Questioning Gen 2 voodoo reliability

[derklink]

I was in the same position (a year ago, I had a deposit on a 2019 GT350 with 1,200 miles for $65k). Went with a Mach 1 for peace of mind (admittedly, I got spooked by the internet rumor mill regarding the Voodoo's reliability) and more useable power band in street driving conditions.

Younger me would have gotten the GT350 in a heartbeat. Driving the Shelby is a thrilling and very emotional experience but I decided it was overkill for the street. My Mach 1 gives my everything my middle-aged heart needs and then some. Do I still think about the GT350? Yes!

Only you can decide. If I could go back in time to that day I decided to cancel my deposit for the GT350, I'd not make that phone call and pick up that sweet car.

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[Cobra Jet]

I believe what also needs to be touched on is that a GT350 sitting in a garage that isn’t being driven is no better than one that is being driven when it comes to the engine reliability.

You don’t know if a low mile engine will let loose or has an issue if it’s not being driven, it’s fact. You can have the best shiniest low mileage mothballed vehicle, and BOOM, one day there goes that VooDoo… Oh and that “warranty”, yep by then it’s expired by years or mileage whatever came first…. So now you’re talking out of pocket expense anyway. Most of these specialty vehicles where owners have purchased “extended” warranties - many of those expire by the years provision than the mileage provision….

IMO, the absolute FIRST thing any potential buyer of an S550 GT350 OR GT500 whether high or low mileage should do is make for 100% certain this TSB was done to the vehicle for affected years. GT350 Timing Chain TSB thread if you have not seen it:
https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/tsb-for-secondary-cam-chain-tensioner.158799/

The second thing to do is if the GT350 is on a Ford Dealer’s lot, tell them you want to review the complete OASIS report. That report will show any Buy Back, any repairs outside of warranty, any warranty repairs done if serviced by any Ford Dealer in the US and if the vehicle had or has an existing maintenance or warranty contract in effect. It will also have the vehicle’s warranty start date as well as other pertinent info.

3rd - Just because the GT350 has reported engine issues found on multiple forums - does NOT mean that EVERY GT350 will have that issue. My beginning statement about a low mile example possibly having an engine issue is to put that possibility out there. I say that because many people have this preconceived notion that garaged low mileage vehicles won’t have any issues because they weren’t driven…. BULLSHIT. Does engine and trans failures happen? Sure it does, across ALL vehicle brands, years, models regardless of documented mileage or condition.

4th - Extended Warranties - Be sure to totally review the entire Contract provisions and more importantly what that Contract does not and will not cover. There’s already a big thread in here with another member going through hell trying to get a trans claim processed on his GT350. The Warranty Co is denying his repair. That can all be read about in this very forum.

5th - if buying the vehicle across state lines and you can’t visit or see the GT350 in person before putting money down on it or signing papers - Do yourself a favor, invest a few bucks in an Appraisal/Inspection Service to get an independent transparent review of the vehicle. Too many people have received a Brand XYZ vehicle that was not in advertised condition and were taken advantage of with no recourse.

 

[Shanksfornothin]

I believe what also needs to be touched on is that a GT350 sitting in a garage that isn’t being driven is no better than one that is being driven when it comes to the engine reliability.

You don’t know if a low mile engine will let loose or has an issue if it’s not being driven, it’s fact. You can have the best shiniest low mileage mothballed vehicle, and BOOM, one day there goes that VooDoo… Oh and that “warranty”, yep by then it’s expired by years or mileage whatever came first…. So now you’re talking out of pocket expense anyway. Most of these specialty vehicles where owners have purchased “extended” warranties - many of those expire by the years provision than the mileage provision….

IMO, the absolute FIRST thing any potential buyer of an S550 GT350 OR GT500 whether high or low mileage should do is make for 100% certain this TSB was done to the vehicle for affected years. GT350 Timing Chain TSB thread if you have not seen it:
https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/tsb-for-secondary-cam-chain-tensioner.158799/

The second thing to do is if the GT350 is on a Ford Dealer’s lot, tell them you want to review the complete OASIS report. That report will show any Buy Back, any repairs outside of warranty, any warranty repairs done if serviced by any Ford Dealer in the US and if the vehicle had or has an existing maintenance or warranty contract in effect. It will also have the vehicle’s warranty start date as well as other pertinent info.

3rd - Just because the GT350 has reported engine issues found on multiple forums - does NOT mean that EVERY GT350 will have that issue. My beginning statement about a low mile example possibly having an engine issue is to put that possibility out there. I say that because many people have this preconceived notion that garaged low mileage vehicles won’t have any issues because they weren’t driven…. BULLSHIT. Does engine and trans failures happen? Sure it does, across ALL vehicle brands, years, models regardless of documented mileage or condition.

4th - Extended Warranties - Be sure to totally review the entire Contract provisions and more importantly what that Contract does not and will not cover. There’s already a big thread in here with another member going through hell trying to get a trans claim processed on his GT350. The Warranty Co is denying his repair. That can all be read about in this very forum.

5th - if buying the vehicle across state lines and you can’t visit or see the GT350 in person before putting money down on it or signing papers - Do yourself a favor, invest a few bucks in an Appraisal/Inspection Service to get an independent transparent review of the vehicle. Too many people have received a Brand XYZ vehicle that was not in advertised condition and were taken advance of with no recourse.

All good info to think about, I didn’t know about the OASIS that’s really good to know thank you!

 

[svttim]

Might as well add my 2 cents. I have owned a 16 and the 19. Both are still running strong. A source at Ford, who will not be named for obvious reasons has told me they had about a 4% failure rate for Gen 1 and about 1% for Gen 2. Take that for what its worth. There has been extensive research here that highlights the differences between generations. There were changes made for reliability issues. The race teams that used the Vodoo stopped using they because the do take more maintenance AND IMSA puts restrictions to make sure everyone is competitive. There was no advantage to the Vodoo at that point. But, they also won the Championship. For a track car there is no better. Having driven both the coyote and the vodoo on track the coyote in stock form feels like a dog. But for street use, Id probably opt for the Mach 1.

 

[WItoTX]

Might as well add my 2 cents. I have owned a 16 and the 19. Both are still running strong. A source at Ford, who will not be named for obvious reasons has told me they had about a 4% failure rate for Gen 1 and about 1% for Gen 2. Take that for what its worth. There has been extensive research here that highlights the differences between generations. There were changes made for reliability issues. The race teams that used the Vodoo stopped using they because the do take more maintenance AND IMSA puts restrictions to make sure everyone is competitive. There was no advantage to the Vodoo at that point. But, they also won the Championship. For a track car there is no better. Having driven both the coyote and the vodoo on track the coyote in stock form feels like a dog. But for street use, Id probably opt for the Mach 1.

Who at Ford? Not a name, but a title would help.
4%. What is that relative to? What is the Gen I, II, and III Coyote failure rate? How did Ford determine cause of failure? What % of failures a human error vs legit metal on metal contact due to a design issue?

All things considered, 4% to 1% is a pretty massive improvement.

 

[pilotgore]

Might as well add my 2 cents. I have owned a 16 and the 19. Both are still running strong. A source at Ford, who will not be named for obvious reasons has told me they had about a 4% failure rate for Gen 1 and about 1% for Gen 2. Take that for what its worth. There has been extensive research here that highlights the differences between generations. There were changes made for reliability issues. The race teams that used the Vodoo stopped using they because the do take more maintenance AND IMSA puts restrictions to make sure everyone is competitive. There was no advantage to the Vodoo at that point. But, they also won the Championship. For a track car there is no better. Having driven both the coyote and the vodoo on track the coyote in stock form feels like a dog. But for street use, Id probably opt for the Mach 1.

I’m curious, did you drive the Mach 1 on track or was it a GT with the coyote? Auto or manual? My home track in the 350 I’d be at 8150rpm right at 2 big braking zones, so the thought of being stuck at 7,500 rpm’s kinda sucked, but I figured the low end torque would be helpful is a few other areas. I’d be curious what your lap time differences were between the two (if you were at the same track.)

 

[Angrey]

Who at Ford? Not a name, but a title would help.
4%. What is that relative to? What is the Gen I, II, and III Coyote failure rate? How did Ford determine cause of failure? What % of failures a human error vs legit metal on metal contact due to a design issue?

All things considered, 4% to 1% is a pretty massive improvement.

Again, stats like this can be nefarious. Seems like when the Gen1 first came out, they were handing out replacement motors like candy for consumption. Then it got REALLY difficult to prove excessive consumption. It's not controversial to say that what Ford/Stealerships would label as excessive before became "that's normal" just like we've observed with the infamous "tick"

 

[WItoTX]

Again, stats like this can be nefarious. Seems like when the Gen1 first came out, they were handing out replacement motors like candy for consumption. Then it got REALLY difficult to prove excessive consumption. It's not controversial to say that what Ford/Stealerships would label as excessive before became "that's normal" just like we've observed with the infamous "tick"

Oh I agree. I am genuinely curious of title though, because if it's their accountant, there is no way I would rely on that 4% vs 1%. Now, if it's an R&D engineer, well is that because he did so much more R&D on the 2015-2018 VooDoo's?

I think the flaws have been proven. The handful of changes in 2019-2020 as best I can tell, have a negligible impact.

 

[JAJ]

Hmmm... I'm just glad that at least 96% of the Voodoo's were fine...

 

[Nfs1000f]

Again, stats like this can be nefarious. Seems like when the Gen1 first came out, they were handing out replacement motors like candy for consumption. Then it got REALLY difficult to prove excessive consumption. It's not controversial to say that what Ford/Stealerships would label as excessive before became "that's normal" just like we've observed with the infamous "tick"

Number of failed engines were overrepresented on this forum. It is human nature to vent and find people to listen to you, and no better place than here. I think 4% is probably accurate.

 

[svttim]

Oh I agree. I am genuinely curious of title though, because if it's their accountant, there is no way I would rely on that 4% vs 1%. Now, if it's an R&D engineer, well is that because he did so much more R&D on the 2015-2018 VooDoo's?

I think the flaws have been proven. The handful of changes in 2019-2020 as best I can tell, have a negligible impact.

The changes in the heads around cylinder 8 I believe because of cooling that was to prevent previous failures. Id have to dig it up again. As for the percentages, I did state take it for what its worth. But it was not an accountant.

The cars we tracked were the school cars at the Ford Racing School. They were track prepped GTs. The prior day was the 350s. There were no Mach 1s at that time. Oddly in all my track time I have never run with a GT.

 

[Kachow]

My motor let loose at Road Atlanta on the back straight. Had the "low engine oil pressure" light come on, looked at my oil pressure, was pegged at zero which wasn't good because I was going 130+.

Pulled into the pits and it sounded like a bucket a bolts. Ford tech tore it apart, oil pump gear was sheared in half (This is not uncommon for the Voodoo).

I did not treat my GT350 unlike any of my other track cars. ESP replaced the motor and I sold it, bought a Honda Civic Type R for this years track season and for our incoming first child. Is it the Shelby? No. Did I take it to Road Atlanta last Saturday and then drive it home after? Yes.

The 350 was a pain the ass but I loved it. There is nothing like the sound of that Voodoo at 8200. Nothing. It is an experience, whole car vibrates. It's so racey. It is special.

For you particular case being that this will be a DD, you DONT want to buy the warranty, you seem concerned you won't be able to enjoy it with that thought in the back of your head, etc etc - I would steer clear of the 350. Driving a car shouldn't be stressful and full of what ifs in my opinion.

I felt okay knowing I had the warranty, it wasn't my dd, and we had other cars in case it went down.

Would I do it all over again when our little one grows up? Maybe. The grabber limes do something to me......

 

[matthewr87]

I did not treat my GT350 unlike any of my other track cars. ESP replaced the motor and I sold it, bought a Honda Civic Type R for this years track season and for our incoming first child. Is it the Shelby? No. Did I take it to Road Atlanta last Saturday and then drive it home after? Yes.

Just FYI for any new or soon-to-be parents here (who will require a rear facing seat from 1 to 2.5 years-ish once the kid gets too big to fit in any of the newborn removable buckets). You can buy one of these and it makes getting the kid in and out of any two door car much easier: https://www.gracobaby.com/car-seats...2me-3-in-1-rotating-car-seat/SAP_2204044.html

I swivel the seat forward for loading and then turn it around so it is rear-facing for transport. Works very well.

 

[Jetset335]

I'm with Kachow, Buy a 2019+ with ESP and drive it. I looked at 5 350's before I bought. 2 had replacement motors, both were heavily tracked. I talked to 2 local Ford dealer service departments and both said the Voodoo engine is reliable in their opinion. I've had a good relationship with both them for 25 years or more. So I bought 2019 with 2k mile and ESP that expires in 2030. Chances are I'm never going to need it..... IMO I have about a 1-2% of using it, but who knows I might need it tomorrow?

 

[MAGS1]

Just FYI for any new or soon-to-be parents here (who will require a rear facing seat from 1 to 2.5 years-ish once the kid gets too big to fit in any of the newborn removable buckets). You can buy one of these and it makes getting the kid in and out of any two door car much easier: https://www.gracobaby.com/car-seats...2me-3-in-1-rotating-car-seat/SAP_2204044.html

I swivel the seat forward for loading and then turn it around so it is rear-facing for transport. Works very well.

Where was this seat 10-15 years ago when my kids were little!

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