Traction control, breaking loose, and countersteer

[NoVaGT]

Empty parking lot or not, law enforcement these days would love to catch someone sliding their car around in a parking lot. Wet, dry or snow they are going to protect and serve the shit out of you.
Better get a lease for the day and rope off the entrances.

Private property.

No worries.

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[ScottsGT]

As long as it's your private property, sure. If not, you better have permission from the property owner/manager. They are the ones that will be sued when stunt driving student flips his car and kills himself and the family is looking for a payday.
Go look at almost any parking lot. Somewhere there is probably one of those signs that grant jurisdiction to the local LE authority.

 

[Freedom]

i drive an auto, and dont decall losing traction ever. good thing about computers ay? XD

 

[CCCP1999]

Glad the OP never drove my modded C6 with it's hard run flats.

 

[stang1971]

these cars are alot to handle for people who arent ready. I would recommend finding a school that can teach you proper techniques. Also, TIRES!!!!....... tires make a huge difference in how a car reacts.

Around KC we have auto x events...... go to a few....learn how to handle the car..... talk to fellow auto x'rs.

you stated you are a shitty driver? you are more than likely a untrained driver.

i have a drag racing and road course racing back ground, and have NO issues when the car wants to get out of control. Its smooth and predictable, but i also have pushed it to the limit to see exactly how it reacts.

 

[RoadDog]

Book yourself a weekend here:

[ame]

Rent this car:

https://www.hertz.com/rentacar/productservice/index.jsp?targetPage=adrenalinecollection.jsp

Pull fuse #62

Make sure your insurance covers rentals, get a helmet (just in case)..

Have fun.

 

[Jay-rod427]

People like me who are good drivers(at being jackasses and borderline out of control). Learned from the recommendations above in younger years. Fish tailing gravel roads, or on wet conditions. After enough time you make proper corrections with throttle and steering wheel without thinking about it. A fellow drag racer once said we learned more how to drive these cars when we were 15 driving 200 hp turds, then we have as adults driving 1,000+ hp cars. You can't teach experience.

 

[Horse]

Generally when a car breaks loose in one direction the instinct is to whip the wheel the other way. Don't do that

Actually I have been curious about this, i.e., what the instinct is in these situations.

For example, let us say that the rear is drifting to the left. In this case, I would say that the driver would feel that the car is turning to the right. So I would speculate that the instinct would be to turn the wheel to the left, which would be the correct move.

If the front is drifting the the left, then the driver would feel that the car is turning to the left, hence instinctively turning the steer wheel to the right, which again is the correct move.

Correct?

Disclaimer: the above is just my pure speculation. I have never experienced such situations where the rear/front got loose. I have never taken driving courses on how to control spinning, etc.. Would like to learn from your experiences. All please fell free to chime in.

:cheers:

 

[Freedom]

Actually I have been curious about this, i.e., what the instinct is in these situations.

For example, let us say that the rear is drifting to the left. In this case, I would say that the driver would feel that the car is turning to the right. So I would speculate that the instinct would be to turn the wheel to the left, which would be the correct move.

If the front is drifting the the left, then the driver would feel that the car is turning to the left, hence instinctively turning the steer wheel to the right, which again is the correct move.

Correct?

Disclaimer: the above is just my pure speculation. I have never experienced such situations where the rear/front got loose. I have never taken driving courses on how to control spinning, etc.. Would like to learn from your experiences. All please fell free to chime in.

:cheers:

thats what i think too, never had to actually do it though. also ive heard that you're not supposed to panic brake either, that causes the mustang memes

 

[Horse]

thats what i think too, never had to actually do it though. also ive heard that you're supposed to panic brake either, that causes the mustang memes

So you are saying/confirming that we should trust our instinct (except the panic braking part of course). Good to know.

 

[Norm Peterson]

Actually I have been curious about this, i.e., what the instinct is in these situations.

For example, let us say that the rear is drifting to the left. In this case, I would say that the driver would feel that the car is turning to the right. So I would speculate that the instinct would be to turn the wheel to the left, which would be the correct move.

Good here. Steer in the direction that you want the car to be going in, aka "steer into the skid", or steer to keep the front of the car in front of where the rear is trying to go.

If the front is drifting the the left, then the driver would feel that the car is turning to the left, hence instinctively turning the steer wheel to the right, which again is the correct move.

More information is needed. If it feels like the front is drifting to the left in a left turn, it's almost certainly a case of the tail running wide to the right. See the above discussion for rear drifting and steer right for that reason.

If you're in a right turn and the front is drifting left enough to clearly notice, you're understeering pretty heavily and cranking the wheel even further to the right could well make a borderline bad situation worse if you're close enough to the front tires' ultimate grip. If you have a little room to let the whole car run wide, you may have other options (at least one of which is counter-intuitive and very much an advanced track-day level technique).


FWIW, don't be riding the brakes through the turn - that uses up tire grip that would be better put toward getting you turned through that corner. Get your slowing down (to a speed you can safely carry through the turn) finished before you're actually in the turn. Slow in, fast out. Braking in a corner should really only happen if you're catching slower traffic in front of you more rapidly than anticipated.


Norm

 

[Horse]

Good here. Steer in the direction that you want the car to be going in, aka "steer into the skid", or steer to keep the front of the car in front of where the rear is trying to go.



More information is needed. If it feels like the front is drifting to the left in a left turn, it's almost certainly a case of the tail running wide to the right. See the above discussion for rear drifting and steer right for that reason.

If you're in a right turn and the front is drifting left enough to clearly notice, you're understeering pretty heavily and cranking the wheel even further to the right could well make a borderline bad situation worse if you're close enough to the front tires' ultimate grip. If you have a little room to let the whole car run wide, you may have other options (at least one of which is counter-intuitive and very much an advanced track-day level technique).


FWIW, don't be riding the brakes through the turn - that uses up tire grip that would be better put toward getting you turned through that corner. Get your slowing down (to a speed you can safely carry through the turn) finished before you're actually in the turn. Slow in, fast out. Braking in a corner should really only happen if you're catching slower traffic in front of you more rapidly than anticipated.


Norm

Thanks Norm. So at least in certain situations counter-intuitive maneuvers are needed. Also, as you mentioned in a previous post, be ready catch the reaction spin in opposite direction.

 

[gov cheese]

http://solo2.com/

Look for an autocross in your area. It is a really good and safe way to find out your cars traction limits. Have applied what i have learned on course about my cars and my driving abilities when things go south on pubic roads. Saved my bacon a couple times when driving next to attention deficit iceholes.

Not my car ........ autocross vid
[ame]

 

[Coyote Red]

Norm knows, and I agree that you can't teach experience, so practice in a private & safe setting will get you better in a while.

 

[Rebellion]

If you're in a right turn and the front is drifting left enough to clearly notice, you're understeering pretty heavily and cranking the wheel even further to the right could well make a borderline bad situation worse if you're close enough to the front tires' ultimate grip. If you have a little room to let the whole car run wide, you may have other options (at least one of which is counter-intuitive and very much an advanced track-day level technique).

Curious to know, which is this technique?

From years of driving trucks on a daily basis (tail happy often), I'm pretty inexperienced with the handling of understeer in a RWD heavy car. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

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