Remote tuning vs dyno and your experiences

[icecreamtruckz]

I am trying to figure out how to do the intake/lth/tune thing, and I’m seeing vastly different opinions in other threads I searched.

I see an option at Lethal to order a JLT and PBD tune. I’m guessing this includes a tuning device and baseline tune to get me started, and then I follow up with logs to refine.

Once I get headers, this tune will then need to be refined again. So should I just wait and do everything at once?

I live a few hours from Palm Beach. Would it be better to buy all the parts at once from them and ship the car down there? Or drive it down and leave it with them a few days?

Or should I get all the work done locally and go with Lund or Wengerd?

Seems like a waste to do the intake and tune, and then a few weeks later do headers and need a tune again.

If it was your 350, what would you do and what tuner would you recommend?

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[SheepDog]

1- @Wengerd Performance

2- An intake and headers do not really justify a dyno tune in my opinion. The email tune you get will be very good. The one advantage to a dyno tune is that you do not have to log on the street, meaning you don't have to find a place to go WOT in 3rd or 4th gear to redline.
The gains will mostly come from the tune anyway, and those parts alone will only provide a small portion of that increase.

3- you don't need to retune for the headers later.

4- the GT350 open intake is as good or better as any aftermarket one.

 

[icecreamtruckz]

1- @Wengerd Performance

2- An intake and headers do not really justify a dyno tune in my opinion. The email tune you get will be very good. The one advantage to a dyno tune is that you do not have to log on the street, meaning you don't have to find a place to go WOT in 3rd or 4th gear to redline.
The gains will mostly come from the tune anyway, and those parts alone will only provide a small portion of that increase.

3- you don't need to retune for the headers later.

4- the GT350 open intake is as good or better as any aftermarket one.

So just slap on the headers and buy from Wengerd? I have no issues with that. Saves me 400 bucks or whatever intakes cost at the moment.

I’m going whipple in the fall so I’m doing headers now to get it out of the way.

 

[SheepDog]

So just slap on the headers and buy from Wengerd? I have no issues with that. Saves me 400 bucks or whatever intakes cost at the moment.

I’m going whipple in the fall so I’m doing headers now to get it out of the way.

Or, don't bother with the headers and get an E85 tune which will provide much bigger bang for your buck than headers and intake combined. You still get a pump gas tune with it, so you can switch back and forth if E85 isn't readily available.

If you're going to install a Whipple, don't bother tuning right now at all. You can just install the headers and then tune once the blower is on.

 

[galaxy]

I see an option at Lethal to order a JLT and PBD tune. I’m guessing this includes a tuning device and baseline tune to get me started, and then I follow up with logs to refine.

Yes, that is the typical equipment and process.

Once I get headers, this tune will then need to be refined again. So should I just wait and do everything at once?

Yes. No. Do it increments if budget and interest dictate. Getting a tune revised for new components is easy and a small fee, if any at all.

I live a few hours from Palm Beach. Would it be better to buy all the parts at once from them and ship the car down there? Or drive it down and leave it with them a few days?

You do you, but I ain't shipping my car anywhere to get worked on, LOL. Enjoy doing the work myself. Do your own wrenching and get the remote files.

Or should I get all the work done locally and go with Lund or Wengerd?

I have a Lund car and a Wengerd car (the 350). Both are great, both run absolutely amazing. Wengerd was quite a bit more/better customer service. Darn near instant response time with tat guy; as if he doesn't have a life, lol.

Seems like a waste to do the intake and tune, and then a few weeks later do headers and need a tune again.

Not a waste. See previous response above. A revision for new parts from Deryl is probably pennies on the dollar.

If it was your 350, what would you do and what tuner would you recommend?

It is my 350 and I did do it. Read my experience here.

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/wengerd-tune-installed-review.204278/

Also some notes off the top; The jury strongly favored no intake for the 350. Save your money, I was recommended. Wengerd uses the TDN app (right off the app store) and the RTD3 device that plugs in the OBD port and connects to the phone via bluetooth. Mine has worked great. I did get an E85 tune, yes. Have not dialed it in yet as winter and opportunity set in before I could get my gas and get to it. It's pretty much a novelty and very impractical if you don't have good E85 readily available, but it's gonna be fun to play with either way.

 

[icecreamtruckz]

Yes, that is the typical equipment and process.



Yes. No. Do it increments if budget and interest dictate. Getting a tune revised for new components is easy and a small fee, if any at all.



You do you, but I ain't shipping my car anywhere to get worked on, LOL. Enjoy doing the work myself. Do your own wrenching and get the remote files.



I have a Lund car and a Wengerd car (the 350). Both are great, both run absolutely amazing. Wengerd was quite a bit more/better customer service. Darn near instant response time with tat guy; as if he doesn't have a life, lol.



Not a waste. See previous response above. A revision for new parts from Deryl is probably pennies on the dollar.



It is my 350 and I did do it. Read my experience here.

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/wengerd-tune-installed-review.204278/

Also some notes off the top; The jury strongly favored no intake for the 350. Save your money, I was recommended. Wengerd uses the TDN app (right off the app store) and the RTD3 device that plugs in the OBD port and connects to the phone via bluetooth. Mine has worked great. I did get an E85 tune, yes. Have not dialed it in yet as winter and opportunity set in before I could get my gas and get to it. It's pretty much a novelty and very impractical if you don't have good E85 readily available, but it's gonna be fun to play with either way.

I live in a condo and don’t have a place to work on the car. Anything larger than simple bolt one like an intake is not possible. I read the install directions for headers and there is no way that’s gonna happen in my parking lot. Sadly it also precludes ordering a barrel of e85. I wish we had some close, I already checked. I live in a bubble apparently. The city 30 miles away has dozens of them, we have zero.

What we do have is race gas at the pump. Sunoco 260 GT is available about 9 miles away. I am pondering getting a map for that. I can do 9 miles for gas. 30 is just completely impractical.

 

[Pistol_91]

Theres not much difference now days unless you're boosted. Then the dyno matters a bit more.

 

[galaxy]

…or you just wanna see your numbers.

 

[S550HPP]

I am trying to figure out how to do the intake/lth/tune thing, and I’m seeing vastly different opinions in other threads I searched.

I see an option at Lethal to order a JLT and PBD tune. I’m guessing this includes a tuning device and baseline tune to get me started, and then I follow up with logs to refine.

Once I get headers, this tune will then need to be refined again. So should I just wait and do everything at once?

I live a few hours from Palm Beach. Would it be better to buy all the parts at once from them and ship the car down there? Or drive it down and leave it with them a few days?

Or should I get all the work done locally and go with Lund or Wengerd?

Seems like a waste to do the intake and tune, and then a few weeks later do headers and need a tune again.

If it was your 350, what would you do and what tuner would you recommend?

Unless you can find a dyno facility that has massive airflow replicating volume, velocity and temp of driving down the road it's a waste because everything heats up after first pull and ECU adapts accordingly to the overheat.

These dyno facilities are rare and costly.

 

[robvas]

Dyno tune also involves:

Paying extra to the tuner if you use a remote tuner (usually)
Paying for dyno time
Trying to schedule that shit

 

[Gregory347]

These cars are noisy on cold start with headers and especially with ffe… something to consider if you live in a condo…

 

[icecreamtruckz]

These cars are noisy on cold start with headers and especially with ffe… something to consider if you live in a condo…

I would feel bad, but there’s a guy down at the end of building with an old Camaro that has cams and cherry bombers, and a guy on the other end with 2 Harley’s. I work from home, so I go days without driving the car. Not like I leave at 6am every day. I will let the Camaro guy take the heat.

Sounds amazing to me. It’s got big block type sound, loping and chunky. If I put my hand on the window I can feel the vibration that beast is putting out. I haven’t talked to him yet, I’m dying to know what he has in there. It’s got a roll cage, bucket seats, and a tubbed rear end and the guy drives the thing almost daily. He’s been here for years, if the neighbors gonna hate, it’s gonna be on him.

 

[junits15]

The conventional wisdom used to be you needed a dyno tune because cars didn't have wideband O2 sensors built in. So the tuner would connect a wideband to your tailpipe and that let them safely tune fuel at WOT. The WOT condition is outside of the measurement range of a narrowband O2 sensor. So the tuner needed the auxiliary wideband at the tailpipe to ensure the mixture is right at WOT. On an S550 the factory widebands can measure the mixture at WOT, meaning you don't need that external sensor at the tailpipe. The tuner just tells the car what mixture to go to and it goes there.

So the major advantage to a dyno tune is just not having to do pulls on the road. If you live in the middle of nowhere with long flat roads, where you can safely do pulls over and over there isn't much need for a dyno tune.

All of this means: A canned tuned is more than adequate for your application, you likely will not even need revisions. It would be good to try and get one tune after you do all of your desired mods, but it isn't required for anything other than the intake. The headers don't require a tune change.

 

[galaxy]

@icecreamtruckz I have a feeling you may know this, but just for expectation management - your car with sound absolutely NOTHING like that Camaro once you're done. If you go no cats, no resonators or any combo like that, it'll be obnoxiously loud for no good reason. Long tubes on this car take some effort to sound great AND loud; some type of cat, resonators, quality muffler, or combo there of, etc.

 

[junits15]

Yeah headers and a factory exhaust is already going to be louder than the vast majority of cars on the road.

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