Ford Recommends 5w50 Now?

[gimmie11s]

Are you an old SVTPERFORMANCE guy. These young kids have no idea how bad we could roast them. BBQ tick. Ticking. Typewriter noise. Rattle. Piston slap. Lots of keyboard mechanics around here

You know me too well.

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[Stonehauler]

I used to live in Chicago. I've been to Minneapolis during the winter more times than I care to count. My vehicles are stored outside, uncovered. I've ridden my motorcycles in howling 9F temps. Mustangs are rarely the only car a person owns and rarely cranked up at extreme cold temp. Yes single digits can happen as far south as NC and low teens even as far as Alabama. When it's extreme cold out (below 20F, let alone 0F) the number of people who take the Mustang to work at o-dark-thirty is downright tiny compared to the total population of owners. And the people that do very likely have an indoor garage or engine-block heaters. I did not suggest running 5w was a bad thing, just that given the distribution of ambient temps, way overkill for a very large cross-section of owners.

except if you write your manual for the entire US, which most do with the possible exception of California, you have to go with what the extremes area, both hot and cold. They are not going to publish a Minnesota manual, a Florida manual etc. especially as there could be people who would want it tested to see if it changed the overall mileage. Therefore, they have to recommend a general oil that will work most places.

 

[Xavierviana]

My 2016 seems to really like 5W30 or 5W40. I haven't put 5W20 in the thing for ages.

Which brand are you using?

 

[stangman638]

Ford is not recommending 5w-50 .. there are no bulletins that state anything of the sort.

 

[GT Pony]

Ford is not recommending 5w-50 .. there are no bulletins that state anything of the sort.

Yep ... apparently only a confused dealership.

 

[choate]

Pretty sure track pack 2011 GTs got 5w50 from the factory

 

[choate]

https://www.svtperformance.com/thre...e-on-14-track-pack-gt-cap-says-5w-50.1020772/

 

[fahadco80]

My dealer provided the first three oil changes free. I asked them to please use 5w30 instead of 5w20 and offered to pay any difference. As far as I know they did what I requested, at no extra cost and shown on the reciept was the 5w 30. My engine has ran without any tick at all. I did my own oil change this past weekend and used my standard 5w30 mobil 1.

Hi,

Do you have the 2k rattle when letting off the throttle paddle?

Like mine:


Thanks

 

[1 old racer]

Mine does not rattle. However if I take the engine cover off I do hear the injectors noise that can be confused as a rattle by some.

 

[BrianGT2015]

You guys have way to much time invested into this oil discussion. I mean seriously...It's informative, but damn. I mean, damn...

 

[GT Pony]

You guys have way to much time invested into this oil discussion. I mean seriously...It's informative, but damn. I mean, damn...

If you think this place is bad about oil discussions, go over to bobistheoilguy and see what goes on there.

 

[VinnyVicci]

Hi,

Do you have the 2k rattle when letting off the throttle paddle?

Like mine:


Thanks

I got the same thing. It goes away once you drive around. It’s the lift off rattle. Not the same as the 2k rattle. There was a tsb for the f150 to replace the heat shield between the transmission and motor, or something of that sort. I don’t know if it fixes it, but there is no tsb for the mustangs. Every time I take it to the dealer it stops making that noise.

 

[fahadco80]

I got the same thing. It goes away once you drive around. It’s the lift off rattle. Not the same as the 2k rattle. There was a tsb for the f150 to replace the heat shield between the transmission and motor, or something of that sort. I don’t know if it fixes it, but there is no tsb for the mustangs. Every time I take it to the dealer it stops making that noise.

Mine will keep doing it 24/7, the dealer heard it in both last two visits and they keep saying its normal.

 

[aleccolin]

Bearing clearances are what establish the viscosity required, primarily. Tight clearances = low viscosity oil, loose clearances = heavier oil. It's not a bean counter decision, it's a function of the design. And of course there's more to it.

Improved modern production tolerances have allowed OEMs to use tighter bearing clearances and lower viscosity oils which help in efficiency and hitting fuel consumption targets. Counter-intuitively, the tight clearances also increase the load capacity of the bearing for a given journal diameter, but the decreased oil film thickness leaves less room for error. Higher than normal cylinder pressures due to boost or nitrous demand an oil with higher film strength to maintain bearing capacity without collapsing the oil film thickness to zero. Very high cylinder pressures at relatively low RPM is the main reason diesel engines use 50 weight oils along with larger bearings and clearances. For a gas engine, basically don't spray on the hit unless your motor is built for it, or you'll quickly introduce your rod bearings to your crank.

This brief article explains this relationship well: https://blog.k1technologies.com/bearing-clearance-and-oil-viscosity-explained

Mechanical shear of the oil film and heat both play a role in diminishing the viscosity of your oil. This is where the quality of your oil may be more importance than the viscosity.

I've had a half dozen cars now with OE or aftermarket forced induction, so I've done a lot of reading on oil and here's my $.02

- For an OE F/I application I use Mobil 1 in the recommended weight. It's cheap and really good. If boost is increased from stock I'll go up a bit in viscosity. My Audi regularly sees 20-22+ psi so I use 5W40 Euro instead of 5W30. Engines built for boost will typically have larger bearing clearances and a higher flow oil pump to suit. The shear forces on the oil film are lower which reduces oil viscosity loss due to mechanical shear, so the need for an oil with exceptional "shear stability" is not as great. The trade off is needing a larger journal diameter to maintain the bearing load capacity and reduced efficiency.

- For an aftermarket F/I application I use Amsoil and go up a step in viscosity. A naturally aspirated engine will generally have tighter bearing clearances than one built for boost. Amsoil does have higher shear stability than Mobil 1 so you get better protection without having to go full race weight on your oil. 5W30 Amsoil Signature is a great all-around option for a boosted Coyote street car even if it sees occasional hard use.

- The biggest reason to go up to a 50 weight for a healthy gas engine is extreme heat. If it's truly a track slut, then go for the 5W50. There's a reason the GT350 has an oil temp gauge in the dash (although I think it's a derived value, not actual). I've got a lot of experience with air/oil cooled bikes and they all require heavy 50 or 60 weight oils because of the heat. If you've ever cooked a big twin in parade traffic then checked your oil you'll know it's as thin as water, maybe less.

So will it hurt to put 5W50 in YOUR car? Probably not, but bear in mind that all else being equal, heavier weight oil will yield higher oil pressure, but lower overall flow. Oil has 3 jobs - to act as an oil film bearing surface, to provide cooling, and to provide lubrication - in that order of importance. Your 50 weight might improve oil film strength, but at the detriment of cooling and lubrication which depend on flow. Unless your operating temps are up high enough to warrant it, skip the race weight oil and stay closer to what the manufacturer recommends.

/nerdfest

 

[GT Pony]

So will it hurt to put 5W50 in YOUR car? Probably not, but bear in mind that all else being equal, heavier weight oil will yield higher oil pressure, but lower overall flow. Oil has 3 jobs - to act as an oil film bearing surface, to provide cooling, and to provide lubrication - in that order of importance. Your 50 weight might improve oil film strength, but at the detriment of cooling and lubrication which depend on flow. Unless your operating temps are up high enough to warrant it, skip the race weight oil and stay closer to what the manufacturer recommends.

/nerdfest

You won't lose any oil flow volume to parts that are force fed by the positive displacement oil pump. You could lose some oil flow if the engine is revved high before the oil gets to full operating temperature - that's a bad thing to do regardless of what viscosity of oil is used. If the PD oil pump goes into pressure relief (due to cold thick oil), then you would lose some oil flow volume to the oiling system. But even 10W-40 or 5W-50 when fully hot should not put the pump in pressure relief, so you're not going to lose oil flow volume in that case. Keep high revs down until the oil is at full operating temperature.

Also, there is plenty of technical information that shows that higher viscosity oil gives a thicker MOFT (minimum oil film thickness) in the journal bearings - that's the only thing that provides full hydrodynamic lubrication and prevents metal-to-metal contact inside the journal bearings. That's the main reason car manufactures recommend a higher viscosity oil for track use ... because with the increased heat from continued high revs, the oil (even if it heats up more from it's own shearing) still has a thicker MOFT than thinner oil would have under the same use conditions. A good oil cooler is a must for any track car, regardless of the oil viscosity used. You could use 0W-20 for track use if you could keep the oil temperature down to 200F all the time. MOFT is directly related to the oil viscosity as a function of temperature.

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