Tabers ProCharged 2015 GT

[flyboy34]

Still waiting for delivery of my car, but find this thread facsinating. What Bath has submitted makes alot of sense.

I wonder if anyone of the tuners/installers has dyno sheets comparing the HP and TQ curves of the two units.

Does the Procharger act more like a turbo, so there is a definite lag in the boost? What RPM do you expect your power curve to come on.

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[ProChargerTECH]

Still waiting for delivery of my car, but find this thread facsinating. What Bath has submitted makes alot of sense.

I wonder if anyone of the tuners/installers has dyno sheets comparing the HP and TQ curves of the two units.

Here you go,

*ProCharger graph from the Evolution build on this forum
**Whipple graph from their company youtube video

 

[AdrianMAK]

Very Nice enjoy the setup.

Your explanantion as to why you chose one over the other should be quoted for future reference. I don't believe I have seen it said better by a customer, hell even some dealers can't explain it that well.

 

[ProChargerTECH]

Very Nice enjoy the setup.

Your explanation as to why you chose one over the other should be quoted for future reference. I don't believe I have seen it said better by a customer, hell even some dealers can't explain it that well.

Ditto.

 

[Kidd]

Does the Procharger act more like a turbo, so there is a definite lag in the boost? What RPM do you expect your power curve to come on.

A centrifugal car just feels like a really really strong n/a car that just keeps pulling (not hard like a turbo car though). Theres really no "lag" because their belt driven so your not waiting for it to spool up like a turbo. Now with that being said; you dont have the brutish low end of pd blower or the violent hit of a turbo that lets you know "I'm in boost". What you do have though is a very predictable, linear power curve that pulls with rpms and still feels strong. When it comes to power a turbo will always make more power per lb of boost then a pd or a centri blower, simply due to 0% parasitic loss. But on a street car you will most likely never know the difference.
I had a turbo on my 07 GT/CS and loved it. But turbos are VERY invasive and in my experience the most problematic of the three fi choices. It seemed I was always chasing an exhaust leak or an oil leak from the turbo.
These coyote motors make such good power down low that I would have to lean towards a centri blower for a street car. If its going to the drag strip a lot maybe a pd blower.
Keep in mind warranty as well. The only fi kit (that I know of) that allows you to keep your factory warranty is the ford racing/roush tvs kit. Hope this helps.

 

[ProChargerTECH]

When it comes to power a turbo will always make more power per lb of boost then a pd or a centri blower, simply due to 0% parasitic loss.

We actually have overcome that with the i-1 ProCharger
Super mega efficient compressor, with no back pressure on the engine exhaust.
AKA: low load on motor, and very high timing threshold. The power per PSI of boost is currently unmatched, on pump gas.

Our 2011 Mustang, runs 10's on just 7.5psi of boost, on 93 octane, with just a blower, and exhaust. (with a stick shift, would be faster if an auto)

Not that we have an i-1 system for the 2015 yet. But just wanted to throw that out there.

 

[Kidd]

We actually have overcome that with the i-1 ProCharger
Super mega efficient compressor, with no back pressure on the engine exhaust.
AKA: low load on motor, and very high timing threshold. The power per PSI of boost is currently unmatched, on pump gas.

Our 2011 Mustang, runs 10's on just 7.5psi of boost, on 93 octane, with just a blower, and exhaust. (with a stick shift, would be faster if an auto)

Not that we have an i-1 system for the 2015 yet. But just wanted to throw that out there.

Thats interesting. Good info for anyone looking at FI.

 

[rio16]

Well, you really just hit the nail on the head, it comes down to personal preference. No one FI option is "best", it simply comes down to how you like power delivered and how much maintenance/install complexity you want to get into. I've had everything from 400whp Turbo 4's, to blown straight 6's:


What it really came down to, for me personally are a few factors:
1) Ease of install (~5hrs)
2) Low Maintenance
3) Power Delivery Characteristics

People get very locked into the "I want more power", especially in the age of internet forums where *cough* "everyone" is making huge numbers. But what you really have to ask yourself, is when you're driving your car, where exactly in the power delivery curve do you actually want more power. For me, I do not need more (Although obviously there will be an addition) off idle power ... I want more peak rpm power. I prefer the linear power delivery and rising boost rate of a centrifugal unit. Its predictable.

I like the future upgrade ability of this kit ... right now I cant see wanting more than 600whp in this car, but if I decide that I want more than that in a year, its completely capable of doing that. People have made 700whp on this kit; and with a simple headunit, tuning, fueling swap, obviously much more is possible. I like how modular this kit is.

In theory, the way boost/power comes on with a centrifugal unit, it SHOULD be easier on drivetrain components - clutch/axles/transmission - I want to enjoy this car, not have a massive project car that is CONSTANTLY breaking things every time I go for a cruise with my girlfriend ... I've owned these in the past, and it gets old quickly. So ask yourself, what are you using your car for, and why do you want more power than this kit is capable of?

What is YOUR power goal? How do YOU drive YOUR car? Do you want more power for the street? The Strip - if so, what kind of times are you looking to achieve? Road course? How much other work do you want to do to your car? What kind of maintenance can you afford? What is your total budget, not just the cost of the blower, but supporting modifications?

Only downside to a centrifgal unit is that when you're dealing with a v8, when you pop the hood everyone at the car show is expecting a big PD blower ... theres no "wow" factor. Other than that, I dont see a benefit to a PD blower ...

Well said bros...:first::amen:

 

[Apollo_1092]

This thread has been a big influence for me in which route I was going to go. I will be joining team ProCharger in the near future. Now to figure out if I want the H.O. with the stage 2 intercooler, or if I just want to go with the entire stage 2 system and call it good.

 

[BathS550]

This thread has been a big influence for me in which route I was going to go. I will be joining team ProCharger in the near future. Now to figure out if I want the H.O. with the stage 2 intercooler, or if I just want to go with the entire stage 2 system and call it good.

I struggled with this issue as well, and for me it really came down to two things:

1) I put ~50k on my shared drive M3, 2 Maine winters, etc and never had a single belt issue leaving me stranded.

2) Retaining the factory tensioner makes sense to me

Im also not certain that there is a right/wrong answer to this.

 

[AdrianMAK]

This thread has been a big influence for me in which route I was going to go. I will be joining team ProCharger in the near future. Now to figure out if I want the H.O. with the stage 2 intercooler, or if I just want to go with the entire stage 2 system and call it good.

That really depends on you ultimate goal with the car. Once you know that, the decision should be relatively easy.

 

[Apollo_1092]

Haha I don't even know that. I have a weird thing where if there are two options, I usually want the "bigger" one even though I don't fully understand the differences between the two. I have been almost obsessing trying to understand. I know the factory tensioner is a big difference in the two system but I don't know if that's good for longevity and stuff like that.

 

[TxBornSooner]

I spoke with some guys at a local shop today. They were advocating for going with stage 2. Their reasoning was that if you go stage 1 then wait a yr or so it will cost significantly more to go to stage 2. (think he said like 2300 more). He also stated if you set up with stage 2 right now if/when you become bored it is as simple as a pulley change.

Stage 2 kit with D1 upgrade
DW 72lb injectors
Diablo intune

install and dyno tune
$8500.

Is that high?

 

[Waldorf]

I want to enjoy this car, not have a massive project car that is CONSTANTLY breaking things every time I go for a cruise with my girlfriend ... I've owned these in the past, and it gets old quickly.

AMEN! Been there, done that, got the T-shirt. It gets very old... very quick. Excellent post, BathS550... says it all.

That is all...

 

[BathS550]

I spoke with some guys at a local shop today. They were advocating for going with stage 2. Their reasoning was that if you go stage 1 then wait a yr or so it will cost significantly more to go to stage 2. (think he said like 2300 more). He also stated if you set up with stage 2 right now if/when you become bored it is as simple as a pulley change.

Stage 2 kit with D1 upgrade
DW 72lb injectors
Diablo intune

install and dyno tune
$8500.

Is that high?

Its as basic as a pulley change (and tuning obviously, but that would be the same with the Stage 2 and a pulley change as well) with the HO kit (up to 650ish whp, then you're dealing with fueling changes)

Amazon tuning has already made 703rwhp on 93 oct with the HO Kit on the standard IC: https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=951489514863749&fref=nf

What are you doing with your car? What are your power goals? - Dont let someone else dictate how much power you need. In a street car, on street tires, 550-600whp is a lot of power.

You need to think about how much power you want, and where you're using your car. I can almost never get to a track, because the closest one is about 3-3.5hrs away from me ... do I go? Sure, a few times a year ... but quarter mile times are not a huge priority for me because its a 6-7hr drive just to get there and back.

Dont let someone else tell you that you're going to get bored with YOUR car. If you bolt on the Pre-Tuned HO kit and make ~550whp, you still have a TON of headroom if you get bored.

You can always do the HO Kit, not stage 2, as a tuner kit with D1 upgrade, and the above mentioned fueling upgrades with the stage 2 intercooler ... but it just depends what you want.

You really just need to decide if you want shared drive or independent drive. There is not exactly a correct answer to this, and you'll find reasonable arguments for both.

That price doesnt seem unrealistic to me, at all ... but keep in mind, with more power you might want to be prepared to replace more parts right away, clutch, etc ...

That being said with some of the vendors on here (I ordered mine from BeefCake and received it in 5 business day) you'll find that the "street price" for the complete HO kit might be a bit less ... but lets just use the price MOST vendors seem to be advertising at $5700 for the HO Kit + $300 for Stage 2 interfooler, you're at $6000

5hr install at $100/hr (Obviously you could do this yourself, some places charge a lot less than this, but lets just use that as an example)

And you're at $6500 TUNED, done. - Now, we all know you can get these kits for less than that, and you could easily install it yourself ... so really you could EASILY be at less than $6000 with ~550whp ... tuned ... with headroom later on to hit 700whp

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