MMR OPG's

[socketman]

Ford says .004" +/- .0005" for the 5.0l & 5.2l. Remember, 5w20-5w30 (gen1/2/3), & 5w50 (boss/voodoo) has to slide through there.

I use the fatter oil. Fuel mileage is not an issue

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[shogun32]

Ford says .004" +/- .0005"

that's tip to mound clearance. Oil flows just fine thru spaces vastly smaller than that. But that's beside the point, that's NOT the pumping mechanism. The oil flow channel is the gap between the FLAT sides of the inner and outer gears and of the sealing face. The vacuum of the teeth opening up suck oil into the cavity and when the teeth are forced back closed it escapes into the gap between the different heights.

The gap between tip to mound is LEAKAGE. Ideally that clearance would approach zero but with 2 rotating assemblies each with their own slop around the center axis you would have to hold very, very good concentric precision to pull it off.

 

[ice445]

that's tip to mound clearance. Oil flows just fine thru spaces vastly smaller than that. But that's beside the point, that's NOT the pumping mechanism. The oil flow channel is the gap between the FLAT sides of the inner and outer gears and of the sealing face. The vacuum of the teeth opening up suck oil into the cavity and when the teeth are forced back closed it escapes into the gap between the different heights.

The gap between tip to mound is LEAKAGE. Ideally that clearance would approach zero but with 2 rotating assemblies each with their own slop around the center axis you would have to hold very, very good concentric precision to pull it off.

I thought the gears were powdered metal formed in a mold? Maybe the molds are worn out or the clearances are intentional?

 

[CJJon]

I thought the gears were powdered metal formed in a mold? Maybe the molds are worn out or the clearances are intentional?

Are they not machined (ground) to final tolerance?

 

[socketman]

Some more measurements , mitutoyo micrometer brand new.

 

[WildHorse]

that's NOT the pumping mechanism

Wut ? Sure looks like it too me.

 

[CJJon]

 

[larr12]

So we can say to stick with FP OPGs

 

[socketman]

So we can say to stick with FP OPGs

well thats an option but once we have TSS in hand i will know better. I cant understand how a complete pump from FP is 1100 and the gears only are 434 have not ready anything about the pump other than all specially assembled by OEM . must get paid well to put them together. Someone on the Edelbrock FB page had a used set of TSS for sale. Look rough to me but what do i know.

 

[larr12]

well thats an option but once we have TSS in hand i will know better. I cant understand how a complete pump from FP is 1100 and the gears only are 434 have not ready anything about the pump other than all specially assembled by OEM . must get paid well to put them together. Someone on the Edelbrock FB page had a used set of TSS for sale. Look rough to me but what do i know.

Agreed. That price on the oil pump is ridiculous.

 

[shogun32]

Wut ? Sure looks like it too me.

maybe I was imprecise. The sweep of the inner gear tooth across the face of the outer's peak acts as a valve, think reed valve. Very little oil flows thru that gap if the parts are made correctly. When the inner tooth starts to vacate the valley it creates a low pressure zone (suck). The oil slides over the top of the outer gear (purple surface) falls into the cavity, and then when the tooth begins to enter the cavity (blow) it forces the oil up and out and flows across the purple surface again to the exit.

 

[shogun32]

Livernois got back to me. " 4340 chromoly and are 50-55 Rockwell "
They ducked the question about case hardening.

 

[socketman]

Livernois got back to me. " 4340 chromoly and are 50-55 Rockwell "
They ducked the question about case hardening.

I spoke with the engineer at boundary and we discussed hardness and 2 different tests are necessary one is Rockwell C and the other is Vickers.Rockwell test the hardness to a deeper level and Vickers test the surface hardness. The pump and gears need to not be so hard as to break if a foreign object goes through the pump like a piece of wire from a buffing wheel. Older ford engines would twist the oil pump drive off. Its a real balancing act to be sure.Some say 50 or above is too hard . Hardness is not the only issue either, its the clearances which were just right out to lunch. I will have the ford gears and TSS test here soon. Sadly this is another Fedex failure story. The gears were picked up from L&M in PA on Tuesday at 5pm and were in Vancouver BC at 8am wednesday morning ,i paid the duty around 10am and they have been back and forth between Richmond BC and Vancouver twice and are now still sitting in Richmond. Aparently the package missed the truck/flight blah blah blah.

 

[ZPD]

So I just tested my unused Boundary OPG and below are the results. The tester is within calibration and was verified with a calibration block prior to the tests.

 

[socketman]

So I just tested my unused Boundary OPG and below are the results. The tester is within calibration and was verified with a calibration block prior to the tests.

Thats pretty much in line with what i have been told but maybe a hair low though the Vickers test tells a lot as well. MIne were HRC 26 on the gear in the middle which is the one that was shedding which is way to soft imho.

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