist, and one thing he noted was this trans tends to behave a bit oddly in any of the gears that can be skipped. But I pointed out that my quirks are in Sport etc. where the gears don't skip and he conceded that. He also told me there is no further hardware he can throw at it currently after the valve body was overhauled. So I don't know, I'm kind of tired of complaining about it and still have a bit under 3 years of warranty left so will see.

Sounds like what I did. He can't explain why it works in normal mode. He starts going on about the drum and stuck valves but then circles back because it shifts fine in normal mode. He offered to do a pressure test. I might take him up on it.

 

[Robottrainer]

In many ways I wish I had a gen 3, better ecu, DI, slightly more power, but I am 100% glad I have the 6R80. My left leg won't let me daily a stick so it has to be auto.

Yeah I have a gen 3. It's a great car except for ford's inability to do anything auto, except my wife's 18 escape. It works great in normal or Sport mode. They should fire everyone that had hands on that trans including the software engineers. They should go first.

 

[Robottrainer]

In many ways I wish I had a gen 3, better ecu, DI, slightly more power, but I am 100% glad I have the 6R80. My left leg won't let me daily a stick so it has to be auto.

I should update my story. So I had it out last night. A bit of 3 to 4 flair and no flair on 4 to 5. I figured it's still adapting but I think it has a learning disability.

Today, started out the same but after the run on the highway, 3 to 4 and 4 to 5 start flailing. Same thing. About 500 rpm. Only in Sport, sport plus or track. Normal is perfect except for the less crisp shifts/throttle response. Seriously, If I could get the normal mode shifts a bit tighter and the better throttle response, I'd take it!

 

[Robottrainer]

Agreed on this. There is no way this trans is adapting to my driving habits. Realistically, it couldn't when it does so much random shit itself. It also doesn't seem to adapt to correct its own quirks as you note too. And same for mine smooth in normal but flat pedal response and skip shifts and short shifts suck.

I had the dealer shop foreman out in mine a few weeks ago with me. He is also a trans specialist, and one thing he noted was this trans tends to behave a bit oddly in any of the gears that can be skipped. But I pointed out that my quirks are in Sport etc. where the gears don't skip and he conceded that. He also told me there is no further hardware he can throw at it currently after the valve body was overhauled. So I don't know, I'm kind of tired of complaining about it and still have a bit under 3 years of warranty left so will see.

And I have no warranty left. ROUSH cuts it down to 3 years and I'm overdue on time, not milage. An 8000 dollar rebuild bill is not in the cards. If it comes to that we may have to part ways. All because ford can't get their shit together. May be it's time for a used GTR

 

[engineermike]

FYI, you can also disable the trans learning but it's not as straightforward as the other ideas.

 

[Qcman17]

FYI, you can also disable the trans learning but it's not as straightforward as the other ideas.

Just curious if you can see evidence of actual learning in any of the logs etc? As in where a parameter is different after a period of time that wasn’t manually changed in the trans tune.

 

[K4fxd]

Just curious if you can see evidence of actual learning in any of the logs etc?

Interesting thought. I never thought to do this. I just might give it a try. I have a 6r80 however.

 

[shogun32]

I have a 6r80 however.

I don't think the 6r80 was allowed to ride except on the short bus.

 

[dirtwarrior]

I do know the can tune from Diablo Sport is not good for the auto trans

 

[engineermike]

Just curious if you can see evidence of actual learning in any of the logs etc? As in where a parameter is different after a period of time that wasn’t manually changed in the trans tune.

I'm not sure you'd see anything. There are so many ways it might be learning and it all happens so fast. The log I posted was a Normal shift at part throttle, so it was as slow as it gets, and I had cut down to just a few channels logged at the highest data rate and you still didn't get a lot of data points.

My assumption was that it learns the solenoid current needed to get a desired amount of clutch slip, since shaft speed is the only feedback sensor it has to learn from. But then I realized those scientists might actually be looking at other things like solenoid resistivity vs current, response times, or even measuring voltage after it's de-energized. My mind has been blown by the amount of learning that these are constantly doing.

US20220099046A1 - Method and system for adjusting operation of a fuel injector - Google Patents

• At time t3, the fuel injector is commanded off. However, fuel continues to flow through the fuel injector while the fuel injector's magnetic field begins to be reduced. The fuel injector voltage turns negative due to the sudden cut-off of electric current flow into the fuel injector.
• [0042]
  At time t4, the magnitude of the slope of the fuel injector voltage increases as the fuel injector voltage decays toward zero. This change in slope may be the basis for determining the fuel injector closing time since the voltage reduction may be indicative of the fuel injector's magnetic field collapsing, which may be indicative of closing time of the fuel injector.

Just an example of the minute details that it's learning constantly. Another example, it learns the null duty cycle of the cam phasers (duty cycle required to hold the cams stationary) and compares banks.

 

[K4fxd]

I was wondering if the changes will show in the module or tuning parameters. I know when I changed battery to an AGM the car learned it and all the correct parameters were listed in the module that controls the battery charging. When I opened forscan to manually enter this info it was already there. It knew it was AGM and the CCA.

Surprised me because everyone says the BCM needs to be reset and correct battery info entered. Not true, at least on gen2

 

[engineermike]

Nah, nothing in the engine tune changes automatically except the kam and I can’t see that part.

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