Let's talk about the C8 vs the GT500

[cib24]

Yes, and likely at supercar prices.

Well, possibly at 911 Turbo or McLaren 570S prices rather than 720S and GT2RS prices. Expensive for sure but the platform has a lot more headroom than the base C8 or Z51 package shows off.

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[ALUSA]

I m surprised Motortrend was only able to get 11.2 s out of the car. Looks like there is also a big difference in the handling department with the track pack car versus the regular car. Regular GT500 is more straight line focused versus the track pack gives both worlds.

Autoblog also must be out of their mind calling the GT500 performance bargain of the year, unless they are only considering a base GT500 with only straight line performance and spending MSRP. In reality a 1lt C8 with the Z51 package for 65 grand takes the cake for the performance bargain of the year award. Now the question is are we going to see a ZL1 1LE track shoot out versus a base GT500 or the 90 plus grand track pack version?

 

[shogun32]

are we going to see a ZL1 1LE track shoot out versus a base GT500 or the 90 plus grand track pack version?

Ideally both but based on "features" it should be against the CFTP, but based on price the 'base'. My guess the ZL1 will split the difference. It'll come very close to equaling the CFTP on interesting road circuits, but lose on DD comfort. Any comparison must necessarily be done on the same tires.

 

[millhouse]

I m surprised Motortrend was only able to get 11.2 s out of the car. Looks like there is also a big difference in the handling department with the track pack car versus the regular car. Regular GT500 is more straight line focused versus the track pack gives both worlds.

Autoblog also must be out of their mind calling the GT500 performance bargain of the year, unless they are only considering a base GT500 with only straight line performance and spending MSRP. In reality a 1lt C8 with the Z51 package for 65 grand takes the cake for the performance bargain of the year award. Now the question is are we going to see a ZL1 1LE track shoot out versus a base GT500 or the 90 plus grand track pack version?

From the way it sounds, the GT500 carbon package is quite a bit quicker (both at the track and strip) than the C8. The performance bargain aspect is likely in relation to much more expensive cars.

 

[Strokerswild]

Personally, having had a modded early-last-gen GT500, I'd still like to have the Z51/1LT C8. Something different, see, beyond the numbers.

I've always wanted a fast, mid-engined car, and it's the only game in town at that price point.

 

[Hack]

Oh they will. The Z06 and ZR1 will demolish everything except maybe a 720S and GT2RS.

I don't know. The current generation Corvette chassis had problems handling the big power with some reviewers calling it "unfinished" and even dangerous. It also had big problems with cooling at first in the bigger power models. Mid engines are notoriously difficult to cool. More difficult than a front engine car.

With the C8 being a brand new setup, and GM having difficulty getting the C7 exactly right on a familiar layout, I would say the jury is out.

Only real fan boys for GM are going to assume that this time on a brand new platform automatically the C8 Z06 and ZR1 will be perfect out of the gate.

 

[Mountain376]

I don't know. The current generation Corvette chassis had problems handling the big power with some reviewers calling it "unfinished" and even dangerous. It also had big problems with cooling at first in the bigger power models. Mid engines are notoriously difficult to cool. More difficult than a front engine car.

With the C8 being a brand new setup, and GM having difficulty getting the C7 exactly right on a familiar layout, I would say the jury is out.

Only real fan boys for GM are going to assume that this time on a brand new platform automatically the C8 Z06 and ZR1 will be perfect out of the gate.

You bring up an interesting point... as much as I want to see a '20 GT500 vs '20 ZL1 1LE (A10) (by the way "GT500 vs ZL1 1LE" sounds like a printer cartridge part number of a laptop serial number), I think a more interesting comparison would be '20 GT500 vs '19 ZR1!

Considering the C7 ZR1, which has a similar amount of power, also being supercharged, similar wheelbase and a FR (front engine, RWD) car to the GT500 is telling, none-the-less. Mind, you still have to consider things like vehicle weight and suspension design-direction priorities. One thing pointed out in one of the reviews I've read is it seems the [electronic] throttle control seems to be a very likely culprit from (with the Challenger being called out out-right!) in respect to how well the GT500 is to control.

If you understand why the C7 Z06 has heat issues (I'm saying why that issue even came to be) and you look at what was done with the ZL1 Camaro variants and what GM has clearly stated with C8 development, I would not have any worry in thermal management for the C8...

I'm not GM- Fanboy (but many will rush to label anyone who speaks in a positive light of and owns a GM product), but, rationally, knowing that the C8.R will have a close, if not nearly direct tie with whatever road-going C8 performance variants are to come, is a strong statement; especially coupled with what was done with C7 Corvette and C6 Camaro...

From over the fence, "Very good job, Ford!"

I'm honestly very impressed (and happy to hear) the positive remarks on the GT500's track manners. The only performance-related negative I am reading is the delay in respect to drag racing/launching. This is something that will [hopefully] just have to be accepted as it is a characteristic of a dual clutch. If they tune that out, you will get into clutch potential durability issue from tuning the clutch to drag on the flywheel - something Ford does on the Focus/Fiesta with questionable reliability concerns*....

*Cost and complexity in understanding how much drag and what that drag is doing to the clutch and/or flywheel over time.

 

[martinjlm]

You bring up an interesting point... as much as I want to see a '20 GT500 vs '20 ZL1 1LE (A10) (by the way "GT500 vs ZL1 1LE" sounds like a printer cartridge part number of a laptop serial number), I think a more interesting comparison would be '20 GT500 vs '19 ZR1!

Considering the C7 ZR1, which has a similar amount of power, also being supercharged, similar wheelbase and a FR (front engine, RWD) car to the GT500 is telling, none-the-less. Mind, you still have to consider things like vehicle weight and suspension design-direction priorities. One thing pointed out in one of the reviews I've read is it seems the [electronic] throttle control seems to be a very likely culprit from (with the Challenger being called out out-right!) in respect to how well the GT500 is to control.

If you understand why the C7 Z06 has heat issues (I'm saying why that issue even came to be) and you look at what was done with the ZL1 Camaro variants and what GM has clearly stated with C8 development, I would not have any worry in thermal management for the C8...

I'm not GM- Fanboy (but many will rush to label anyone who speaks in a positive light of and owns a GM product), but, rationally, knowing that the C8.R will have a close, if not nearly direct tie with whatever road-going C8 performance variants are to come, is a strong statement; especially coupled with what was done with C7 Corvette and C6 Camaro...

From over the fence, "Very good job, Ford!"

I'm honestly very impressed (and happy to hear) the positive remarks on the GT500's track manners. The only performance-related negative I am reading is the delay in respect to drag racing/launching. This is something that will [hopefully] just have to be accepted as it is a characteristic of a dual clutch. If they tune that out, you will get into clutch potential durability issue from tuning the clutch to drag on the flywheel - something Ford does on the Focus/Fiesta with questionable reliability concerns*....

*Cost and complexity in understanding how much drag and what that drag is doing to the clutch and/or flywheel over time.

When I was still at GM doing Competitor Intelligence, my assessment to the Camaro and Corvette teams was to expect the 2018 GT500 (this was late 2016...it had not been delayed yet) to come in right on top of the ZR1. Now, I was also telling them to expect a 5.2 - 5.4TT +10AT. You win some, you lose some.

 

[9secondko]

When I was still at GM doing Competitor Intelligence, my assessment to the Camaro and Corvette teams was to expect the 2018 GT500 (this was late 2016...it had not been delayed yet) to come in right on top of the ZR1. Now, I was also telling them to expect a 5.2 - 5.4TT +10AT. You win some, you lose some.

not a bad hypothesis. I was fully expecting the 5.2 TT to win out along with the 10 speed, with a long shot AWD tier.

that DCT though. I think it’s responsible for the new stratosphere the 500 is playing in. The 760 hp doesn’t hurt though.

 

[Mountain376]

not a bad hypothesis. I was fully expecting the 5.2 TT to win out along with the 10 speed, with a long shot AWD tier.

that DCT though. I think it’s responsible for the new stratosphere the 500 is playing in. The 760 hp doesn’t hurt though.

I disagree!

I think it is time and consideration that is making this car what it is turning out to be. The parts are cool and all, but the execution of synergy of all those capabilities is the key in this vehicle!

The GT500 was, from what can be gathered, delayed from when it was originally projected to be debuted.

BUT, this allowed Ford's competitors to show their cards and allow Ford more time in development to turn up a few notches. Not only did they turn up a few notches, but they do so in, what it seems, very well executive. The comments on the car's dynamic controls, power delivery, suspension balance and transmission performance clearly show this.

 

[9secondko]

I fully expect GM to come out swinging.

GM has been been swinging for the fences since 2016 (actually before then in development, but whatevs).

Ford is finally punching back with bad intentions. And landing.

 

[Hack]

GM has been been swinging for the fences since 2016 (actually before then in development, but whatevs).

Ford is finally punching back with bad intentions. And landing.

GT350 and R won most comparisons with GM's recent products. Mostly swinging and missing by GM. Good tries though.

 

[Mountain376]

GT350 and R won most comparisons with GM's recent products. Mostly swinging and missing by GM. Good tries though.

Most people must not be reading what you do I guess?

 

[gixxersixxerman]

I read in car and driver that the best mustang times are done on a “prepped” track. (I don’t think they were prepping our notoriously slippery LVMS but could be wrong) and that best is 10.7 and 3.3 0-60. Where as the C8 did it on their “clean pavement” at 11.1 and 2.8 0-60. C&D expect 3.3 and 11 flat respectively on “clean pavement”. I know to some that hypothetical tenth is an eternity. But on the “street” it may seem like a base 65k C8 will be able to hold its own against a GT500... of course I can’t wait to see what the GT500 does on a tire in east coast air.

do they make radials that fit the GT500. 315/20’s? Or are they going to have to compromise?

 

[DekiDoo]

Most people must not be reading what you do I guess?

Just so you know, according to him, if you point out something shitty about a Ford product that you own, you also have to point out something shitty about a GM product as well, otherwise you're a troll.

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