Another engine bye bye

[stangman638]

Got a call from dealer and kinda thought they were going to say engine tick tapping during RPM is normal, they said they isolated to one of the cylinders, will be getting a short block possibly a long block they need to check a few more things, advisor also acknowledged that he thinks ford will issue a recall shortly. He thinks it's due to manufacturing error, something is out of spec, didn't say what.

Very surprised as it seems to be a total 180 degree view on handling the issue, tech has been in contact with ford hotline and following what he is told.

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[bootlegger]

Got a call from dealer and kinda thought they were going to say engine tick tapping during RPM is normal, they said they isolated to one of the cylinders, will be getting a short block possibly a long block they need to check a few more things, advisor also acknowledged that he thinks ford will issue a recall shortly. He thinks it's due to manufacturing error, something is out of spec, didn't say what.

Very surprised as it seems to be a total 180 degree view on handling the issue, tech has been in contact with ford hotline and following what he is told.

Was your only indication of an issue the sound?

 

[Gtgpa]

If something is out of spec, won’t the new one still be bad?

 

[Condor1970]

If something is out of spec, won’t the new one still be bad?

If it turns out to be improper reposition of the pin boss after increasing the diameter of the cylinder and pistons, then the piston slap may in fact be too excessive. If that's proving to be the case, they may in fact have fixed the issue already and will issue a recall to start replacing engines. That's not a very big recall, since there are only about 100,000 cars affected. However, it would be a very costly one.

 

[careature]

If it turns out to be improper reposition of the pin boss after increasing the diameter of the cylinder and pistons, then the piston slap may in fact be too excessive. If that's proving to be the case, they may in fact have fixed the issue already and will issue a recall to start replacing engines. That's not a very big recall, since there are only about 100,000 cars affected. However, it would be a very costly one.

Seems like < 2017 cars have a tick that is more likely is a rod bearing related. 2018+ also have some poston related issue. It is important to distinguish those. Tick sounds like bbq tick and piston issue is more like rattle as far as I heard clips. Correct me.

 

[Condor1970]

Seems like < 2017 cars have a tick that is more likely is a rod bearing related. 2018+ also have some poston related issue. It is important to distinguish those. Tick sounds like bbq tick and piston issue is more like rattle as far as I heard clips. Correct me.

I wasn't aware the earlier <2017's were verified as a bearing issue. It may be. That was my original thought as well. From everything I read, they still don't really know, but the same tick is much more common in the 2018's. Because of that. logic tells me it's because of the changes made. ie. the larger cylinder/piston diameter causing more rocking/slapping. It's possible the geometry hasn't allowed for perfect pin boss location to compensate adequately.

From all the times I've heard engines with any kind of wiped bearing, the tick isn't really a tick. It's more like a knock that simply gets louder as it gets worse. And no matter how minimal or severe, it always seems constant with engine rpm, and not intermittent like the BBQ tick. I could be wrong, but the more I read, this tick they've had in the past, and even more prevalent in the 2018's is really more akin to piston skirt slap.

 

[careature]

I wasn't aware the earlier <2017's were verified as a bearing issue. It may be. That was my original thought as well. From everything I read, they still don't really know, but the same tick is much more common in the 2018's. Because of that. logic tells me it's because of the changes made. ie. the larger cylinder/piston diameter causing more rocking/slapping. It's possible the geometry hasn't allowed for perfect pin boss location to compensate adequately.

From all the times I've heard engines with any kind of wiped bearing, the tick isn't really a tick. It's more like a knock that simply gets louder as it gets worse. And no matter how minimal or severe, it always seems constant with engine rpm, and not intermittent like the BBQ tick. I could be wrong, but the more I read, this tick they've had in the past, and even more prevalent in the 2018's is really more akin to piston skirt slap.

Or even check gt350 piston slap clips. It sounds like rattle that you can hear inside car.

Tick is heard from outside with windows down and some reflection on the side.

 

[Condor1970]

Or even check gt350 piston slap clips. It sounds like rattle that you can hear inside car.

Tick is heard from outside with windows down and some reflection on the side.

Yes, if piston slap eventually gets bad enough, then it will be audible inside the vehicle, and very annoying. That's when the engine really is worn out, and needs repair.

 

[stangman638]

Was your only indication of an issue the sound?

Many says there tapping went away when engine hot, mine did not, heard while hot as well as revving engine while hot, I scan say I think there was also a loss in power overall, more noticeable low end.

 

[Condor1970]

Many says there tapping went away when engine hot, mine did not, heard while hot as well as revving engine while hot, I scan say I think there was also a loss in power overall, more noticeable low end.

Well, in my case, the tick did go away after running hard for a good 10 minutes or so, at a constant 3,500rpm. The next day, the tick did come back, but as time has gone on, the tick seems to be a little less and less, even when cold. That said, I'm just switching to a better oil (PUP 5w30), and see where it goes from there.

 

[88lx50]

If it turns out to be improper reposition of the pin boss after increasing the diameter of the cylinder and pistons, then the piston slap may in fact be too excessive. If that's proving to be the case, they may in fact have fixed the issue already and will issue a recall to start replacing engines. That's not a very big recall, since there are only about 100,000 cars affected. However, it would be a very costly one.

Why would they have to reposition anything? The bore center is the same.

 

[Condor1970]

Why would they have to reposition anything? The bore center is the same.

As the diameter of the piston gets larger, the leverage placed on the piston due to combustion at different rates will apply a slightly different angular force on the top of the piston. The mass of the piston will also change as well. If the pin boss location is not optimally placed in accordance with the slight change in its center of gravity to minimize rotational force, excessive rocking motion and skirt slap can occur. The Ford Tech at the local dealer even told me these pistons have a fairly short skirt, and piston slap is not uncommon.

 

[stangman638]

If something is out of spec, won’t the new one still be bad?

Great question, maybe, maybe not. Perhaps why these blocks are on back order now? (read they were here or somewhere) Majority of buyers dont get an engine like this, so if they roll with what they have, maybe 80% chance no problem with new engine, if they did address issue, than it should be ok.

 

[stangman638]

One BIG thing i noticed, I swore i felt my engine rattle when I was WOT in sport mode using the paddle shifters, 6-10 degrees knock, program only records up to 10, but thats some serious detonation going on. Factory tune, 93 octane.

 

[bootlegger]

Many says there tapping went away when engine hot, mine did not, heard while hot as well as revving engine while hot, I scan say I think there was also a loss in power overall, more noticeable low end.

I never had the tick at idle, only the rattle. But the rattle is always there. I definitely haven't lost power.

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