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Staggered or not

rpinkstn

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This is the exact scenario that confuses me. So you're saying you could in fact tell that the front wheels were narrower than the rear wheels as it drove passed?
Maybe it's just me, but looking at a car from the side, I cannot tell if the rear wheels are 1 inch wider than the fronts. If it's a drag car and has fat and skinnies on the car, that's understandable but a 10" front compared to an 11" rear seems hardly visually noticeable.
Very true, only a 1" difference would be difficult to see - however, most staggered setups I've seen (and the one I installed on my wife's car) have a wider tire on the rear in addition to the wider wheel as well as a significantly different offset between the front and rear wheels. These two factors usually make a staggered setup more noticeable.
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Ewheels

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I have a staggered set up that I like and am not going to enter the debate on which is better. But I want to ask the others, do you really think rotating is that important? Before you answer, hear me out. I'm running 285/35/19 front and 305/35/19 rear. Last time I purchased the front were just under $300 each and the back were about $330 each, so $1,300 in tires.

Without being able to rotate, I'm going through 2 sets of rears for every 1 set of fronts. That means I'm saving ~$600 every other time. With a square set up I'd be replacing all 4 every time. See I'm saving myself money :cwl:
The tire change interval would be longer on the square setup - fair point though; probably not as pertinent on a street car. More important for track cars when you could be going through a set of tires in a weekend.
 

coz0502

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The tire change interval would be longer on the square setup - fair point though; probably not as pertinent on a street car. More important for track cars when you could be going through a set of tires in a weekend.
I was half joking but as I typed that, I did wonder if the longer time to replace on a square setup would even out the only replacing 2 every other time? I guess it would depend on each persons driving habits.
 

luc

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I have a staggered set up that I like and am not going to enter the debate on which is better. But I want to ask the others, do you really think rotating is that important? Before you answer, hear me out. I'm running 285/35/19 front and 305/35/19 rear. Last time I purchased the front were just under $300 each and the back were about $330 each, so $1,300 in tires.

Without being able to rotate, I'm going through 2 sets of rears for every 1 set of fronts. That means I'm saving ~$600 every other time. With a square set up I'd be replacing all 4 every time. See I'm saving myself money :cwl:
Me, itā€™s the opposite, running 305/35/18 squared and the front wear much fasterā€¦I wonder why? Maybe because itā€™s a track car ?šŸ˜‚
 

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luc

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I never heard the word ā€œstance ā€œ used so much than in this forum, obviously a lot of Mustang drivers are willing to make some handling compromise in order to achieve the ā€œright ā€œ stance
Not a criticism, not everyone need the best handling possible on the street
On a race/track car, the right stance is the one that give you the lowest lap timesā€¦ f&$ck the estheticā€¦
 

Egparson202

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On a race/track car, the right stance is the one that give you the lowest lap times
Im right there with you! Fast cars look good!
 

Rapid Red

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Changing the stock rims on this car would be a downgrade.

There is a .5'' difference in the rim widths, of the factory wheels. So just how much frigging understeer is happing? I've not noticed, but I also know how to drive and correct the line on the fly.

How does it really affect the driving at the end of the lap? Unless you're campaigning the car, the time advantage squared is a moot point.

Boiling it down to the common denominator it comes to this 1 fact.

Square you can do a front-to-back cross rotation. On the other hand, staggered simply rotates crosswise.

That will extend the mileage of the tire. Why because of the road surfaces and route driven daily. Flipping the tires, the driver to pass side changes the wear pattern.

One more "When someone says they only use Cup 2's, I know they're a newbie."

To me, it sounds like someone that is in over his head making car payments. Most likely running Costco fuel.

I like the tire and can afford to run them.
 

K4fxd

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Most likely running Costco fuel.
In my part of the woods Costco fuel is the best. I kept hearing how much better V power is so I filled a tank and data logged. Knock city. Especially in the mid range section. It wasn't much, mostly less than 1 degree being pulled but some being pulled non the less. On the supposed cheap fuel I get 0 knock even pulling hard up a hill in hot summer weather.

Why the costco fuel is better at knock suppression, I don't know since all the gas in these parts comes from the same distribution tanks in Covington Ky. It must be the additive package or it might be the freshness of the fuel.

If you like Cup 2's more power to you.
 

Ewheels

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Changing the stock rims on this car would be a downgrade.

There is a .5'' difference in the rim widths, of the factory wheels. So just how much frigging understeer is happing? I've not noticed, but I also know how to drive and correct the line on the fly.

How does it really affect the driving at the end of the lap? Unless you're campaigning the car, the time advantage squared is a moot point.

Boiling it down to the common denominator it comes to this 1 fact.

Square you can do a front-to-back cross rotation. On the other hand, staggered simply rotates crosswise.

That will extend the mileage of the tire. Why because of the road surfaces and route driven daily. Flipping the tires, the driver to pass side changes the wear pattern.

One more "When someone says they only use Cup 2's, I know they're a newbie."

To me, it sounds like someone that is in over his head making car payments. Most likely running Costco fuel.

I like the tire and can afford to run them.
"Changing the stock rims on this car would be a downgrade."
- so changing from the heavy factory PP2 wheels to some 18x11 Forgelines would be a downgrade? Ok, sure šŸ¤¦ā€ā™‚ļø

"Square you can do a front-to-back cross rotation. On the other hand, staggered simply rotates crosswise."
- correct. We're on the same page here.

"To me, it sounds like someone that is in over his head making car payments. Most likely running Costco fuel. I like the tire and can afford to run them."
- I can very comfortably afford my car and have probably another $15k or so in mods. I do not use Costco fuel.
The reason Cup 2's are a terrible choice is not because they are a bad tire but because there are better options in every way.
1. Max grip: Cup 2's cost the same as Hoosiers so if you're going for fastest lap times, Cup 2's are the wrong choice.
2. Grip per dollar: the Supercar 3R is faster AND cheaper than the Cup 2, so wrong again.
3. Longevity/Consistency: if you're after some practice laps, there are other tires out there that last much much longer than Cup 2's. Once again, wrong choice.
 
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luc

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Changing the stock rims on this car would be a downgrade.

There is a .5'' difference in the rim widths, of the factory wheels. So just how much frigging understeer is happing? I've not noticed, but I also know how to drive and correct the line on the fly.

How does it really affect the driving at the end of the lap? Unless you're campaigning the car, the time advantage squared is a moot point.

Boiling it down to the common denominator it comes to this 1 fact.

Square you can do a front-to-back cross rotation. On the other hand, staggered simply rotates crosswise.

That will extend the mileage of the tire. Why because of the road surfaces and route driven daily. Flipping the tires, the driver to pass side changes the wear pattern.

One more "When someone says they only use Cup 2's, I know they're a newbie."

To me, it sounds like someone that is in over his head making car payments. Most likely running Costco fuel.

I like the tire and can afford to run them.
Obviously you donā€™t track your car because otherwise you would know that you have other tires, nt01, being 1 of them, they are much better than the cup2
At least the same grip, last longer and more importantly, do not heat cycles out
Also having a well balanced car on a track ( almost every one run 305 squared) is not only about the fastest lap but also the sheer driving pleasure than the car give you
Btw,I always turn tc/stability control completely off at the track because itā€™s the only way to get and feel the true handling characteristics of the car
 

tosha

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305/30/19 square on 11 rims with 200TW tires is what I drive daily, guess I'm doing something completely wrong šŸ¤Ŗ šŸ¤£. Love the looks of it as well as steering feel aspect.

PP1 staggered setup is a terrible downgrade for anything track driving related.
 

Prodigal

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305/30/19 square on 11 rims with 200TW tires is what I drive daily
What offset and spacer set up are you running? Suspension?
 

tosha

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What offset and spacer set up are you running? Suspension?
25mm spacers, ARP extended studs, Ford Performance Magneride Track Package (springs, sway bars) and tune, steeda trident 11 wheels with +53 offset (I believe), steeda camber plates and alignment, steeda extreme g-trac k member brace, something else I probably forgot. Planning to fix IRS next.

The only issue with this setup is road clearance, it's under 4 inches :crazy:
 
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m3incorp

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Wow, this is one of those threads where almost everyone tracks their cars :). Those who track are definitely going to recommend what they track. Now, how many other people with Mustangs track their cars.....a very small percentage, and those people don't give a crap about tracking and instead, running whatever setup looks good, feels good, rides good, handles good, or whatever to them. What's up with the Costco hate? Many consider Costco to be good gas. Also, it has nothing to do with what one can afford or not......visit places with a lot of high-cost cars, and you will see plenty of them at Costco pumps. Keep in mind, this very forum has a huge thread where a lot of the people who run 87 octane.....yep cringe territory for many of us, but fine for them. One thing about a forum is that many of us HAVE TO BE RIGHT and everyone else is doing it wrong....doesn't matter whether their situation is different or not.
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