Supercharger Cost Question

[GreenS550]

I haven’t really been in a higher geared coyote but what would this do to highway driving? I know in fox body days that meant highway speeds at 4K

The 18 up have 2, overdrive gears. You could put a 456 in it and it would be fine on the freeway doing maybe 2500 rpm's at 80

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[WhinRR]

The 18 up have 2, overdrive gears. You could put a 456 in it and it would be fine on the freeway doing maybe 2500 rpm's at 80

Not much different then. I’m stock 3.31 and usually around 1800 rpm at 80 mph.

 

[Jackson1320]

@brucelinc I felt the same way after driving the Whipple cal for 20k miles. However, once I started logging data and “seeing what I couldn’t feel” it was surprising how far off things were. The operating strategy of the pcm is fantastic and does a great job of covering up calibration errors, but when you see it adding 5 of spark advance at part throttle and hitting the knock advance limit, you were deprived of 5+ deg of timing advance for 2+ seconds while it catches up. In some places I’ve added up to 10 deg of timing and still no knock, which results in better response and fuel economy at no cost. It was only then that I realized what I was missing before and didn’t know it.

Have you ever data logged the factory tune? I know it works the same way by adding timing at a controlled rate. Just like the aftermarket tunes can. I wonder if there really is much difference in how the timing logs

 

[engineermike]

Stock will learn the octane of the fuel and adjust to it, while most supercharged cals will not.

 

[Stang55]

You have Roots Screw, Twin Screw, and Centrifugal. Centri Superchargers make peak boost at peak RPM whereas Roots Screw or Twin Screw have full boost throughout the RPM range. I found the VMP 2.65 TVS Kit aka loki for 6299 on Black Friday, the Whipple Gen 5 was like 200 bucks more. I think its well worth the money. Not to mention you 60-120 times improving, which is where these kits matter the most on the street.

 

[Epona]

The key to a successful marriage is compromise. I have just demonstrated this in the following way: my wife gets wood flooring throughout out our house: I get to supercharge my 2015 convertible GT!

I am blessed in having a step-son who is quite good with auto mechanics, and would be delighted to install whatever product I chose, free of charge, thereby eliminating a major cost element.

I am therefore asking you, my colleagues, to give me your opinion as to the best type and branch to buy.

Thanks in advance for your advice.

 

[GreenS550]

My experience with procharger, Whipple, Roush, and Vortech have all been just great. Tunes are important as well as the tuner. My recommendation is if you go Whipple you use their tune. If you go with. ProCharger their tune is good as well. Idle mid throttle and wide open throttle is excellent. I'm not a big fan of Lund but that's just been my experience. My Roush was tuned by Brent at Bren speed in me about 600 wheel horsepower on my 2011. I raced that car over a hundred passes and it never failed me. So at this point I would do either a Whipple or ProCharger. If you're installing it yourself the ProCharger is a much much easier install. You're probably looking at all in around 65 to 6,800.

 

[beetle6986]

My experience with procharger, Whipple, Roush, and Vortech have all been just great. Tunes are important as well as the tuner. My recommendation is if you go Whipple you use their tune. If you go with. ProCharger their tune is good as well. Idle mid throttle and wide open throttle is excellent. I'm not a big fan of Lund but that's just been my experience. My Roush was tuned by Brent at Bren speed in me about 600 wheel horsepower on my 2011. I raced that car over a hundred passes and it never failed me. So at this point I would do either a Whipple or ProCharger. If you're installing it yourself the ProCharger is a much much easier install. You're probably looking at all in around 65 to 6,800.

Similar to what you are saying, I think the roots blowers (whipple, roush, edelbrock, etc.) are all pretty close with their power delivery and potential. They are all essentially air pumps that can change the boost using different pullies. There may be more of a difference when you really start pushing them to their limits, but I think it comes down to the tune more than the hardware. I noticed a big difference going from the Roush tune to the VMP tune. I have data logs from both, but haven't really compared them much. One thing I did noticed immediately was the AFR was very rich on the Roush tune (many times in the 10s). The VMP tune has it more dialed in at the 11.5-11.9 range.

There is a big difference with power delivery between the roots style blowers and the Centrifugal blowers. At least with he cars I drive with Centrifugal blowers there was more lag whereas the Roots blowers are almost instant power.

 

[Veteran]

One other often-overlooked thing when talking cost is the calibration. The oem spends huge sums of money perfecting the “tune” with a team of engineers and specialists, simulation programs, and a bank of dynos running 24/7. If you look at the calibration of, say, a stock 5.0 engine it is absolutely optimized and clear that a great deal of effort went into it. Conversely, if you look at any aftermarket supercharged calibration (even 3rd party), it’s clear that orders of magnitude less time and effort went into them. To most, the difference is either unnoticeable or not significant, but the oem would never let one out the door like that. However, if we wanted an oem-quality calibration we would probably have to be willing to pay double for the kits and I just don’t know anyone willing to do that.

Not saying you’re wrong, and a late reply to boot, but if oem is so good, why is the Roush not even mentioned in the FI forum ?
also oem has to comply with emissions. So I dunno how performance optimised it is ?.

 

[engineermike]

Not saying you’re wrong, and a late reply to boot, but if oem is so good, why is the Roush not even mentioned in the FI forum ?

Are you saying that roush is an oem?

 

[Veteran]

Are you saying that roush is an oem?

No but Roush is the oem approved SC. That said they would do some serious testing before endorsing it. So about as close oem as you can get. Only the gt500 is pure oem.

 

[engineermike]

No but Roush is the oem approved SC. That said they would do some serious testing before endorsing it. So about as close oem as you can get. Only the gt500 is pure oem.

Ive looked at the Roush and Predator calibrations and the Roush is not even close to Predator. Coyote is actually significantly more developed than Predator. I don’t think Ford-proper would sell or warranty a car with the Roush cal.

 

[beetle6986]

Not saying you’re wrong, and a late reply to boot, but if oem is so good, why is the Roush not even mentioned in the FI forum ?
also oem has to comply with emissions. So I dunno how performance optimised it is ?.

They're mentioned a bunch in the FI forum. The Roush thread is probably the busiest thread with 600 pages. The advantage the Roush has over the others is the warranty. However, they warranty it because their tune is extremely conservative. The oem Roush tune does hold them back performance wise. An aftermarket tune solves that issue once the warranty has expired.

 

[Veteran]

They're mentioned a bunch in the FI forum. The Roush thread is probably the busiest thread with 600 pages. The advantage the Roush has over the others is the warranty. However, they warranty it because their tune is extremely conservative. The oem Roush tune does hold them back performance wise. An aftermarket tune solves that issue once the warranty has expired.

My bad, I was under the impression Roush falls under factory warranty system.

 

[brucelinc]

Ford does have the Roush kit in their accessory catalog and they do put their name on the blower but the warranty is all Roush Performance.

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