B&O center (dash) speaker replacement guide request

[ChaoticFury09]

Yes, it’s definitely worth it to at least upgrade the mid bass woofers in the lower portion of the doors. I did this with a Hertz DSK 165 speaker set and left them powered by the factory B&O amp. The Hertz speakers also come with a set of 24.3 mm tweeters which fit perfectly in the A-pillars (must hot glue them in) behind the factory grills too, so it looks factory. I do have an AudioControl 4.300W amp running the tweets. The rear deck speakers don‘t bring much to the party either. I actually removed one of mine to serve as a bass port for the 12” JL Audio Stealthbox sub that I’m running. I am using an AudioControl 1.300 mono sub amp to power the subwoofer. My speaker signal is fed from the head unit via a PacAudio AmpPro4 fd-21 amp interface, into an AudioControl DM-608 Digital Sound Processor and from there, into the two aforementioned amps. Stereo sound killer now! Oh and I removed the center channel speaker from the dash altogether and it improved the sound. No negative effects either.

Sorry I missed the notification on the reply.

I was thinking of doing all of the speakers. My hope was that an amp would help with the rear speakers being louder and having a better surround sound feel. Maybe that isn't possible with the B&O setup. I am new to all of this and will have to rely heavily on my audio guy but do I need to worry about what someone else said which I think was in relation to OHMS of the stock speakers?

Anything I should watch out for or know? I want to give him as much information as I can before we decide on what to do. Also, did you do any sound deadening? I know the doors sound crazy hollow.

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[geep81]

Just disconnect it. I much prefer the sound without it.

 

[NGOT8R]

Sorry I missed the notification on the reply.

I was thinking of doing all of the speakers. My hope was that an amp would help with the rear speakers being louder and having a better surround sound feel. Maybe that isn't possible with the B&O setup. I am new to all of this and will have to rely heavily on my audio guy but do I need to worry about what someone else said which I think was in relation to OHMS of the stock speakers?

Anything I should watch out for or know? I want to give him as much information as I can before we decide on what to do. Also, did you do any sound deadening? I know the doors sound crazy hollow.

NP. If you like surround sound similar to watching a movie on your home theater setup, then I recommend keeping and/or replacing the center speaker. I ran with mine for a while and when I got around to removing it, I was surprised at how much better it sounded to my ears.

Maybe have your installer remove the center grill, play the stereo with the B&O factory center speaker and with whichever aftermarket speaker you choose. Then have him disconnect the center speaker altogether and decide which way sounds best to you and go with that.

 

[ChaoticFury09]

NP. If you like surround sound similar to watching a movie on your home theater setup, then I recommend keeping and/or replacing the center speaker. I ran with mine for a while and when I got around to removing it, I was surprised at how much better it sounded to my ears.

Maybe have your installer remove the center grill, play the stereo with the B&O factory center speaker and with whichever aftermarket speaker you choose. Then have him disconnect the center speaker altogether and decide which way sounds best to you and go with that.

I will definitely try that and see what sounds better. Do I need to watch the frequency or OHMS from the original speakers and try to replicate that or can I choose whatever I want as the replacements?

 

[NGOT8R]

I will definitely try that and see what sounds better. Do I need to watch the frequency or OHMS from the original speakers and try to replicate that or can I choose whatever I want as the replacements?

I think it’s going to come down to what your ears like, so I wouldn’t worry too much about the speaker ohms. One other thing I found improves sound too, is to move the fade forward of center 1 or 2 ticks (try both to see which one you like best). I never run with my fade centered because it doesn’t sound as good like that to me. Moving the sound stage forward gives me that perfect sound.

 

[GTP]

I have a few quality home audio drivers that might fit.
Look up Parts Express RS75-4. Here is the mechanical drawing. It seems too small.

I have these high end brand drivers on hand, all which are close in size:
Peerless TC9FD18-08 (1)
Faitalpro 3FE20-8 (2)
Tang Band W3-881SJ (1)

I have all sorts of resistors to add if you want. I have the faston connectors for the terminals.

To me, the order of importance is:

1. Mechanical size/fit
2. Build quality (home drivers are made with better materials and will withstand the car environment)
3. Sound quality
4. Impedance / sensitivity

I am a professional loudspeaker designer/manufacturer. Guys, don't overthink the impedance issue because there is just SO much more to it than that anyway.

EDIT: Link#2 corrected.

 

[Elp_jc]

Tang Band W3-881SJ (1)

That's probably the best, no? Your #2 link is the same as #1, so couldn't compare #2. But there are no measurements from hole to opposite hole, to see if it'd fit the car's 2 bolt holes (how do you know?). The speakers should come with wires and terminals, right? That way it'd be easy to splice the terminals to the stock speaker connector, and then just plug it in to the car. Are you selling those speakers? They're super cheap, so they'd probably be more expensive than buying a new one, no?

Finally, I personally think impedance is very important. Yes, you can modify it with resistors, if desired (I personally want an 8-ohm speaker from the factory), but at the end, it has to be 8 ohm, or you'd end with a louder speaker, and it'd ruin your entire system, making the center sound overpowering. That speaker was designed with 8 ohms, so it should have 8 ohms, especially since there's no center speaker sound adjustment. But to each his own, of course .

 

[GTP]

I corrected Link #2. I added that I have the push-on connectors.

As for the hole spacing, these little speakers either have plastic frames or thin metal frames. It would be easy to cut the "ends" of the holes so as to turn them into "slots". Then I think it will match the dash stud spacing well enough.

No, impedance is not critical. It is NOT an indicator of sensitivity (loudness). Only an impedance that is too low (e.g. an ohm or less) is a problem because it can be too high of electrical load to the amp.
If the center speaker is too loud, you can try a different series resistor, no matter the speaker impedance. Unfortunately this really only reduces the midrange and not the treble.

TBH, the proper way to pad down the loudness requires 2 resistors and a capacitor.
Impedance is NOT resistance. It varies with frequency. It could be 20 ohms at 150Hz, then 3 ohms at 300Hz, then 40 ohms at 20kHz. That is why the sound gets thinner the more you pad down the output with a single series resistor.

If anyone wants to buy these speakers from me, I will measure the full impedance curve, and then design the RC flattening Zobel, and then we can see what resistors will lead to particular #dB cut.

 

[Xzavior1818]

You could give this a try.. Dayton audio makes some pretty good stuff and this Is a full range driver..8 ohms like you want. With a 4ohm driver you might not even notice a difference in loudness because of driver efficiency and the impedence curve each driver has.. Just imo

 

[NGOT8R]

I corrected Link #2. I added that I have the push-on connectors.

As for the hole spacing, these little speakers either have plastic frames or thin metal frames. It would be easy to cut the "ends" of the holes so as to turn them into "slots". Then I think it will match the dash stud spacing well enough.

No, impedance is not critical. It is NOT an indicator of sensitivity (loudness). Only an impedance that is too low (e.g. an ohm or less) is a problem because it can be too high of electrical load to the amp.
If the center speaker is too loud, you can try a different series resistor, no matter the speaker impedance. Unfortunately this really only reduces the midrange and not the treble.

TBH, the proper way to pad down the loudness requires 2 resistors and a capacitor.
Impedance is NOT resistance. It varies with frequency. It could be 20 ohms at 150Hz, then 3 ohms at 300Hz, then 40 ohms at 20kHz. That is why the sound gets thinner the more you pad down the output with a single series resistor.

If anyone wants to buy these speakers from me, I will measure the full impedance curve, and then design the RC flattening Zobel, and then we can see what resistors will lead to particular #dB cut.

While I am perfectly content with having deleted my center channel speaker, there are many who prefer to keep theirs. In an effort to help those individuals, I have a question for you.

Would it be possible for you to design a speaker with a basket and mounting holes that are an exact match to the factory center speaker?

 

[GTP]

I also disconnected my center speaker.

Hard part #1 is mechanical matchup of speaker frame to car.
Hard part #2 are the electro-acoustic issues of getting good sound, i.e. the impedance/sensitivity/frequency-response, etc.

To your question, the drivers I listed are candidates to replace the Ford speaker. If someone who still has their center speaker out would measure the hole spacing, then we can reference the data sheets to see if they are close enough to work.

Then for #2, I will measure the impedance curve and design the R-R-C circuit for anyone who buys a speaker from my list.

How's that?

 

[NGOT8R]

I also disconnected my center speaker.

Hard part #1 is mechanical matchup of speaker frame to car.
Hard part #2 are the electro-acoustic issues of getting good sound, i.e. the impedance/sensitivity/frequency-response, etc.

To your question, the drivers I listed are candidates to replace the Ford speaker. If someone who still has their center speaker out would measure the hole spacing, then we can reference the data sheets to see if they are close enough to work.

Then for #2, I will measure the impedance curve and design the R-R-C circuit for anyone who buys a speaker from my list.

How's that?

Here is a measurement of the hole spacing.

 

[GTP]

Excellent.

You could also measure inside between the hole/slot (caliper jaws), outside between them (caliper prongs), and then the hole ID. That would give me exact dims range. Also, switch over to mm, since that is how the data sheets are published.

Thanks.

 

[NGOT8R]

Excellent.

You could also measure inside between the hole/slot (caliper jaws), outside between them (caliper prongs), and then the hole ID. That would give me exact dims range. Also, switch over to mm, since that is how the data sheets are published.

Thanks.

Here ya go.

 

[GTP]

All my speakers listed in Post #51 look to be a bit small.

I have Wavecor WF120BD04 (one 8ohm and one 4ohm) on hand, a very high end driver. It is kinda deep, but apparently there is "plenty of depth". ?

I can make either of these work for you, including impedance and padding. Let's make a deal.

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