Ohlins Road and Track s550

[Bluemustang]

Thoughts? I think this is everything that you mentioned.

The toe links you don't need. It's a great part and serves a purpose. But I've had issues with noise on links like this and eventually went back to stock. The FP toe knuckle bearing, you do want. AMERICAN MUSCLE sells it. 100 bones.

I would skip the spherical on the vertical links. It's not necessary. Even the Mustang GT4 racecar uses stock vertical links. If you do upgrade that I'd find one with a poly bushing. I use the Steeda poly vertical link.

The front control arm bearing you don't need. But it is a great mod. It will make the steering more direct and reduce control arm deflection under hard braking. If it were me, I'd leave this one to later. It adds a tiny bit of NVH. I personally don't mind it.

The rear camber adjustment kit you don't need. It is adjustable from the factory. If you want a better solution, get the SPC camber arms from OPMustang.

Don't forget- address the IRS subframe. Go to BMR CB005 or the Steeda solution.

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[guitrflip]

It comes with J&M camber plates... Thank you, for the input!

I can't help a whole lot on spring rates, except to say that is close to what I was running before with BMR/FP shocks. It worked well. I have no reason to think it won't work here.

@*****[/USER] contacted them and said they can do 650/1200 no problem. I believe it. There's a lot of damping force available.

OMG... Wow 650 / 1200 ? Geez.. that's full bare-bone race car track specs...
Hmm... stock Ohlins 515F and 800R. It makes sense why Ohlins stuck with 800R... I should probably consider your stock Ohlin setup as well due to below (old excel file I saved from linear spring rates since 2016ish):

 

[Bluemustang]

It comes with J&M camber plates... Thank you, for the input!



OMG... Wow 650 / 1200 ? Geez.. that's full bare-bone race car track specs...
Hmm... stock Ohlins 515F and 800R. It makes sense why Ohlins stuck with 800R... I should probably consider your stock Ohlin setup as well due to below (old excel file I saved from linear spring rates since 2016ish):

Yeah. Ohlins are pretty much motorsport dampers lol. So they better be good lol.

FYI I am using the J&M plates as well. I have -2.4 front camber and I can probably get close to -3. @***** with his setup is already running -3.2 (but FYI this is a track setup. You don't need as much as he is running)

Yeah this setup is similar to the Swift Spec-R setup. Stiff front, soft rear. I think there is some evidence to suggest this is right. Also, go look at the Mustang S550 Bilstein coilovers. They do the same thing. Those two manufacturers know suspension.

Paging @TeeLew. He can provide his thoughts perhaps on the stiff front and softer rear. He does the same thing. Do some hard thinking before hitting that buy button lol

 

[TeeLew]

The Ohlins rates get really good comments. If you go to slicks, you might need the added rate, I don't know. You don't need anything more that the stock Ohlins for just about any DOT tire I'm aware, though.

In general, run the springs as soft as you can, but as stiff as you have to control pitch and ride. The car brakes a lot harder than it accelerates, so you need a stiffer front than rear. Control roll and balance with the bars.

It's a complete oversimplification, but this is essentially the thought process.

 

[Jaymar]

I have what may amount to 2 dumb questions for the big front/light rear crowd:

1. With the large increase in roll resistance up front, is there still any need for roll center correction like the extended ball joints to correct the front geometry for the lower ride height or does that become unnecessary with that much spring?

2. With springs that light in the rear, what are you running for rear anti-roll bars? I'm assuming the front is the typical 35mm offering from BMR/Steeda/Eibach etc. but do you need to step up to the 25mm rear offerings from the same or are you still running OEM PP/GT350 like rears?

 

[NightmareMoon]

Confidence and predictability - if that’s your goal, it matters very little if you have nice coilovers or stock parts.

You need tons experience as a driver operating the car at and just past it’s traction limits. You need your brakes, alignment, and the car in general to be very well maintained, you need great tires well matched to the conditions, you need to know the road conditions ahead past the bend in the curve, and you need to be leaving some safety margin for the unexpected.

Skimp on the budget for any of that and it wont matter if your coilovers were shiney and expensive or not. Note that I mentioned the driver first. Invest in track instruction and autocross if you really want your confidence to be more than a false emotion about some name brand you spent a bunch of money on.

Local autocross guys in my region go to porsche club autocrosses sometimes. They always beat all the P club guys, and its not because we’re bringing better cars, its because our confidence wasn’t bought at a store, it was earned through seat time driving at the limits.

That said, ohlins are probably nice kit, I personally like me some stiff suspension, but dont blow the budget on coilovers if it means skimping on the stuff that matters more - real driver training, aggressive maintenance of things like brakes and alignment, and great tires.

 

[shogun32]

Too much rear bar is a problem. Some racers even take the rear bar out in rain conditions.

As a current user of the Steeda dual rates in the back, I definitely think it's not best for feel. For long radius and on banking where you can really load it up it may be great. But trying to go hard in tight cloverleaf's the rear feels like it's struggling to maintain grip. My stock eco feels better in the back

 

[Bluemustang]

1. With the large increase in roll resistance up front, is there still any need for roll center correction like the extended ball joints to correct the front geometry for the lower ride height or does that become unnecessary with that much spring?

I use them. There is some effect regardless once you lower the ride height. There are more effects, bumpsteer is one of them. And if you do use them, you basically need to adjust bumpsteer anyway. Do you need them? Probably not. Most people don't use them. And there is a downside - at least the Steeda arms. It comes at the expense of reducing the track width slightly and also some static camber. But it's basically a wash because you've got some geometric anti-roll back in by correcting the roll center. The ideal way would be an adjustable arm to dial in the track width and correct the roll center.

 

[Bluemustang]

Too much rear bar is a problem. Some racers even take the rear bar out in rain conditions.

As a current user of the Steeda dual rates in the back, I definitely think it's not best for feel. For long radius and on banking where you can really load it up it may be great. But trying to go hard in tight cloverleaf's the rear feels like it's struggling to maintain grip. My stock eco feels better in the back

I think 1200 rear is too much for the street, and likely most situations unless you're on the track and running R-compounds or slicks.

 

[Bluemustang]

Confidence and predictability - if that’s your goal, it matters very little if you have nice coilovers or stock parts.

You need tons experience as a driver operating the car at and just past it’s traction limits. You need your brakes, alignment, and the car in general to be very well maintained, you need great tires well matched to the conditions, you need to know the road conditions ahead past the bend in the curve, and you need to be leaving some safety margin for the unexpected.

Skimp on the budget for any of that and it wont matter if your coilovers were shiney and expensive or not. Note that I mentioned the driver first. Invest in track instruction and autocross if you really want your confidence to be more than a false emotion about some name brand you spent a bunch of money on.

Local autocross guys in my region go to porsche club autocrosses sometimes. They always beat all the P club guys, and its not because we’re bringing better cars, its because our confidence wasn’t bought at a store, it was earned through seat time driving at the limits.

That said, ohlins are probably nice kit, I personally like me some stiff suspension, but dont blow the budget on coilovers if it means skimping on the stuff that matters more - real driver training, aggressive maintenance of things like brakes and alignment, and great tires.

With respect, while I do agree with all of that, a stock GT lacks all confidence inspiring qualities. The rear subframe issues especially. I would do a few simple mods first to allow you to build the confidence. But you're right, you don't need shiny coilovers, etc. to be fast and have car control.

 

[NightmareMoon]

With respect, while I do agree with all of that, a stock GT lacks all confidence inspiring qualities. The rear subframe issues especially. I would do a few simple mods first to allow you to build the confidence. But you're right, you don't need shiny coilovers, etc. to be fast and have car control.

For predictable and confidence, yeah I would recommend dealing with the rear slop, and you wont usually catch me on record saying that, but for these goals, yep go for it.

 

[TeeLew]

I have what may amount to 2 dumb questions for the big front/light rear crowd:

1. With the large increase in roll resistance up front, is there still any need for roll center correction like the extended ball joints to correct the front geometry for the lower ride height or does that become unnecessary with that much spring?

2. With springs that light in the rear, what are you running for rear anti-roll bars? I'm assuming the front is the typical 35mm offering from BMR/Steeda/Eibach etc. but do you need to step up to the 25mm rear offerings from the same or are you still running OEM PP/GT350 like rears?

1. I own them and haven't installed them, because I really don't feel as if I need any more response out of the front and I don't want to give up the negative camber. I really can't speak to them further.

2. I'm running a 20mm RARB. Depending on the day/track/driver, I can see being on anything from unhooked to the 24mm my car came with stock. Again, this is all I can personally speak to, I'm sure you can find scenarios where even bigger could work. Corner exit traction will ultimately dictate how much you can run.

My personal preference is on the softer side, but this is one of the advantages of having significantly less nose weight. The alternative is that I can run the same configuration with less understeer. My Eco will naturally have a more neutral balance just because of weight distribution (& my battery is in the trunk) which allows me to run proportionally less rear roll resistance for a given balance which, in general, improves corner exit traction. I do everything I can to gain rear stability on corner entry and forward traction on exit.

I use the rear bar as the icing on the cake, not a fundamental tuning device. It's a good way to fine-tune the balance, but it's usually not the best tool for gross adjustments. Once you put the correct amount of camber in the front end of the car, I don't think understeer is a significant problem. It becomes a lot more about what you're doing as a driver and where you're putting the load dynamically as opposed to just a dead-steering push.

 

[Jaymar]

Thank you everyone for the responses, there is some great information here. Now I can imagine totally new and different ways to throw money at a car.

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