Working on a dual intake?

[GregO]

Rear manifold pix looks like a scroll type common plenum.

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[Jaymar]

Yeah, I don't know how many ITB comparisons you can make. That still looks like a plenum with runners on it they just slapped two TBs on the front instead. Given it's Ford, we should be lucky it isn't an '18 manifold cut and glued back together.

 

[4V Mayhem]

Yeah, I don't know how many ITB comparisons you can make. That still looks like a plenum with runners on it they just slapped two TBs on the front instead. Given it's Ford, we should be lucky it isn't an '18 manifold cut and glued back together.

Don't give them any ideas man.

 

[tdstuart]

I want to preface with I am terrible at electrical stuff.

But, to make it work it would seem like you would have to combine the 2 maf signals into one and have the tb signals combined as well. Make the dual throttle bodies act as one.

You may even be able to have one throttle body act like a normal one and have a controller that reads rpm and pedal position to control the secondary like we think the 24+ Mustang will work. But that would require a lot more work.

I don't think it would be worth it for the s550 gen mustangs to try and use this setup. I think Ford chose to do this because they wanted a bigger throttle body for more power but also the control of a smaller throttle body for driveability. The smaller throttle body may even help with low-end torque. But to do it effectively like we already stated they will use one throttle body as the main and one as a helper in higher rpm to give more power. I think replicating that effect on the s550 mustang will be pretty hard. You will probably need a custom controller to control the second throttle body, which will need inputs from the ecu.

I think if you want the bigger throttle body you go cj setup.

 

[Optimum Performance]

It's a common plenum. Individual banked plenums only work on Flat Plane engines with equal firing. 2 smaller TB's offer much more resolution than one big one. It's 2023, you can now (still) buy a 500+ HP NA V8 car, as tighter emissions standards are legislated in for ICE. What OEM's are doing with power levels while meeting emissions and offering warranties is nothing short of amazing. There is so much investment to make this possible, decades of research dollars at the US's advanced research labs etc. People tend to make assumptions based on current technology and strategies, missing that existing sensors could be used for other purposes in the system.

Large prime power engines with big long crankshafts actually adjust what "TDC" is on the fly due to the multiple degrees of crankshaft twist present while under load. On a 24 cylinder engine the spread is huge. We learned by changing the gas pressure feeding them gave us better fuel control because we forced the valve to travel further so corrections were 10 times more precise. I believe this is the reason for 2 banks of induction, more precise, no airflow restrictions while meeting upcoming emission standards.

 

[engineermike]

Got my hands on the 2024 calibration. To my surprise the tb model looks just like a gen3 except there are two of them. That leads me to believe they just work in parallel. Logic determines flow required for desired torque, then calculates flow area required, then crosses that to a throttle angle on a lookup table x 2.

 

[WildHorse]

Got my hands on the 2024 calibration.

So, post it up.

 

[engineermike]

What else you want to know? I can say it is completely revamped vs the gen3. Shockingly so.

 

[Grimreaper]

OP cam angles changed?
Pe?

 

[engineermike]

Op cam angles are drastically different. Home/deenergized position isn’t at the same location for the intake cam, but even if you account for that it’s very different. For instance, the gen2 moves the intake cam 38 deg through the rpm range, gen3 is 44 deg. Gen4(?) only moves it 24 deg.

Pe lambda is basically the same.

 

[Jasonb543]

Do you think there is some major gains to be unlocked on these gen 4s??

 

[engineermike]

Do you think there is some major gains to be unlocked on these gen 4s??

With just a tune, I doubt it.

 

[K4fxd]

Got my hands on the 2024 calibration.

What format and can you share it?

 

[engineermike]

What format and can you share it?

Sorry, I can’t share either one of those at this time.

 

[MAGS1]

With just a tune, I doubt it.

Sounds like Ford didn’t leave much on the table, similar to GM and the C8 Vette. Which is a good thing IMO. Give as much to the consumer as you can right out of the gate.

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