Horrible understeer

[luc]

I always trail braked into that one. My problem was oversteer on exit. Especially terrifying because there was astro turf on runout there way back when.

…and the astro turf was always full of marbles….

Sponsored

 

[bnightstar]

then don't take your street wheels to the track. Changing camber is just dumb.

your fear of thru-bolt spacers is irrational and without cause. Your buddy clearly did not torque things properly. Wheel lug bolts are NOT designed to take the sheer forces, the clamping-induced friction is. Any spacers you use should not be painted for this reason. Anodized is fine.

Not on track I have rubbing on full lock when I park the car into the garage. Also how am I supposed to drive on the street -3.2 camber on the OEM PP1 rims looks insane. Ether way my buddy has a lot of mechanical knowhow and it's very fast driver on full slicks in a fully preped 2.8T BMW Z3. I don't think it was over torque or something just spacers are that dangerous last season we have 2-3 similar incidents with different cars and drivers. I just don't see spacers safe enough nor I want to deal with the whole hassle around them. Less things to brake on track less things that can go wrong. Ether way as I said spacers for me are not needed on track and I run 305/30 with no rubbing. I do agree changing camber is annoying and dumb though.

 

[Dana Pants]

The best part of actually racing your car is giving zero cares what it looks like.

 

[luc]

Not on track I have rubbing on full lock when I park the car into the garage. Also how am I supposed to drive on the street -3.2 camber on the OEM PP1 rims looks insane. Ether way my buddy has a lot of mechanical knowhow and it's very fast driver on full slicks in a fully preped 2.8T BMW Z3. I don't think it was over torque or something just spacers are that dangerous last season we have 2-3 similar incidents with different cars and drivers. I just don't see spacers safe enough nor I want to deal with the whole hassle around them. Less things to brake on track less things that can go wrong. Ether way as I said spacers for me are not needed on track and I run 305/30 with no rubbing. I do agree changing camber is annoying and dumb though.

Spacers are 100% safe if used correctly. For example hub centric design require hub centric spacer
So a failure , as you described, is always due to operator mistakes
In that you’re right that it add a level of complexity and risks compared to no spacers
As for you being able to run 305 with no spacers, you should precise that there is downside to not using spacers in that you can’t rotate your tires. Which is quite a big issue on track tires

 

[bnightstar]

As for you being able to run 305 with no spacers, you should precise that there is downside to not using spacers in that you can’t rotate your tires. Which is quite a big issue on track tires

You mean you can't rotate tires without tire machine but you still can rotate at a tire shop. Here in Bulgaria tire shops are super cheap so it's not an issue.

 

[luc]

You mean you can't rotate tires without tire machine but you still can rotate at a tire shop. Here in Bulgaria tire shops are super cheap so it's not an issue.

Ok, you can’t rotate wheels

 

[Flyhalf]

The best part of actually racing your car is giving zero cares what it looks like.

......naaahhhh we are still proud of how it looks c'mon.
Imagine F1 dirty with water spots. There is some attraction to have a beautiful car

 

[kz]

Also how am I supposed to drive on the street -3.2 camber on the OEM PP1 rims looks insane.

Why ? It's not exactly stanced look but most importantly, why do you give a shit ?

 

[bnightstar]

Why ? It's not exactly stanced look but most importantly, why do you give a shit ?

Regarding appearance no. But you can imagine rubbing every time you park your car into the garage can get annoying really fast and by rubbing I mean annoying knock from the wheel to the chassis everytime I do a full lock. This obviously is not healthy way to park a car. That's why I give a shit. Obviously max possible camber is needed for track duty.

 

[Bulldog9]

Spacers are 100% safe if used correctly. For example hub centric design require hub centric spacer
So a failure , as you described, is always due to operator mistakes
In that you’re right that it add a level of complexity and risks compared to no spacers
As for you being able to run 305 with no spacers, you should precise that there is downside to not using spacers in that you can’t rotate your tires. Which is quite a big issue on track tires

The only way a hubcentric spacer will fail is if they are not torqued properly, and never checked thereafter.

 

[GTP]

... With either a stock spring setup ... I find the Mustang has a serious lack of front support and entry stability is not good. ... To make a front engine GT car turn, you need to be able to carry the brakes into the corner to keep tire load forward in the car...

My advice? Put on a big front spring, either the Steeda or BMR, without stiffening the rear spring. You don't can't afford to give up any grip on the rear of the car. A cheap and easy way to see if my advice has any merit is to put a 70 or 80 hardness spring rubber in the front and try it. https://www.resuspension.com/springs/spring-rubbers/res-5-00-spring-rubber-re-sr500-1500-xx.html
...
The Mach 1 is the first stock S550 to even go in the direction I'm talking about & it gets pretty good feedback from the track.

So there's a lot to chew on. See if it does anything for you.

@TeeLew, I have 2019 PP1 Magneride, and GT350R bars front & rear. I am unsure of the OEM spring rates. The spreadsheet in the 6g sticky thread is getting rather dated. If it is correct for my car then I am at only 165#/inch front rate, and 728 rear.

The M1 owner's manual publishes (page 339) 211#/in front and 742 rear for the handling package. So the rear is already pretty close between the two cars.

I switch several things converting my car from street to track and back again. So inserting spring rubber donuts would be easy enough to add.

Which hardness donut do you recommend for me to attempt to mimic the M1 front spring rate? Which sets if I ordered two pairs of different hardness?

Would be nice if there was a chart to help choose which donuts.

 

[bnightstar]

@TeeLew, I have 2019 PP1 Magneride, and GT350R bars front & rear. I am unsure of the OEM spring rates. The spreadsheet in the 6g sticky thread is getting rather dated. If it is correct for my car then I am at only 165#/inch front rate, and 728 rear.

The M1 owner's manual publishes (page 339) 211#/in front and 742 rear for the handling package. So the rear is already pretty close between the two cars.

In terms of spring rates any 200/800 combo springs will get you close enough to M1 rates. But your shocks are totally different than the M1 Magneride and that you can't mimic.

 

[kz]

But your shocks are totally different than the M1 Magneride and that you can't mimic.

How did you come up with that ? I haven't looked (which should be easy to do) but dampers are probably exactly the same, VDM programming might be slightly different.

 

[TeeLew]

......naaahhhh we are still proud of how it looks c'mon.
Imagine F1 dirty with water spots. There is some attraction to have a beautiful car

Beauty might only be skin deep, but it's a reasonable indicator for overall prep.

 

[TeeLew]

In terms of spring rates any 200/800 combo springs will get you close enough to M1 rates. But your shocks are totally different than the M1 Magneride and that you can't mimic.

I do think that Ford Performance Track kit is a little better combo for spring rates. I don't know which MR dampers are on the M1. There is a higher damping force model which was on GT350R's and GT500's. It might have those.

Sponsored