How does this keep happening

[gimmie11s]

x100!

busted ring lands are usually from ring gaps set too tight. Loosen them up while the motor is apart.

Also buy some ARP head studs.

Truthfully, I'd also slam a set of forged pistons on the stock rods and go after it.

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[Notagain]

This thread makes my head hurt with all the random guessing.

He have a few nutcases on the forum that "claim" meh 1k whp + thats no big deal and itll do it daily on a stock block no problem then we have threads like this LOL!

 

[bluebeastsrt]

This thread makes my head hurt with all the random guessing.

He have a few nutcases on the forum that "claim" meh 1k whp + thats no big deal and itll do it daily on a stock block no problem then we have threads like this LOL!

Guesses are about all you can expect. Without having the dead engine sitting in front of us. Watching the mechanic assemble the new engine. (Not all mechanics are created equal) And observing the OPs driving habits.

 

[Nuked]

Boost a Pump functioning/wired properly?

 

[torino501]

Need to soften the chambers too while your building the new short block. we see a few ring land failures. all on Roush blown F-150, usually they are 4x4's lifted big 35's with a 2' ball min the receiver hitch. rarely any mustangs. they tend to run out of road, or just quick sprints here and there. but a blow in a truck and use it like a superduty is just asking for a blow engine.

 

[ahl395]

If you are rebuilding the engine again, do not put a stock motor back in. You have forced induction and if you're spending all the money on these repairs, build the engine properly with the right parts. Forged internals, proper ring gaps for FI, and head studs.

Rings are often too tight from the factory for FI which will cause them to fail with the extra heat caused by FI. Tune, bad gas, too much boost or timing could all have caused the failure.

A wastegate "torque booster" bleeds off boost over your chosen psi. It spins the blower faster for more boost than intended, more boost means more heat in the air charge. You bleed this out before the intercooler cools the intake air, but the residual heat is there. There is no way in hell that would have anything to do with the failure however. I have an aggressively wastegated centri and my IATs raised 20 degrees from it. That's no different than driving on a 20 degree warmer day. Also, the tune will pull timing over a certain IAT for this reason, to protect the motor. Usually that is 130ish.

Now, the wastegate failing and not opening, causing you to overboost and detonate, is unlikely but possible. You would have seen your boost controller go into overboost shutdown if it was set up properly. How much boost will your pulley make if it was not wastegated?

Tune is unlikely because it's Lund, but you should post a datalog here.

Heat will cause this but at your boost levels, wategate or not, that wouldn't be an issue. E85 or meth injection will help heat however. This is one of the main reasons I went meth injection on my car, to save the rings from failing eventually.

 

[robmustang201528]

Yes boost a pump wired properly

 

[robmustang201528]

If you are rebuilding the engine again, do not put a stock motor back in. You have forced induction and if you're spending all the money on these repairs, build the engine properly with the right parts. Forged internals, proper ring gaps for FI, and head studs.

Rings are often too tight from the factory for FI which will cause them to fail with the extra heat caused by FI. Tune, bad gas, too much boost or timing could all have caused the failure.

A wastegate "torque booster" bleeds off boost over your chosen psi. It spins the blower faster for more boost than intended, more boost means more heat in the air charge. You bleed this out before the intercooler cools the intake air, but the residual heat is there. There is no way in hell that would have anything to do with the failure however. I have an aggressively wastegated centri and my IATs raised 20 degrees from it. That's no different than driving on a 20 degree warmer day. Also, the tune will pull timing over a certain IAT for this reason, to protect the motor. Usually that is 130ish.

Now, the wastegate failing and not opening, causing you to overboost and detonate, is unlikely but possible. You would have seen your boost controller go into overboost shutdown if it was set up properly. How much boost will your pulley make if it was not wastegated?

Tune is unlikely because it's Lund, but you should post a datalog here.

Heat will cause this but at your boost levels, wategate or not, that wouldn't be an issue. E85 or meth injection will help heat however. This is one of the main reasons I went meth injection on my car, to save the rings from failing eventually.

I wish i could afford to buy a built motor but with all the money I've spent and the information I know now I should've bought a built motor. I k ow guys with built motors that have blown up, I know guys with the stock motor with twins running high 8s low 9s without any issues. I talk to people, read the forms, and there are guys making a 700+ HP on the stock block and I do a simple setup with a reputable tunner running low boost and I'm having the same major issue twice!! I see alot of people on the form saying the torque booster generates heat... yes I agree but damn... enough heat to crack rings on 10lbs after 4 or 5 hits on the street? I need to get a copy of the logs and post them. I don't know the timing the car was set too but I'm sure lund didn't go crazy on the timing. Car never overboosted, if it did anything it would loose boost at high rpm. It would never get to 10 lbs and hold it. I'd have my foot to the floor, rpms climbing boost dropping. Might have something to do with the boost controller or the tune not 100 percent sure. I'm not here to bash anybody but I don't think it was a defect I don't think it's the torque booster, fuel or spark I'm thinking its the tune. I'm going to have lund re tune it because I already paid for it. I don't want to keep bouncing from tunner to tunner spending a bunch of money. These guys do this all the time. Their a reputable company they will figure it out. My question is should I have lund tune on a dyno or should I have it street tuned again? Thanks to everybody who is trying to help

 

[RaceHorseV8]

Not offering an actual fix but I think you are on the right track by using as much data as possible. Data logs, etc. Tell Lund that you need a special case opened so they scour the logs carefully. I've been in the business of mechanical failure(not FI Ford engines) and in my experience 2 identical failures in such a short period of time is VERY unlikely without a specific cause. Unless a high probability reason is discovered, and I know that is asking a lot, I would take it slow and when you get it back together make a few less-than max runs and pull the data logs. If everything checks out go a little harder and check the logs and as many parts as you can without full tear-down. I know that's a PITA but maybe you'll see something before BOOM. If it continues to check good then you might as well let it rip. Good luck!

 

[sigintel]

Dont blindly bolt that head back on yet.
Make sure that head is clear of any FOD or obstruction in water jacket that might cause higher temps on #8.
Check the oil restrictor orfice for blockage and replace or even consider opening it up 5-10% for that side for better oil cooling.
Open #8&7 piston squirters slightly.
Reische 170 Tstat.
CHECK THE HEAD GEOMETRY. Make sure you dont have any geometry defect in that cylinder.
Gaps.
A 20k mile car ragged on before FI will have wider/better ring gaps. If you were low miles and driven lightly, or new stock gaps, thats expecting alot from FORD gaps setup for max longevity daily driven in OEM stock form.
The hottest cylinder will bind the rings first (#8).
Check #7 for evidence of binding and cylinder wall chatter, carbon in ring land, xtransfer of piston/ring land metal when bound.
A bound ring may flash the oil vapor locally due to lack of oil flow and that can blow nearby oil back out and dry the ring further.

 

[ahl395]

I wish i could afford to buy a built motor but with all the money I've spent and the information I know now I should've bought a built motor. I k ow guys with built motors that have blown up, I know guys with the stock motor with twins running high 8s low 9s without any issues. I talk to people, read the forms, and there are guys making a 700+ HP on the stock block and I do a simple setup with a reputable tunner running low boost and I'm having the same major issue twice!! I see alot of people on the form saying the torque booster generates heat... yes I agree but damn... enough heat to crack rings on 10lbs after 4 or 5 hits on the street? I need to get a copy of the logs and post them. I don't know the timing the car was set too but I'm sure lund didn't go crazy on the timing. Car never overboosted, if it did anything it would loose boost at high rpm. It would never get to 10 lbs and hold it. I'd have my foot to the floor, rpms climbing boost dropping. Might have something to do with the boost controller or the tune not 100 percent sure. I'm not here to bash anybody but I don't think it was a defect I don't think it's the torque booster, fuel or spark I'm thinking its the tune. I'm going to have lund re tune it because I already paid for it. I don't want to keep bouncing from tunner to tunner spending a bunch of money. These guys do this all the time. Their a reputable company they will figure it out. My question is should I have lund tune on a dyno or should I have it street tuned again? Thanks to everybody who is trying to help

Street or dyno tuned doesnt really make a difference. You're going to get the same end result. It's just easier to do it on the dyno not worrying about traffic, imperfections in the road, or speed limits lol. Also gets it all done in one shot rather than back and forth with logs for days.

If you're rebuilding this motor, it will be cheaper to put upgraded parts in and have it last than to put OEM parts in and have it break again. At the very least make sure the ring gaps are not too tight before it goes back together. Pretty much all FI engines are living on borrowed time with the factory ring gaps.

I know how you feel with constant recurring failures. My 6R80 has broken 4 times. it sucks, but you'll go farther in debt putting stock parts in which may break again than putting built parts in which are much less likely to break.

 

[kcc0521]

I think the difference between the stock motors that take the abuse and the ones that die early has a lot to do with luck and the ability of the owner to keep a close eye on logs and any issues that pop up so they can be corrected before engine failure. I doubt the tune is pulling timing at only 130 IAT but it could be since it is a 93 tune. My tune does not pull any until 160 but I am on E85. Lund told me that the 3.33 pulley would cause My IATs to be too high on a hot day so I have stuck with the 3.48 for now. Good luck with the next build.

 

[z06psi]

Higher h.p. and BAP do not go together.

 

[WhippledS550]

I have the same issue going on now . Low compression on cylinder 7 lots of blowby,
In the process of Taking engine out now .

 

[WhippledS550]

I’ve got a Gen2 shortblock ordered , I was wondering could I take the pistons out and regap the rings for boost? (Also are the rod bold torque to yield?) Or will I have to order new rings. Also giving thought to just replacing my pistons with Manley forged pistons which are only $699.00 . Would I have to get rotating assembly balanced to those pistons ?

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