SCCA CAM-C Thread

[Aluehrs11]

That is being targeted for the offseason.

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but other than saving a few thousand dollars, why bother with stock style struts? I'm surprised more people aren't running coilovers, especially if running in camc.

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[kz]

If you're not running gt500/machl/R dampers especially up front. Sell your kidney and get them

Do you have data on their damping force vs current ? And how that compares to "regular" MR dampers from GT PP / GT350 ?

 

[kz]

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but other than saving a few thousand dollars, why bother with stock style struts? I'm surprised more people aren't running coilovers, especially if running in camc.

Not a dumb question - but :

- Few thousand dollars you mentioned.
- You can convert front struts to coilovers fairly easily and run any spring you want, rear even easiler since it's a divorced spring
- Potential of the adaptive damping (taking advantage and whether there is real advantage over lest's say Penskes is a whole another story)

- Also - lowest hanging fruit is always the driver. At least in my case and in the appraach I've taken. Investing in the car can make it better (and easier to drive with lower skill) but most people will honestly still be where they are after spending $5k or $7k on good coilovers - at least in my opinion (which is what is keeping me from spending it).

 

[mavisky]

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but other than saving a few thousand dollars, why bother with stock style struts? I'm surprised more people aren't running coilovers, especially if running in camc.

Because the MR system is very capable and adaptable and I'd like to try and improve/retain that functionality. Also as mentioned you can easily convert to coilovers with infinite spring rate choices using either the AJ Hartman style solution or the Ground Control solution.

My frustration with the DSC unit is that there is really only 1 negative trait that's been identified with it and we're not able to determine how the system does what it claims to do in order to better understand if the issue is inherent to the system or if it's inherent to the tuning of the system.

I'd be concerned that it's just a "me" problem, but others have duplicated the issue too and I know that I can swap back to the factory magneride controller and while I take a decrease in capability of the system overall, it doesn't have the same issue with control over the front hitting a large swell in a straight line and getting "floaty".

 

[shogun32]

Do you have data on their damping force vs current ? And how that compares to "regular" MR dampers from GT PP / GT350 ?

I don't have the numbers, but TeeLew did! :(

From just seat of pants, and also Johnson whats-his-name that did that GT350R and Cup2 tuning (and blog) said the innate piston and fluid are by themselves more resistant/damped.

Anyone using PP1/PP2/GT350 dampers in anger (or even heated) needs to bin them and replace with the better units. It took me all of 10 minutes to tell the original spec dampers were inadequate.

 

[shogun32]

it doesn't have the same issue with control over the front hitting a large swell in a straight line and getting "floaty".

hmm, too much rebound not letting the wheels extend fast enough, and then maybe not enough rebound once the wheels have come back?

In the MR tuning there is a notion of a 'home' location. Sounds like to me when the displacement goes negative (extend from home) the algorithm is wrong or the values are amiss. But there isn't a set of tables for dealing when the shock is in 'negative' territory, right?

 

[mavisky]

hmm, too much rebound not letting the wheels extend fast enough, and then maybe not enough rebound once the wheels have come back?

In the MR tuning there is a notion of a 'home' location. Sounds like to me when the displacement goes negative (extend from home) the algorithm is wrong or the values are amiss. But there isn't a set of tables for dealing when the shock is in 'negative' territory, right?

It's more of a lack of compression and rebound control all around in these scenarios. Ive been able to somewhat tune it out by just throwing big voltages at it. The primary concern is trying to identify if this is an issue with the dampers or the DSC. The fact I don't see it with the factory VDM makes me feel like it might be a DSC issue and upgrading the dampers may not solve the issue completely. I will say though that all of those who've complained about the issue from my research seem to be GT350 owners and not GT350R or GT500 owners.

 

[kz]

My frustration with the DSC unit is that there is really only 1 negative trait that's been identified with it and we're not able to determine how the system does what it claims to do in order to better understand if the issue is inherent to the system or if it's inherent to the tuning of the system.

It's not just you - only original DSC calibration I'm running is the "Comfort" one since I sometimes drive to locals and don't want to lose teeth and any road bump results in bunch of oscillations like a car with completely not working dampers would have (not quite but same sort of movement).
I think they just bump the voltage up between Comfort, Sport and Track if I remember correctly.

 

[shogun32]

The primary concern is trying to identify if this is an issue with the dampers or the DSC. The fact I don't see it with the factory VDM makes me feel like it might be a DSC issue

agreed, it sure smells like a DSC issue. But the R/M1/500 damper upgrade is worthy on it's own. Even if it doesn't solve this issue.

 

[mavisky]

It's not just you - only original DSC calibration I'm running is the "Comfort" one since I sometimes drive to locals and don't want to lose teeth and any road bump results in bunch of oscillations like a car with completely not working dampers would have (not quite but same sort of movement).
I think they just bump the voltage up between Comfort, Sport and Track if I remember correctly.

Theres some additional changes but that's the majority of what changes. I've only been able to mitigate this oscillation by cranking up the base voltages and ditching the G-Comfort setting entirely.

 

[shogun32]

only original DSC calibration I'm running is the "Comfort" one since I sometimes drive to locals and don't want to lose teeth and any road bump results in bunch of oscillations like a car with completely not working dampers would have

wow, that's just embarrassing!

 

[kz]

Re : coilovers - if we count the cost of DSC, set of GT500 dampers, conversion kits for front and rear - total cost starts to approach the cost of decent set of coilovers (Magride delete has to be added to those though).

 

[mavisky]

Re : coilovers - if we count the cost of DSC, set of GT500 dampers, conversion kits for front and rear - total cost starts to approach the cost of decent set of coilovers (Magride delete has to be added to those though).

$3,600 for 4 GT500 dampers, ground control coilover kit, and DSC.

I'm not suggesting everyone follow this route, but it was obviously a progression for me.

MCS TT1 setup would be $4,100 + another $500 or so for the magneride deletes.

I know some friends who've moved to the MCS RR2 units.

MCS RR2 setup would be $6,000 + another $500 or so for the magneride deletes.

 

[tosha]

I'm tempted to try GT500 dampers in combination with Ford Performance provided tune from MR track package. Or would that simply be on par with GT350R stock calibration? Thoughts on this?

 

[shogun32]

(Magride delete has to be added to those though)

I've been meaning to ask, you can't just unplug the MR controller from the harness?

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