Vibration between 50 & 70 mph

[Cobra Jet]

For those who *might not* have taken time to read this entire thread through - you may have missed these (2) very important posts from me - which will give you (and your Ford Service Center) some GUIDANCE regarding the vibration diagnosis and trying to procure a free Ford loaner:

My post # 1036 (My post discussing how to deal with your Service Center, loaner, etc.):
http://www.mustang6g.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1133039&postcount=1036

My Post # 1037 (Actual Correspondence between my Ford Service Center and Ford Engineering Team):
http://www.mustang6g.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1133123&postcount=1037


One thing to mention - for guys telling their Dealer to read this thread - unfortunately, many Service Writers and Techs WILL NOT read through this thread - why? Because A) they don't have time, B) many have "Ford Blinders" on, meaning they'll only do what the Ford Shop manuals state and won't deviate from those books or C) have the attitude of "you're a customer who is trying to tell us Professionals something that you, the customer, have not been trained to diagnose".

Post # 1037 I linked above is actual Ford instructions on how my driveline vibe was diagnosed AND corrected. That should be a HUGE help to Service Writers and Techs - and should save time for both Dealer and Customer!!

I feel bad for the guys on here where the Dealer does not understand or does not know how to property operate the Vibe Analysis tool... and telling folks "it's a characteristic of the Mustang"...

Watch the documentary "A Faster Horse" - Ford folks knew of the vibration which is discussed in that film - and now we're almost into MY 2017 and the problem is just as persistent as when the 2015 was initially released.

Good luck!

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[15gt]

Well they told me today they sent the drive shaft off to get balanced at another location and would install it to see if that fixed it. And never got a follow up call. So far tomorrow will be a week and they haven't even come close to fixing the issue and I have had to call to get information about the car each time. And they won't look at this forum for information on the issue.

 

[Lo Pony]

Well they told me today they sent the drive shaft off to get balanced at another location and would install it to see if that fixed it. And never got a follow up call. So far tomorrow will be a week and they haven't even come close to fixing the issue and I have had to call to get information about the car each time. And they won't look at this forum for information on the issue.

Let us know how it works.

 

[15gt]

Spoke to my advisor and he stated the isolated the engine with no vibration had the drives haft balanced 3 times and sent off to get checked and it is fine. So they isolated it down to the rear differential and tore it down and found a bearing in the carrier that was shot. So they are ordering a new rear differential should be in early next week. They have another car in their with the same issue and found a problem in the rear differential also. Hopefully it fixes it.

 

[ultimate warrior]

Spoke to my advisor and he stated the isolated the engine with no vibration had the drives haft balanced 3 times and sent off to get checked and it is fine. So they isolated it down to the rear differential and tore it down and found a bearing in the carrier that was shot. So they are ordering a new rear differential should be in early next week. They have another car in their with the same issue and found a problem in the rear differential also. Hopefully it fixes it.

wishing you the best of luck on this.

 

[Lo Pony]

All this sounds a little weird. There is no way a carrier bearing would produce the harmonic vibration you're describing.

At least you're getting a new differential - they probably used the carrier bearing excuse just to order a new diff (i.e. what they really found was nothing wrong with it, but are hoping a new diff fixes it). I HOPE they are ordering a new rear driveshaft and pinion flange to go with the new diff? I know you have no control over it, so best of luck and let us know how it goes.

15GT - I apologize for ranting and I am NOT picking on you, but rather on the general lack of problem solving ability that we encounter at dealerships. Where is the skill here? Why send a driveshaft off to be balanced 3 times? Why not start intelligently? Otherwise, it's like throwing darts blindfolded. A driveshaft is either balanced or it isn't. And as I've already mentioned, balancing a driveshaft is NOT the answer - you have to match the shaft balance to offset imbalance and runout at the flange.

Moreover, I wonder in how many cases the hangar bearing is at fault (where the front and rear driveshafts couple)? To me, if everything is aligned and indexed properly and the DS assy. doesn't visibly wiggle when it rotates, the hangar bearing seems like an EXCELLENT place to start replacing things to me if there is even the tiniest bit of slack.

Oh jeez....I'm starting to sound like a broken record.

However, sometimes these things work out. I sure hope you get it fixed, I don't mean to be cynical and I'm wishing you the best of luck. "Crossing my fingers". Please ask them specifically what parts they replace (i.e. diff only, diff assy. with flange, and + or - driveshaft) and report it here.

 

[Lo Pony]

So, here's my "how they fixed it" post. First, we need to realize that there are 2 possible causes for the driveshaft/driveline vibration. The first is out of spec parts- DS, pinion flange are out of round or not straight. The second is out of balance parts- just like a wheel/tire the DS or pinion flange have heavy or light spots. They are supposed to be balanced at the factory but nothing is perfect. It can be either or both of them together.

When I took my car in the first time, they verified the vibration, checked the runout on the DS (out of spec) and installed a new DS. This did not fix it, so they ordered another DS and waited for the Ford rep to be there for the install. This DS was in spec for runout but the car still had the vibration- quite bad at 60mph.The Ford rep had vibration measuring equipment and they balanced the DS on the car after the install. This still did not fix the problem but they didn't have another option to try so I mentioned that replacing the pinion flange had fixed it on Chris' car. Since the vibration was still very evident, the Ford rep said to order the flange. The next time the Ford rep was going to be there, they scheduled it to replace the pinion flange and re-balance the DS again. This fixed it. The picture below shows one of the bolts holding the DS to the flange (there are 6) with a flat washer under the head of the bolt. That is how they add weight to balance the DS on the car. It looks like a regular washer but I'd guess they come in a kit and are pre-weighed. Compared to the weights welded on the DS, these are pretty small so they are really fine-tuning. I wasn't there for any of this so I'm going on what they told me they did- which I believe.

I know they measure the DS and pinion flange for runout to make sure they are both round but I don't know if they check the pinion flange face for runout. If the face of the flange which bolts to the DS is not perfectly flat or exactly 90deg to the pinion axis, then it will make the DS spin in an elliptical pattern and cause vibration. I have no idea what the spec on that should be but I'd guess less than .005in.

Anyways, here is what I'd ask the dealer to do, knowing what we know now-
1) Check runout on the DS and flange- if either is out, replace flange.
2) Check the face of the flange to make sure it is flat and perpendicular to the pinion axis. If out, replace flange.
3) Recheck runout with the new flange. Drive the car and check for vibration. If out, replace DS.
4) Balance DS on the car using the washers.
5) Drive the car at the affected speeds in 5 mph increments on as smooth a section of Hwy as possible and measure vibration levels in the car with the equipment to make sure the vibration has not changed to a different speed/rpm.

If the dealer doesn't have the vibration measuring equipment, or doesn't know how to use it, make sure the Ford rep is there to do it correctly.

Look back at the above post - This is really the ONLY way to fix the problem, but most dealerships will either not be willing or know how to go through this procedure. Like I said - you guys can fix it yourself, and I'll guide you through it step by step. All you need are some jack stands and basic tools, and a vibration app you can download for your iPhone.

 

[347CobraII]

All this sounds a little weird. There is no way a carrier bearing would produce the harmonic vibration you're describing.

At least you're getting a new differential - they probably used the carrier bearing excuse just to order a new diff (i.e. what they really found was nothing wrong with it, but are hoping a new diff fixes it). I HOPE they are ordering a new rear driveshaft and pinion flange to go with the new diff? I know you have no control over it, so best of luck and let us know how it goes.

15GT - I apologize for ranting and I am NOT picking on you, but rather on the general lack of problem solving ability that we encounter at dealerships. Where is the skill here? Why send a driveshaft off to be balanced 3 times? Why not start intelligently? Otherwise, it's like throwing darts blindfolded. A driveshaft is either balanced or it isn't. And as I've already mentioned, balancing a driveshaft is NOT the answer - you have to match the shaft balance to offset imbalance and runout at the flange.

Moreover, I wonder in how many cases the hangar bearing is at fault (where the front and rear driveshafts couple)? To me, if everything is aligned and indexed properly and the DS assy. doesn't visibly wiggle when it rotates, the hangar bearing seems like an EXCELLENT place to start replacing things to me if there is even the tiniest bit of slack.

Oh jeez....I'm starting to sound like a broken record.

However, sometimes these things work out. I sure hope you get it fixed, I don't mean to be cynical and I'm wishing you the best of luck. "Crossing my fingers". Please ask them specifically what parts they replace (i.e. diff only, diff assy. with flange, and + or - driveshaft) and report it here.

YES it can

 

[Norseman71]

Sharing info

Took mine in 2/18 for vibration, they said they felt it but was not balance related
Bring it back when summer wheels are on ( I'm thinking strange as winter wheels are 18" Ford wheels from non PP ecoboost)

I didn't believe them so had them balanced myself - no change

Brought it back 3/15

They put summers on and test drove ( they think it's from the transmission where it joins the driveshaft)

Parts are on order, they have one car that was leaking fluid so it's been there 2 weeks.

They are ordering parts and calling Ford Engineers

Estimate 2 weeks for parts but have offered a rental when the repair is done

Keeping my fingers crossed and will update as more news rolls in.

 

[2016Mustang]

Spoke to my advisor and he stated the isolated the engine with no vibration had the drives haft balanced 3 times and sent off to get checked and it is fine. So they isolated it down to the rear differential and tore it down and found a bearing in the carrier that was shot. So they are ordering a new rear differential should be in early next week. They have another car in their with the same issue and found a problem in the rear differential also. Hopefully it fixes it.

This is the same thing there doing to mine! When you mentioned they have another car with the same issue there getting the diff replaced I thought you were talking about mine but I saw your from NC lol... My cars driveshaft was replaced and the noise was still present. They ended up saying it was some type of bearing from the differential. I should be getting the car back tomorrow, And I will keep you guys posted on exactly what was replaced. And hopefully this resolves the noise

 

[Mako_254]

Are they replacing the whole diff as a unit assembled at the factory or are they rebuilding the diff by replacing the internal components at the dealer?

 

[2016Mustang]

Are they replacing the whole diff as a unit assembled at the factory or are they rebuilding the diff by replacing the internal components at the dealer?

I really doubt there replacing the whole diff, prob replacing the internal bearings

 

[Mach3]

So is there anyone NOT having this problem after thousands of miles?

The poll is split 50-50 but I imagine some said no before the problem showed up. I'm about to buy a mustang but now I'm not so sure

 

[FordTechOne]

So is there anyone NOT having this problem after thousands of miles?

The poll is split 50-50 but I imagine some said no before the problem showed up. I'm about to buy a mustang but now I'm not so sure

One of my associates has a 2015 GT Performance Pack, MT82. I've driven it extensively (6+ hour road trip) and never had any vibration issues.

Just road test the car before you drive it, you'll be fine.

I'm not sure what everyone in here is referring to, as it seems nobody has been able to have a dealer verify the issue or post G readings of the "issue". Some vibration from a sport car with low profile tires and stiff suspension is normal. If someone could post actual G readings of their "vibration" that would greatly assist in determining if it's a vehicle characteristic or a problem.

 

[Alan2955]

Another rental car with vibrations!

After renting a vibrating 2016 Mustang 4 cyl. Convertible in California last month with the dreaded vibration issues, I rented another one in Ft. Lauderdale this month. January 2016 build, 2100 miles, 4 cyl. Convertible. Guess what..the dreaded vibration problem was very evident! On this one it started at about 40 mph, started to blur to rear view mirror at 45 mph, shaking it so bad that you could easily FEEL the vibrations with a hand. Turned into an obnoxious fluttering boom noise around 50 to 65, then got better at higher speeds. This sample also had the air bag warning light on constantly, and an inoperative trunk light!

Ford has really dropped the ball on quality on this new model. Incredible to me that they can't stop building cars with the vibration issues. My 2014 v6 has no such issues, so don't tell me it's due to being a sporty car. How can they put out crap like this for over a year, and act dumb about what the cause is? Counting a test drive I'm 3 for 3 on vibrations on these. I wonder if ANY of them don't vibrate? Sad.

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