Who will swap for the new 7.3 V8!

[nastang87xx]

Totally depends on the gearing and the distance of the race.

Of course but if we were talking about everything being identical as before? Well...should be obvious.

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[millhouse]

Of course but if we were talking about everything being identical as before? Well...should be obvious.

We'll, we have been comparing different engines, different gears and transmissions.

 

[WildHorse]

You really don't understand anything I posted nor do you understand either video you posted.

Then please explain to me how 'area under the curve applies to peak HP, where your acceleration in the greatest? I see how.. cause you keep changing transmissions, gearing, etc. 1/4 mile races is about peak HP. If your engine is dropping into the 'area under the curve' where its greatest: IE midrange, your not setup properly. 300hp/500ftlbs will never out accelerate 500hp/300ftlbs. Same car, same weight, same driver. Acceleration measured to 60ft, 330ft, 660ft & 1320ft (time over distance). And if you watched the vids, he explained it perfectly.

 

[millhouse]

Then please explain to me how 'area under the curve applies to peak HP, where your acceleration in the greatest? I see how.. cause you keep changing transmissions, gearing, etc. 1/4 mile races is about peak HP. If your engine is dropping into the 'area under the curve' where its greatest: IE midrange, your not setup properly. 300hp/500ftlbs will never out accelerate 500hp/300ftlbs. Same car, same weight, same driver. Acceleration measured to 60ft, 330ft, 660ft & 1320ft (time over distance). And if you watched the vids, he explained it perfectly.

I already have (as did your first video)! You need to watch them again. Ever heard of the old adage "torque gets you moving, horsepower keeps you moving"?

You want to test out your horsepower theory? Bring your RPM up to 5000 in 5th gear and try to launch. Now do the exact same thing in 1st gear at 5000 RPM. Which one will accelerate you faster? You're making the same horsepower with both.

And you have yet to answer my torque converter question.

 

[WildHorse]

And you have yet to answer my torque converter question

Well since my s550 is a standard. I'll have to go waaaaaay back to my 71 roadrunner 440/727/4.30 gears. Shifted at 6 grand. Started with a 3500 stall. Ended with a custom DEBS 4500 stall that flashed to 5000. That got my FASTEST 60ft/ET/TRAP 1200rpm above my peak torque. Somewhere around 410 ftlbs whereas I made peak torque of 480 @ 3800 rpm. Reason for such a huge stall? Stock stall: After 1st Shift: 3,600 RPM. After 2nd Shift: 4,100 RPM. Tight TC so slip prolly around 8%. Crossed the line at around 5,800 RPM. Coulda used more gear yet. But the car was killer consistent on the dial in with that setup.

 

[GT Pony]

I already have (as did your first video)! You need to watch them again. Ever heard of the old adage "torque gets you moving, horsepower keeps you moving"?

You want to test out your horsepower theory? Bring your RPM up to 5000 in 5th gear and try to launch. Now do the exact same thing in 1st gear at 5000 RPM. Which one will accelerate you faster? You're making the same horsepower with both.

You're not making the same HP to the rear wheels where it counts a split second after initial movement, so it's a bad example. In the 5th gear example, as soon as the clutch is engaged the RPM drops way down on the T and HP curves due to the gearing, so it's really two different situatons going on between senarios.

Cars with lower torque output that have a high peak HP RPM range use gearing to increase torque to the rear wheels. So it's easy to make the same or more low end torque to the rear wheels in the lower gears (to get moving off the line) if the gearing on a lower peak T but higher peak HP car is setup/geared property compared to a car with a lower end torque curve that doesn't rev as high.

 

[Fatguy]

No one is really going to fit this taco van engine into an S550. Maybe some old version of the Mustang.
So why have sleepless nights thinking up witty reposts? It's ultimately bad for your health, the gormless internet argument, you know?

What?


And go back to polls over which colour someone should get? Jacking rails - and - the sink hole dilemma! Whoa: almost has an accident! Whoa: almost has an accident with my car...


Stuff like that?

 

[Fatguy]

It's hard to believe that this thread is still going

If I pull the trigger on the swap it is the full 7.3 and it’s A10 transmission as I need that 1000 ft lb breathing room. That is one story...


The second story is transforming the thing into a street dragster. Lower cost and double the video and story.


Two/Two/Two engine’s in one!

 

[Erik427]

If I pull the trigger on the swap it is the full 7.3 and it’s A10 transmission as I need that 1000 ft lb breathing room. That is one story...


The second story is transforming the thing into a street dragster. Lower cost and double the video and story.


Two/Two/Two engine’s in one!

7.3 ruffles more feathers than a LS swap......sheesh.
I understand people love the Coyote....
But I also understand that some people don't.
I really feel that the 7.3 and the 3.5TT should be offered.

I love bottom end tq/hp and top end tq/hp.
Why can't we have both?

 

[Fatguy]

7.3 ruffles more feathers than a LS swap......sheesh.
I understand people love the Coyote....
But I also understand that some people don't.
I really feel that the 7.3 and the 3.5TT should be offered.

I love bottom end tq/hp and top end tq/hp.
Why can't we have both?

Maybe with an electric car...


Well we are getting info from anonymous tipsters at Ford. The Super Duty 6.7 diesel will put out some impressive numbers:

“There are rumors and estimates out there that say that the 2020 Super Duty diesel will make around 490 hp and 1,015 lb-ft of torque. This is reportedly based on anonymous inside sources and the fact that Ford has revised the big V8 diesel with a higher pressure fuel system (up to 36,000 psi) among other upgrades.”


This one was from a May 16 story: https://www.tfltruck.com/2019/05/wi...uty-diesel-v8-make-over-1000-lb-ft-of-torque/


Looks like some news for the 7.3 any time now. On the basis of engineers here, the new 7.3 will not have class leading performance as the head of engines said so. So I predict 387 horsepower and 415 pound feet of torque. As these numbers are less than the current Coyote I expect production of the Godzilla to be terminated before it begins. The 120 people laid off from Coyote production and sent to Godzilla production will now be unemployed. Hackett may just end all gasoline V8 production period as the new motor “sucks ass”. Happy days, happy days!

 

[millhouse]

Well since my s550 is a standard. I'll have to go waaaaaay back to my 71 roadrunner 440/727/4.30 gears. Shifted at 6 grand. Started with a 3500 stall. Ended with a custom DEBS 4500 stall that flashed to 5000. That got my FASTEST 60ft/ET/TRAP 1200rpm above my peak torque. Somewhere around 410 ftlbs whereas I made peak torque of 480 @ 3800 rpm. Reason for such a huge stall? Stock stall: After 1st Shift: 3,600 RPM. After 2nd Shift: 4,100 RPM. Tight TC so slip prolly around 8%. Crossed the line at around 5,800 RPM. Coulda used more gear yet. But the car was killer consistent on the dial in with that setup.

Here you go, look at the video you posted again...I've time stamped it for you.



When you are launching, you are in a single gear set. You don't have the ability to shift to another gear to sacrifice torque for horsepower and use gearing to manipulate rear wheel torque. Max acceleration off the line is going to occur at peak torque. Once your off the line, you are interested in keeping the engine in the area where the maximum amount of work can be done in the shortest amount of time. This is the area under the horsepower curve, integrating between your high shift point and rpm drop point. This changes for each gear shift, as each rpm drop is different.

There are a million articles written on this (that you will probably choose to ignore)

"That’s because in any 1 gear, the torque peak is where the car accelerates the quickest, producing the highest Gs. The torque peak can be important for launching the line, but after that HP is all that matters."
http://performancetrends.com/blog/?p=7

"It is important to understand torque numbers, as you will be wanting the stall to lock-up when close to peak toque of the engine"
https://www.roadrunnerconverters.com/top-considerations-for-drag-racing-torque-converters/

"The only secret to picking the "right" torque converter for a given application is to match the stall speed to the peak torque curve of the engine. Ideally, the torque converter should reach its stall speed at the same time the engine hits its peak torque output."
https://www.aa1car.com/library/torque_converters_performance.htm

"For best drag strip results, we like to see a converter that stalls close to peak torque."
http://kennedysdynotune.com/torque-converter-tech-tips-selection/

Let's throw another anology out.

Car A has 200hp and 300lb ft of torque. Car B has 250hp and 300lb ft of torque. Given identical weights and identical first gears and rear end ratios, both of these cars will have the same off the line torque...meaning they will perform almost identically in the 60'. After 60 feet however, Car B has the ability to do it's work quicker (assuming similar hp curves) and will end up winning this race.

If this doesn't get through to you by now, I don't know what to tell you. Do you not notice you are the only one arguing against this point?

You're not making the same HP to the rear wheels where it counts a split second after initial movement, so it's a bad example. In the 5th gear example, as soon as the clutch is engaged the RPM drops way down on the T and HP curves due to the gearing, so it's really two different situatons going on between senarios.

Cars with lower torque output that have a high peak HP RPM range use gearing to increase torque to the rear wheels. So it's easy to make the same or more low end torque to the rear wheels in the lower gears (to get moving off the line) if the gearing on a lower peak T but higher peak HP car is setup/geared property compared to a car with a lower end torque curve that doesn't rev as high.

It's a perfect example why peak torque IS what's important for launches. I've already said, this can absolutely be overcome by gearing.,,but in the end, you are increasing your rear wheel torque by doing such. Let's not forget however that it comes with the penalty of a earlier 1-2 and 2-3 shift (like the S550 mustang does). Again, the GT350 is a perfect example of this issue. It's geared appropriately for the track, not the drag-strip...hence the (relative) poor 1/4 mile times for it's horsepower. Hell, back in 2015 the GT350(non r) was tested to a [email protected] mph yet a 2018 GT was tested to a 12.6@115mph (manual trans). With an extra 66hp, the GT350 should smoke the GT by more than 0.2 seconds, no?

All this comes back to the fact that at launch, you want the most available torque at the wheels possible. This occurs at peak engine torque (assuming traction is available)

 

[Erik427]

Maybe with an electric car...


Well we are getting info from anonymous tipsters at Ford. The Super Duty 6.7 diesel will put out some impressive numbers:

“There are rumors and estimates out there that say that the 2020 Super Duty diesel will make around 490 hp and 1,015 lb-ft of torque. This is reportedly based on anonymous inside sources and the fact that Ford has revised the big V8 diesel with a higher pressure fuel system (up to 36,000 psi) among other upgrades.”


This one was from a May 16 story: https://www.tfltruck.com/2019/05/wi...uty-diesel-v8-make-over-1000-lb-ft-of-torque/


Looks like some news for the 7.3 any time now. On the basis of engineers here, the new 7.3 will not have class leading performance as the head of engines said so. So I predict 387 horsepower and 415 pound feet of torque. As these numbers are less than the current Coyote I expect production of the Godzilla to be terminated before it begins. The 120 people laid off from Coyote production and sent to Godzilla production will now be unemployed. Hackett may just end all gasoline V8 production period as the new motor “sucks ass”. Happy days, happy days!

I doubt that the 7.3 will make the same numbers as the 6.2

 

[bootlegger]

Maybe with an electric car...


Well we are getting info from anonymous tipsters at Ford. The Super Duty 6.7 diesel will put out some impressive numbers:

“There are rumors and estimates out there that say that the 2020 Super Duty diesel will make around 490 hp and 1,015 lb-ft of torque. This is reportedly based on anonymous inside sources and the fact that Ford has revised the big V8 diesel with a higher pressure fuel system (up to 36,000 psi) among other upgrades.”


This one was from a May 16 story: https://www.tfltruck.com/2019/05/wi...uty-diesel-v8-make-over-1000-lb-ft-of-torque/

Unlike the 7.3, the 6.7 diesel is a wonderful display of modern engine technology. It will be using the latest and greatest injectors/pump at 2500 bar, advanced concepts for fuel mapping and injection pulse, and a whole new ECU control system. I am happy Ford went that direction. We had to invest a lot of time and money to support this development.

 

[Fatguy]

I doubt that the 7.3 will make the same numbers as the 6.2

Unfortunately my sources concur with you ( and it’s 6.7).


Third hand unvetted chatter says the new 7.3 is a 1,300 pound rock crusher producing 318 horsepower and 345 lb ft of torque. The Head of Engines - who then suggested swapping in the 2.3 Ecoboost on 93 Octane instead - was soon fired and last seen being dragged out by Ford security, clutching some obscure book by Gore Vidal and screaming: Free Julian Assange!

His replacement Robert Oppenheimer Jr. says that our troubles are over by putting a Whipple Supercharger on the Coyote and putting that in the Super Duty! Look at my blackboard with all those obscure squiggles on it - I am smart!


Still trying to confirm this new breaking information...

 

[Erik427]

Unfortunately my sources concur with you ( and it’s 6.7).


Third hand unvetted chatter says the new 7.3 is a 1,300 pound rock crusher producing 318 horsepower and 345 lb ft of torque. The Head of Engines - who then suggested swapping in the 2.3 Ecoboost on 93 Octane instead - was soon fired and last seen being dragged out by Ford security, clutching some obscure book by Gore Vidal and screaming: Free Julian Assange!

His replacement Robert Oppenheimer Jr. says that our troubles are over by putting a Whipple Supercharger on the Coyote and putting that in the Super Duty! Look at my blackboard with all those obscure squiggles on it - I am smart!


Still trying to confirm this new breaking information...

LOL......just give me a 289 and a Paxton.

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