Pre-collision alert went off, nothing there

[wynand32]

Well, in that case they're the kind of drivers I was talking about, who should not be driving in the first place. This system is made for them. If the system acts on their behalf and saves them (and me), then they should turn in their driving licence right there and then. That's not a mistake that could happen to anyone. That's pure stupidity and lack of driving skills, and there's no excuse for it.
Having it myself in my car would not make any difference.

I'm curious: did you say your system that's throwing so many false positives has been checked? Because as far as I can tell, that's the cost you're talking about.

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[wynand32]

Perfect response to a lame brain post. So many idiots floating around it's almost hard to log in to the Mustang forum.

It is starting to read like the garage urinal, 30% knowledge 70% Karren's afraid of their own shadows..

I ask myself who dresses these people each morning?

Pure ad hominem drivel. And I'd like to know who put a gun to your head and forced you into this thread. That person should be banned for life.

 

[wynand32]

Sure. But nobody said they should lack any kind of safety gear completely. We're only discussing a particular one.
Most safety devices don't interfere with your normal driving and do not hinder or annoy you in any way. This one does. That's my problem. If it worked properly and only triggered when absolutely necessary, and I didn't even know I had it until then, then I would be fine with it.

This is the comment I should have responded to in asking whether your system has been evaluated for errors. Nobody else has said that they're having even close to your experience, so it sure does seem to me like your system is broken.

I hope you understand that everyone else who's in favor of the system is speaking from the perspective that it's not causing the same issues as you're experiencing. I disagree that such a system should be required. I'm only arguing against the idea that someone is a bad driver or a "Karen" (god, I hate that lazy word) or whatever because they like having the system in place.

 

[Rapid Red]

Pure ad hominem drivel. And I'd like to know who put a gun to your head and forced you into this thread. That person should be banned for life.

And yours is not, scared of your own shadow we are? That sounds like a personal problem.

Shiver me timbers,
TUFF guy on a keyboard, a pussy face to face I'm betting.

 

[wynand32]

And yours is not, scared of your own shadow we are? That sounds like a personal problem.

Shiver me timbers,
TUFF guy on a keyboard, a pussy face to face I'm betting.

If I'm not mistaken, you're the one who came into this thread and insulted people for no apparent reason other than that they disagree with you about the value of a safety system. And that's after mischaracterizing their positions (unsurprisingly).

I do wonder if you'd take the same attitude in a face-to-face discussion, and if so, I wonder why. Someone who's confident in their intellectual position doesn't typically feel the need to get violent when discussing differences of opinion.

 

[Vlad Soare]

I'm curious: did you say your system that's throwing so many false positives has been checked? Because as far as I can tell, that's the cost you're talking about.

No, because I didn't (and still don't) think it was defective. I think it was working precisely as it had been designed to work.
That's because it never triggered for no reason at all (I mean, due to leaves, bugs or the like). Every time it triggered it had a seemingly valid reason (i.e. another car, or a pedestrian). It's just that that reason was far enough away not to concern me. Sometimes it braked because someone from the oncoming lane was turning left (thus crossing my way). But they were far enough, and were moving fast enough, for me to know for sure that they would clear the way long before I got there. The car always acted as if it didn't trust me, as if it thought I was slow-thinking and had the reactions of a snail.
Besides, after selling that car and getting the Mustang, I kept getting unwarranted alerts (though it didn't brake by itself as often and hard as the other car, which may be due to the software having got more refined in the meantime). This indicates it wasn't a defect per se, it wasn't something a dealer could fix.

Was it because of my driving style? Perhaps. But you see, that's the point - I don't need a computer to tell me how my driving style should be. I want it to adapt to me and to my style, not the other way around. My driving style isn't dangerous - If I were to give a lift to any of you on this forum, I'm willing to bet my salary for one year that none of you would ever feel unsafe for one second. I don't drive dangerously, but I do drive spiritedly and I know the limits of my reflexes. The car doesn't. The car is programmed for the lowest common denominator. That makes it annoying.

 

[blitzburgh]

I'm not getting into your 3rd grade level tough guy internet shit talking, I just wanted to point out mine goes off from time to time on twisty roads with parked cars.

 

[Vlad Soare]

I disagree that such a system should be required.

I'm only arguing against the idea that someone is a bad driver or a "Karen" (god, I hate that lazy word) or whatever because they like having the system in place.

No, not because they like having it. I've nothing against that. I'm glad this system exists. It's good to have choices. If you feel safer with it, or you just want to have it as an extra insurance, just in case, there's no reason not to get it.
I'm just against the idea that we must all have it from now on, and that we can't be safe anymore without it. An idea which wasn't expressed by you, so all my comments above that tried to combat it weren't directed at you.

 

[wynand32]

No, because I didn't (and still don't) think it was defective. I think it was working precisely as it had been designed to work.
That's because it never triggered for no reason at all (I mean, due to leaves, bugs or the like). Every time it triggered it had a seemingly valid reason (i.e. another car, or a pedestrian). It's just that that reason was far enough away not to concern me. Sometimes it braked because someone from the oncoming lane was turning left (thus crossing my way). But they were far enough, and were moving fast enough, for me to know for sure that they would clear the way long before I got there. The car always acted as if it didn't trust me, as if it thought I was slow-thinking and had the reactions of a snail.
Besides, after selling that car and getting the Mustang, I kept getting unwarranted alerts (though it didn't brake by itself as often and hard as the other car, which may be due to the software having got more refined in the meantime). This indicates it wasn't a defect per se, it wasn't something a dealer could fix.

Was it because of my driving style? Perhaps. But you see, that's the point - I don't need a computer to tell me how my driving style should be. I want it to adapt to me and to my style, not the other way around. My driving style isn't dangerous - If I were to give a lift to any of you on this forum, I'm willing to bet my salary for one year that none of you would ever feel unsafe for one second. I don't drive dangerously, but I do drive spiritedly and I know the limits of my reflexes. The car doesn't. The car is programmed for the lowest common denominator. That makes it annoying.

I think it was established earlier in the thread that you can turn down the sensitivity. Have you tried that?

After all, It's just math and physics, with the system merely measuring things like distance and closing velocity to determine whether an alert should be issued (and, at the extreme, if braking should be applied). I don't think it's based on a personal evaluation of one's driving abilities, but I'm sure there are some assumptions being made about the average person's reflexes and ability to stop on time. As an average, that certainly means that some people are quicker and some are slower.

If adjusting the sensitivity doesn't help, then I'm not sure what to say. As I hope I've made clear, I don't think such systems should be required by law. I believe in a free society with all the inherent risks that entails.

Personally, I find the system fascinating. I have the display set to show the system's evaluation of my distance from the car ahead of me, and it's often in the red. So, while I'm not close enough to trigger the alert, I'm closer than the system thinks is safe. And yet in those instances, I don't feel like I'm too close at the given speeds. Mostly that happens in 45MPH zones as opposed to highway speeds. If I'm honest with myself, I do have to recognize that the system might very well be correct at least some of the time, and that it knows the car's braking distance better than I do.

 

[Strokerswild]

My F150 has the feature, the exact reaction of which I did not know until recently when I was accelerating onto a highway on-ramp. A large bird (a pheasant, perhaps) flew across directly in front of the windshield roughly even with the front of the truck, triggering it. The alert scared the living hell out of me honestly (much more so than the bird) and might have even been the cause of an incident in the case of the same scenario with an inexperienced driver.

Not a fan. I've adjusted sensitivity, but I'd prefer if I could just shut it off altogether.

 

[Michael_vroomvroom]

I'm not getting into your 3rd grade level tough guy internet shit talking, I just wanted to point out mine goes off from time to time on twisty roads with parked cars.

Indeed, the most common cause for me seems to be when I'm turning according to the lane (following the lane on a two-lane road with another car in the lane next to me, really close, but also turning. If the car next to me were not also turning, it would look like I'd be ramming straight into that car. Presumably the system is not yet intelligent enough to understand that since we are both turning, there will be no collision. Not something that's easy to program I suspect.

Something similar, but more simplistic, is probably the case with twisty roads and cars parked; at some point in the turn it will look like you're heading into the parked car, if the system does not adequately take into account the wheel position.

 

[Vlad Soare]

I think it was established earlier in the thread that you can turn down the sensitivity. Have you tried that?

Yes, that was the first thing I did. Everything I said happened with the sensitivity set to low.

I'm sure there are some assumptions being made about the average person's reflexes and ability to stop on time. As an average, that certainly means that some people are quicker and some are slower.

Yes, it's most likely based on an average. And if the average it's based on happens to be lower than your own abilities, then it gets annoying.
Mind you, I know I'm not statistically relevant. I am hot-blooded, fast to react, everything I do, I do very fast, and I have no patience whatsoever with people or things that are slower than I am. If the person in front of me at an ATM, for instance, needs more than twenty seconds to withdraw the money and leave, I feel my blood starting to boil. I feel like pushing them aside and saying "move over, I will do it for you, otherwise we'll still be here next week". I think fast and act fast. This isn't necessarily a good thing (quite the contrary), but that's how I am, and there's nothing I can do about it.
This is why I get annoyed when someone (or something, in this case) treats me as if I were slower. And incidentally it's why most of my posts are so passionate in style, which may give one the impression that I'm always grumpy and/or angry. I'm not.
It's just that I value my freedom more than anything in the world, even more than my life. And I love cars with a passion. I live for cars, I live for driving, I dread the moment when I won't be able to drive anymore. Cars are my air. So, any system that attacks both of my core values at the same time is bound to make me mad.

As I hope I've made clear, I don't think such systems should be required by law. I believe in a free society with all the inherent risks that entails.

 

[wynand32]

Something similar, but more simplistic, is probably the case with twisty roads and cars parked; at some point in the turn it will look like you're heading into the parked car, if the system does not adequately take into account the wheel position.

I think this is exactly what happened in my case. There was a car parked on the side of the road right as I started into a turn. We have a lot of kids in my neighborhood and so I try to keep it under 25MPH, but in the Mustang I sometimes find myself closer to 30MPH. In this case, that was probably fast enough to make the system give me a warning.

In this case, I actually don't mind the warning because I've had kids run out in front of me between parked cars before. I'll take any amount of annoyance if it means avoiding hitting a kid because I'm going a little bit too fast.

 

[Michael_vroomvroom]

Yes, it's most likely based on an average. And if the average it's based on happens to be lower than your own abilities, then it gets annoying.
Mind you, I know I'm not statistically relevant. I am hot-blooded, fast to react, everything I do, I do very fast, and I have no patience whatsoever with people who are slower than I am. If the person in front of me at an ATM, for instance, needs more than twenty seconds to withdraw the money and leave, I feel my blood starting to boil. I feel like pushing them aside and saying "move over, I will do it for you, otherwise we'll still be here next week". I think fast and act fast. This isn't necessarily a good thing (quite the contrary), but that's how I am, and there's nothing I can do about it.

Are you one of those drivers in small cars making ugly noises who are veering in and out of lanes all the time, aggressively passing people in roundabouts at the most unexpected time? Suddenly popping up by my side as a jack in box? Except your car is not small and does not make ugly noises? ;-)

No wonder your alarm goes off all the time then. I'm suspect 90% of my alarms have been when I'm in a hurry and trying to save every second I can, so that at the end, I arrive at 20:00, rather than 20:01. Whee, 60 seconds saved. It's fun, especially on a motorbike, but also with a much greater risk of accidents I'm sure. Not necessarily because of me, because when driving like that I am of course also more alert and responsive than normal, but because it's different from how everyone around me is driving.

PS. When on the track, after both the car and I have warmed up and familiarised ourselves with the track somewhat, I switch the drive mode to "track". In addition to partially disabling traction control, this, anecdotally, also disables various other features it seems some in this thread find annoying. Including pre-collision alerts and lane assist. You can in addition also push up the trac-control switch for some seconds to completely disable traction control. For the ultimate freedom. ;-)

Perhaps this driving mode is more suitable to some here? No? May the lord hold a protective hand over the other drivers on the same road though.

 

[Vlad Soare]

Are you one of those drivers in small cars making ugly noises who are veering in and out of lanes all the time, aggressively passing people in roundabouts at the most unexpected time? Suddenly popping up by my side as a jack in box? Except your car is not small and does not make ugly noises? ;-)

Nope. That's not me.

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