PP1 VS BASE GT BRAKES...

[Latinsen]

I have a chance to snag some pp1 front brake calipers with hawk pads used. im wondering if this would be a good brake upgrade from my 4 piston caliper and brake pads. I occasionally go to the track but more so spirited driving. Also in case someone pulls out in front of me or i need to do an emergency braking, which one would perform better? i think for my car I would just need to buy the dust shield,rotors, and maybe new brake lines for the front pp1 brakes? after some spirited driving i don't feel confident in my brakes so much that if i hold the brake pedal, i can feel my brakes cooking. what are your thoughts? should i bite the bullet and get the front pp1 brake calipers or stick with the base 4 piston calipers?

Sponsored

 

[I Bleed Ford Blue]

Upgrading to the PP1 calipers is a simple bolt on. All you need is the new rotor, pads, dust shield, and new crush washers. By the time you piece together everything you need, you might be better off just buying the kit.

https://lmr.com/item/LRS-32120K/mustang-ford-oe-6-piston-brake-kit-2015-2020

The stock 4 pot GT brakes are fine for street use, but the 6 pot brembos have much better fade resistance and will give you a lot confidence in your brakes for some occasional spirited driving.

 

[GrabberBargeCaptain]

^ That's cheaper than I thought it would be.

 

[Need4SpeedMotors]

I have a chance to snag some pp1 front brake calipers with hawk pads used. im wondering if this would be a good brake upgrade from my 4 piston caliper and brake pads. I occasionally go to the track but more so spirited driving. Also in case someone pulls out in front of me or i need to do an emergency braking, which one would perform better? i think for my car I would just need to buy the dust shield,rotors, and maybe new brake lines for the front pp1 brakes? after some spirited driving i don't feel confident in my brakes so much that if i hold the brake pedal, i can feel my brakes cooking. what are your thoughts? should i bite the bullet and get the front pp1 brake calipers or stick with the base 4 piston calipers?

Hey this is Junior from N4Sm. The PP1 Brembos are a nice upgrade, I had the same 4 piston calipers on my car and did the swap. You should be able to get a good deal on a used pair I see them for sale all the time. Since I was already going to have to bleed the brakes I purchased the Steeda steel braided brakes lines and Powerstop ceramic pads. The brakes feel great and the ceramic pads don't dust all that much. The oem pads are horrible with brake dust.

 

[2morrow]

If you get the calipers, you'll need the rotors. You'll love the upgrade too.

If your interested I have a pair ready to rock. They just got turned 2 days ago.

 

[paulm1]

If you are tracking the car i think brake cooling is probably more important than upgrading the calipers/rotors. Once things get hot i dont care how many pistons the calipers have, boiled brake fluid will not stop the car.

 

[Oakley]

its kinda nuts how good these brakes are so yeah i'd say they're worth it. plus you can sell your old GT brakes to a EB guy and make some dollars back. everybody wins.

 

[2morrow]

If you are tracking the car i think brake cooling is probably more important than upgrading the calipers/rotors. Once things get hot i dont care how many pistons the calipers have, boiled brake fluid will not stop the car.

Yes and no. Cooling the rotors is critical but the OEM 4 piston design is lacking in the cooling dept.

A lot of people that track s550's upgrade to the 6 piston due to that factor. Research cooling vains for 4 piston rotors and you'll be surprised.

https://www.vorshlag.com/forums/for...0-brakes-uses-limitaitons-and-upgrade-options

OP: Don't forget high quality fluid. There are several great options on the market.

 

[paulm1]

Yes and no. Cooling the rotors is critical but the OEM 4 piston design is lacking in the cooling dept.

A lot of people that track s550's upgrade to the 6 piston due to that factor. Research cooling vains for 4 piston rotors and you'll be surprised.

https://www.vorshlag.com/forums/for...0-brakes-uses-limitaitons-and-upgrade-options

OP: Don't forget high quality fluid. There are several great options on the market.

The PP1 has brake cooling built into the belly pan. Without it I think hard track use would boil the stock fluid pretty quick 6 piston or 4. I have a '21 base GT and cooked the brakes on my first track night at pocono. Kenny Brown makes a great kit for the s550, I never had a problem after that with the 4 piston & fluid upgrade. I did upgrade the calipers this year for better stopping power but this is a heavy car, you need brake cooling in the front if you push hard at the track.

 

[ice445]

Definitely worth. Stopping power won't be noticeably different (this is more of a tire thing above a certain level of brake), but fade resistance and endurance is in another league. If you only street drive the base brakes are fine, but if you track its 100000% worth

 

[K4fxd]

It's a cooling issue. The 6 pots are very good but they are heavy. My solution was to get 2 piece rotors for the 4 pot calipers and add cooling. This so far has been plenty. Not only do I have brakes that do not fade in a 20 min session I lost 20 or so pounds from the front compared to the stock rotors.

The 23 4 pot rotors are properly cooled so all you would need to do is get a set of 23 4 pot rotors and cut an opening in the rock guard for better cooling. Adding a cooling duct will make this almost as good as the 6 pots.

If you do the 6 pots you will still need to add a cooling duct if you track with any speed.

 

[Hack]

Stopping distance on the street in a modern Mustang is ENTIRELY a function of tire grip. Ford did not put brakes on ANY modern Mustang that will get hot before they can stop you from any street legal speed a single time or a few times in a row even. And 20-40 MPH over a street legal speed - same thing. If you want the car to stop in a shorter distance on the street, get better tires.

Also, if you are engaging the antilocks during braking on the street in normal traffic I would encourage you to watch the rear view mirror first, because the Mustang will outstop a lot of vehicles on the road today.

Track use is entirely different than anything that happens on the street. You are limit braking on every corner and then flooring it when you exit the corner and then limit braking again. You will never do this on the street, no matter how "spirited" you feel. The only reason most people can even achieve this on a track is because there are braking markers and you repeat the same corners over and over until you figure out and memorize the locations where your braking points are. Otherwise, you are going to leave some safety margin.

Now I think I know this stuff, but maybe I'm wrong and the PP1 brakes will help you. Are you smelling the brake pads burning during your drive? Are you pushing hard on the brake pedal and not getting the car to stop well? If so, then the PP1 brakes might help you. I would be really surprised, though.

Now if you just WANT better brakes, I totally get it. I really want to buy the GT350 brake kit, because the brakes on that car are SUPERB. I never noticed a difference in feel between base and PP1 GT brakes, though. Frankly I would recommend if you want better brakes, just go straight to GT350 brakes or something aftermarket.

Edit: just to be clear, the GT350 brakes won't shorten your stopping distances on the street either. To do that, you still need wider or stickier tires. But they have much better FEEL than base or PP1 GT brakes.

 

[K4fxd]

But they have much better FEEL than base or PP1 GT brakes.

90% of the feel is due to the 2 piece rotors.

 

[Latinsen]

Stopping distance on the street in a modern Mustang is ENTIRELY a function of tire grip. Ford did not put brakes on ANY modern Mustang that will get hot before they can stop you from any street legal speed a single time or a few times in a row even. And 20-40 MPH over a street legal speed - same thing. If you want the car to stop in a shorter distance on the street, get better tires.

Also, if you are engaging the antilocks during braking on the street in normal traffic I would encourage you to watch the rear view mirror first, because the Mustang will outstop a lot of vehicles on the road today.

Track use is entirely different than anything that happens on the street. You are limit braking on every corner and then flooring it when you exit the corner and then limit braking again. You will never do this on the street, no matter how "spirited" you feel. The only reason most people can even achieve this on a track is because there are braking markers and you repeat the same corners over and over until you figure out and memorize the locations where your braking points are. Otherwise, you are going to leave some safety margin.

Now I think I know this stuff, but maybe I'm wrong and the PP1 brakes will help you. Are you smelling the brake pads burning during your drive? Are you pushing hard on the brake pedal and not getting the car to stop well? If so, then the PP1 brakes might help you. I would be really surprised, though.

Now if you just WANT better brakes, I totally get it. I really want to buy the GT350 brake kit, because the brakes on that car are SUPERB. I never noticed a difference in feel between base and PP1 GT brakes, though. Frankly I would recommend if you want better brakes, just go straight to GT350 brakes or something aftermarket.

Edit: just to be clear, the GT350 brakes won't shorten your stopping distances on the street either. To do that, you still need wider or stickier tires. But they have much better FEEL than base or PP1 GT brakes.

let's just say after doing a pull, im having to pump my brake pedal because if im holding it, you can feel them getting getting cooked. I hear a groaning noise but no steering wheel shake. theres been a couple of close calls where I do have to pump the brakes because holding them feels like i wont be able to stop. i don't smell brake pads but I know for sure I'm creating heat spots. even at the 1/8 mile after finishing the run, i still have to pump. i know I probably should just do fluid, pads, and rotors but I feel like I would have more confidence with a larger brake surface area and pads. I'm probably overthinking this brake situation...

 

[Latinsen]

let's just say after doing a pull, im having to pump my brake pedal because if im holding it, you can feel them getting getting cooked. I hear a groaning noise but no steering wheel shake. theres been a couple of close calls where I do have to pump the brakes because holding them feels like i wont be able to stop. i don't smell brake pads but I know for sure I'm creating heat spots. even at the 1/8 mile after finishing the run, i still have to pump. i know I probably should just do fluid, pads, and rotors but I feel like I would have more confidence with a larger brake surface area and pads. I'm probably overthinking this brake situation...

just as a note, the car has 39k miles and the brake pads still have a lot of life in them. I would say the measurement is about 7mm. again the rotors have heat spots and im hearing they don't have great cooling which then makes sense. Yet i know someone that has the same spec as mine a base gt but it's a 2021. IM SURE he drives his car hard often. When i drove his 21, i duplicated the same driving conditions and found his to have a normal brake feel.

Sponsored