Then why are we all here, why are you here defending your brand against the competition? Do you work for Ford?
I'd say it's a smart move to sacrifice very small (in reality) amounts of real, quantitative performance in order to make cars that are much better to live with and as a result, more people want to buy. Could they have made the GT PP match the current SS? Yes. Could they have made the 15-18 GT350 easily best the SS 1LE vs being very close to it on track? Yes. Would they have added cost that was not of value to many of the customers who bought them? Yes (though less so for the GT350). It is about choices. Bragging rights over a lap, showroom stock are only worth so much, and Ford knows that most of the serious track rats modify the cars extensively and beyond what would be considered reasonable to sell anyway. I'll agree on the coolers thing on the PP2, those should absolutely be in, but otherwise I think they allocated the money smartly.
Would you rather cater to the 99% or 1%. As you can see the 1% will never be happy with anything and the critics/haters will always be just that. Do people who care only for profits want to dump money to updating and upgrading a model every single year so a few dozen people on a forum who live their lives a magazine 1/4 mile at a time can stroke their e cocks? Regardless which car is faster it doesn't really matter for most who buy the car and drive it around outside of a track.
This is a Ford Mustang enthusiast site is it not? The real question is, why are you here...as you're the one hyping up the competition.
GM is a bragging track whore, they have been for quite some time. They do everything they can to set record lap times so the magazines can eat them up. Ford doesn't intentionally showboat their products with lap times. They'll do some creative advertising from time to time, but they let the design and features speak for themselves. It's been working for 54 years, why change it.
Going to stop you right there. Yeah, a large portion wont. But I will tel you this: a lot, A LOT of track people have snapped up the new Camaro because it is such a good performance car, right out of the box. People from domestic and foreign cars alike. I have see a handful of 6G Camaros at nearly every single driving event I've been to since the car came out. So, although many people will not, and this is the same with nearly every car, there is a large amount that do; and those that do, I would guarantee you, if the Camaro didn't have the coolers, the transmission, the suspension, etc., that it does, a LARGE majority of those people that are tracking these cars, would NOT be in a Camaro. I wouldn't be. I would have kept my 2012 GT and just modified it more or bought some project car. So, no, I'm going to say you are wrong in a larger sense of what you say, enough to say that you are plain wrong; 1. there are many people I come across at car cruises and shows that never have been on track before and want to because they hear of what the car is capable of and 2. first timers at driving events that show up because #1, feeling comfortable to do so because they dont have to worry about their car breaking.
I will amen that. I am not totally new to tracking my cars. But until I got my Camaro I had only tracked Corvettes before. C4 and C5, so that was a long time ago. This Camaro is by far the most potent car I have ever tracked. One caveat....I have driven a number of GM and competitor cars in a track environment at GM Proving Grounds. These were, of course, NOT my own cars (drive it like you stole it
) and we teetered on the brink of pushing to the limits, but not abusing them. A very fine line. Since you don’t care how the mustang performs compared to the competition and seems like you hide behind the sales, i don’t see your value on the participation! For guys like you the cars are always ok the way they are but deep inside you are dying to see a mustang beat the competition on the track and testing. Its a versus thread there are other threads in this forum for other topics!
Fair enough, but a majority of sales for these cars don't come from people tracking their cars. It's great for the 1%, but a complete waste for everyone else. A "LOT" of track people is still a minuscule percentage of people who buy these cars.
This mustang happens to be my slowest of all that I've owned (by a wide margin). I (as well as most others) purchased the mustang knowing it's slower than the camaro. It looks better, has a better seating position, more trunk space, more leg and head room for the kiddos, better visibility etc. Quite honestly, if you don't like me in here you can GTFO (as I'm not going anywhere). Otherwise, sit back and enjoy the rhetoric.
Milan's fun, but I always ran better (and had far...far fewer crowds) at Stanton. It's of course in the middle of BFE, so not the most convenient location. Still, I recall hot-lapping 10+ runs a night at Stanton.I will amen that. I am not totally new to tracking my cars. But until I got my Camaro I had only tracked Corvettes before. C4 and C5, so that was a long time ago. This Camaro is by far the most potent car I have ever tracked. One caveat....I have driven a number of GM and competitor cars in a track environment at GM Proving Grounds. These were, of course, NOT my own cars (drive it like you stole it
Since I had a very good idea of what CA6 could take, i bought one and am very comfortable taking to the track. Weather permitting, our Camaro club will be spending the better part of the day tomorrow at Milan Dragway.
No, the performance delta between the two cars are not enough to choose and ugly car, over one that is sublime.
Just got back a while ago. We had to wait for the track to dry from some early morning rains. Ran a 12.8 @ 109 and a bunch of 12.9s @ 107. Also a couple 13+ when I didn’t control wheel spin. Not too bad for a bone stock vert. Gotta work on my 60’ though. Ewww!
Good deal. Solid runs in less than ideal conditions. :cheers:
Higher volume? The latest data available (2017 model year) shows 1,512 Camaro SS 1LE's were built. How many GT350's were built for model year 2017? And ZL1 1LE's are far rarer, just like the GT30R. As far as desirability...very subjective!
