Talk me into a centrifugal

[blakeman8192]

Centri will be everything you love about the character of the coyote engine, but more. True story.

100% this. Power delivery is just like NA, but with a whole lot more of it.

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[GregO]

Hey, I can safely say that very few people kick my ass at autocross. I beat Shotz's ZL1 1LE (whipple) Optima car in 2022 at Nationals and took the W right out from under him.

Last year I did loose to Shotz's fully built SS 1LE, Otis's ZL1 1LE (who is local to me and usually spanks everyone - he's an alien), and a 4-banger Camaro. I was sore about losing to the 4 cylinder.

So, that doesn't tell us much about what's the winningest combination (turbo 4, NA V8, Wipple V8), but I run against Otis a lot and I do feel like his power AND 2nd gear top speed limits are impactful. Shotz thought his ZL1 was front top heavy with the blower which is I think why he said he built the NA SS car for '23.

I figured the Centri might be a win if I can keep at least my currently level of low RPM torque (after dropping down to 3.31) - the car wouldn't be any slower at low RPM, and it would be faster at high RPM and could run to 70. We're often in a low RPM out of low speed tight corners, but you can't really romp on it until you get the car straightened out some, which leaves some time for the RPM/boost to build. My general strategy is to optimize for the fast sections (but those are going to often be ending in some sort of maneuvering through offsets or slaloms at nearly 65mph, so front-top whipple weight may indeed be an issue.

I’m the wrong guy to engage in this conversation but figured what the heck I’ll throw this out there.

https://www.hamburgerssuperchargers.com/Ford-Supercharger-Kits_c_86.html

https://kraftwerksusa.com/superchar...cle/15-20-mustang-5-0l-coyote-w-o-intune.html

Rotrex FTW

 

[Timbuck]

hellion turbo V ess g3 120mm pulley of memory…

Just shows how quick small turbos can spool 500hp @ 4000 , compaired to 5700for the ESS
PD if you want power now…but comes with heat. Interchiller would be awesome for track stuff To help keep everything cool.
but very hard to beat the simplicity of any supercharger really. ESS is a no brainer for that. One day and you away Having fun.

every video I see century blowers is just about people going flat out , with out showing day to day drivability or mid throttle cornering etc. perfect for flat out a10 cars. Got to be at high rpm to make them work.

I guess this is where PD is for the win , crack the throttle and you have power Anywhere any time.

The custom made twin turbo I went in was pretty perfect. At 2500 we had 3lbs of boost and it just was instant power from there Whenever you needed it. almost felt like a OEM turbo car. It had 750hp on 10lbs. It felt so perfect and had power at any RPM or gear. Was a 6r80 car stock Converter etc.

We have a Mercedes A250 and it has full boost at 1800rpm yes it falls over I the higher rpm , I feel coyote is not that different than 2 of these bolted together.
turbo tech has come along way and I feel If one was not shooting for huge HP numbers it wouldn’t be hard to replicate something like a 650 or 700hp instant boost type set up.
kind of perfect drivers car….…. You have power everywhere and controllable via boost curve.
food for thought.

 

[ShadesOfBloo]

Hey, I can safely say that very few people kick my ass at autocross. I beat Schotz's ZL1 1LE (whipple) Optima car in 2022 at Nationals and took the W right out from under him.

Now I'm curious about that Camaro build, but can't find anything about it.
He replaced his stock supercharger with a Whipple? What else do you know about it?

 

[schmeky]

Sad thing about threads like this is it always gets into a Turbo vs PD vs Centri thing.

So OP gets confused and is stuck in paralysis analysis (as I was at one time).

I went with a P1X and don't regret one second or 1/10 of a mile. It's been great, reliable, and non-intrusive. My Centri set up is super simple, has only a few moving parts, and has been OEM reliable and trouble-free.

TUNING IS CRITICAL.

You'll hate anything that is not tuned right, and keep in mind drivability has not been discussed in this thread. This is critical if you want to be happy, regardless of the decision.

My Wengerd tuned P1X is superb, has great throttle response and has all the daily power you need below 3K. P1X runs very cool in daily driving and runs 3 - 4 degrees above ambient on the highway.

Coyote and a Centri are a well suited to each other, and the A10 will put you in the "Oh My God" mode in a second.

Any FI is great, and you can't go wrong with a Coyote, but if I had to do it all over again, I would go Centri for sure.

 

[Beaujangles]

Well, I went and did it, ordered the G3X kit with a G4 intercooler...having had cars with Turbo and PD in the past, I figured it's about time to try a Centi since I already knew what I didn't like about the others ...

 

[SheepDog]

Good man

Yeah I see that they dont have lag, they’re just weaker at low RPM. Im my case (autocross), I’ll be in 2nd gear at whatever RPM the course allows, and if I’m getting on the power its probably digging out of a 35mph corner to accelerate up to 70mph before hitting the brakes for the next slow element. I need more than NA torque to pull out of corners at low RPM and to makeup for the torque hit I’m going to take from switching to 3.31 gears

It looks like Centris sort of do that. I’d have a little more power at 3k than stock but not tons more and sure once I get going things will build ok. With a turbo, by the time it spooled I’d be out of time and hitting the brakes. Its very hard to prespool for a corner exit with your foot, so turbos are out, but I’m on the fence about Centris

A wipple might be the right choice for power delivery (more boost at low RPM??) but they’re heavier and more expenaive.

My question is: Are you planning on installing a fuel system? (Or KPM type of upgrade) so that you can run E85?

IMHO, the centri setup will work great for what you are trying to achieve provided you get the benefit of the additional timing you can add with E, and the ability to pulley down. People saying that “they’re weak down low, no power until 5k rpm etc” are running conservative setups that aren’t exploiting the system properly.

ESS or Procharger, E85, and a pulley that will net you 13-14 psi, and you will see boost the moment you tip into the throttle.

people running pump gas and a giant blower pulley are sad because they aren’t coming anywhere near the full potential of the system

 

[80FoxCoupe]

Well, I went and did it, ordered the G3X kit with a G4 intercooler...having had cars with Turbo and PD in the past, I figured it's about time to try a Centi since I already knew what I didn't like about the others ...

Should have went procharger, but at least you got a centri nevertheless. Congrats-ish.

 

[Beaujangles]

Actually Procharger was my first choice, but the price difference made me go with ESS.

 

[NightmareMoon]

My question is: Are you planning on installing a fuel system? (Or KPM type of upgrade) so that you can run E85?

IMHO, the centri setup will work great for what you are trying to achieve provided you get the benefit of the additional timing you can add with E, and the ability to pulley down. People saying that “they’re weak down low, no power until 5k rpm etc” are running conservative setups that aren’t exploiting the system properly.

ESS or Procharger, E85, and a pulley that will net you 13-14 psi, and you will see boost the moment you tip into the throttle.

people running pump gas and a giant blower pulley are sad because they aren’t coming anywhere near the full potential of the system

Ah good point about the pully! TY

I was thinking about my conservative top end goals and not considering setting a pully size for good low RPM boost.

Yes I'd get a fuel system if my goals require a fuel system. Chances are I'll be messing around with surge tanks anyway (fuel starvation issues on track)

 

[SheepDog]

Ah good point about the pully! TY

I was thinking about my conservative top end goals and not considering setting a pully size for good low RPM boost.

Yes I'd get a fuel system if my goals require a fuel system. Chances are I'll be messing around with surge tanks anyway (fuel starvation issues on track)

Exactly. You spend very little time at redline. Pulley so that you’re making power as soon as possible. The ethanol helps not only with timing, but cooling the cylinders (especially important if you have a stock bottom end with very tight ring gaps)

 

[SolarFlare]

Should’ve bought a Camaro SS 1le lol

 

[blakeman8192]

Should have went procharger, but at least you got a centri nevertheless. Congrats-ish.

Genuine question - why would Procharger have been the better choice?

 

[HKusp]

He's not sold on the ESS "hype".

 

[furdfan2018]

No wrong choices if you are doing a max-effort drag build. Centri, PD, turbos... all will deliver MORE than you could imagine.

For a street build/occasional track day, PD blower or turbos with lots of cooling. Centri is boring AF on the street. Sorry... my experience with one SUCKED. Belt slip all the time, no power at all until 5k rpm, LOUD ass bypass valve ALWAYS open unless you are WOT. Pass!

Flame suit on. lol

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