Potential Clutch Issue? Lethal LPX-HD

[Zrussian13]

Looking for feedback on my current setup as I am experiencing some complications and I'm wondering has anyone else experienced this as well.

Ben Calimer Built (Stg 3) MT82/ Lethal LPX-HD Clutch. Alum flywheel. Both brand new and installed along with other goodies last march, about 5 track passes on the setup.

I took the car to the track back in late Sept. after a pass I noticed when clutch pressed in that the car didn't want to let go of first gear, I didn't think much of it then till now. Now it's starting to do it daily driving, not wanting to let go of several gears unless I am double clutching it, and even then it may not let the gear go. Odd thing is when I am running the car hard I don't have any issues. But when I am normal driving seems like I am having a bunch of resistance when changing gears. Any idea? Is the clutch going bad already? It doesn't feel like it is slipping.

My guess is clutch is fine and you still have a little air in the lines. Probably not enough you need to rebleed the slave, as long as it was bench bleed the first time. My lpx-hd was very similar for the whole first winter with it. 1st, maybe second and reverse were hard to go into and out if gear sometimes. Slow driving especially low gears felt notchy or like there was resistance. And banging gears at 8k were absolutely no problem. Summer came and clutch felt perfect. Now thats its cold again I was wondering what issues I would have but it's been pretty solid so far. Goes in gear easy, no notchy resistance and still bangs 8k shifts no problem. Only thing it is doing is sometimes is sticking in gear, only 1st and 2nd, and only going really slow basically almost lugging the motor. I have around 25k miles on the clutch now.

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[Whitewalkers550]

slave issue for sure, had the same issue with mine, i got a bad slave that was binding causing the issue, replaced it and no issues since

 

[NGOT8R]

slave issue for sure, had the same issue with mine, i got a bad slave that was binding causing the issue, replaced it and no issues since

Bad as in right out of the box? Bench bleed procedure done as well?

 

[Whitewalkers550]

Bad as in right out of the box? Bench bleed procedure done as well?

yup bad right out of the box i had bench bled and everything pulled the trans 3 times trying to figure it out finally worked the lave by hand slowly and felt it catching and got it warrantied

 

[15Oxford5oh]

slave issue for sure, had the same issue with mine, i got a bad slave that was binding causing the issue, replaced it and no issues since

Yea i'll be dropping my car off monday and seeing what's the deal. Talked with Mcleoud, they say if the clutch is bad they will warranty it and send it rebuilt. Free of charge, I am hopping I don't have to deal with the hassle of my car just sitting up there at the shop so hopefully the slave cylinder took a dump. Will keep you guys posted.

 

[ProfessorV8]

Was this ever resolved? I just put a Stage 2 Calimer trans and a McLeod street clutch in my car and I’m having the same issues. Feels like I’m hitting a wall when trying to go into first or reverse from a stop. I can usually get it by sitting on the pedal for a few seconds or shifting from 3rd to 1st. I have no issues when I’m WOT shifting. Also sometimes I can feel a slight nibble when shifting into other gears and have to wait for rpm’s to drop slightly before it’ll slide into gear. This is all happening under normal driving… I pulled the trans last week and put my stock clutch back in with a brand new TOB and SS clutch line to see if maybe the clutch was faulty but getting same issue?? I’m gonna try vacuum bleeding the reservoir today and see if that helps, but I’m at a loss. Only other thing I can think is bad pilot bearing or something is messed up on this trans because the car drove perfect before the swap…minus 4th gear that was going out in my old trans. Any input would be appreciated!!

 

[silverbullet85]

Are these mt82d-4 trans you guys are having issues with? I had the same issue on my 19gt with a mantic cerametalic clutch. Wouldn't shift out of first most of the time, dropped the trans 3 times to make sure the tob was bled properly, no go. 8k shifting was perfect but around town was horrible. I installed the stock clutch and never had a problem like it again. I believe the tob clearance to the clutch isn't setup properly on some aftermarket clutches and need to be shimmed, but none say to do so that I've seen

 

[Zrussian13]

Are these mt82d-4 trans you guys are having issues with? I had the same issue on my 19gt with a mantic cerametalic clutch. Wouldn't shift out of first most of the time, dropped the trans 3 times to make sure the tob was bled properly, no go. 8k shifting was perfect but around town was horrible. I installed the stock clutch and never had a problem like it again. I believe the tob clearance to the clutch isn't setup properly on some aftermarket clutches and need to be shimmed, but none say to do so that I've seen

I wondered the same thing while I was dealing with this issue. Another thing i noticed is the clearances between the floater plate, first disc and flywheel play a big part in the issue. I think quality control is garbage with most brands and engagement is hit or miss.

 

[15Oxford5oh]

UPDATE: Floater plate had a few areas of warping on it, disc 1 and disc 2 also showed some heat marks and scoring. Sent the clutch off to McLeoud and it's been sitting there ever since. I'll listen out for them and see what they ultimately say is the problem, in the interim I hated playing the long waiting game so i ordered a Vengeance Stage 2 clutch and I am waiting for it to be built and shipped to me now. Keep you guys updated along the way.

 

[merrillt_12]

UPDATE: Floater plate had a few areas of warping on it, disc 1 and disc 2 also showed some heat marks and scoring. Sent the clutch off to McLeoud and it's been sitting there ever since. I'll listen out for them and see what they ultimately say is the problem, in the interim I hated playing the long waiting game so i ordered a Vengeance Stage 2 clutch and I am waiting for it to be built and shipped to me now. Keep you guys updated along the way.

Any updates on the vengeance vs lpxhd? Interested to see how they compare.

 

[15Oxford5oh]

Any updates on the vengeance vs lpxhd? Interested to see how they compare.

So McLeoud ended up sending me a new clutch free of charge, from the failure of the LPX-HD on their part. I ended up going with Vengeance Stage 2 in the meantime while waiting.

Vengeance Clutch had been feeling solid for about a month of breaking it in. (Currently only 800 miles on it) Now the same kind of problem is starting, car is not letting go of Reverse/1st-2nd gear notchy with it also not wanting to release 1st. gear... 3/4- 5/6 also have moments of resistance when shifting, unless the car is completely shut off then I have no problem going into any gear. I'll have to put the car back in the air, a new slave cylinder was installed everytime the trans was dropped. I am expecting it to be either a pilot bearing has failed, slave cylinder randomly took at dump, or the brand new clutch is toast. Doesn't make sense and it seems I'm having a case of bad luck with the setup all together. Keep you guys posted.

 

[merrillt_12]

So McLeoud ended up sending me a new clutch free of charge, from the failure of the LPX-HD on their part. I ended up going with Vengeance Stage 2 in the meantime while waiting.

Vengeance Clutch had been feeling solid for about a month of breaking it in. (Currently only 800 miles on it) Now the same kind of problem is starting, car is not letting go of Reverse/1st-2nd gear notchy with it also not wanting to release 1st. gear... 3/4- 5/6 also have moments of resistance when shifting, unless the car is completely shut off then I have no problem going into any gear. I'll have to put the car back in the air, a new slave cylinder was installed everytime the trans was dropped. I am expecting it to be either a pilot bearing has failed, slave cylinder randomly took at dump, or the brand new clutch is toast. Doesn't make sense and it seems I'm having a case of bad luck with the setup all together. Keep you guys posted.

Yeah that is odd. I’m having the same issues with my lpx and I was able to somewhat solve it with a stainless steel line and vacuum bleeding the master cylinder but it’s not perfect and still catches sometimes the same way yours is. Sometimes I’m locked out completely at a stop.

 

[15Oxford5oh]

Yeah that is odd. I’m having the same issues with my lpx and I was able to somewhat solve it with a stainless steel line and vacuum bleeding the master cylinder but it’s not perfect and still catches sometimes the same way yours is. Sometimes I’m locked out completely at a stop.

Yea i'll be glad when I can actually get to enjoying the car again, I sometimes have to shut the car off too. I haven't even had time to play in it because it keeps running into road blocks during the break in period. I'm gonna have everything inspected, bench bleed it/vacuum bleed it. Then go from there.

 

[J17GT]

I've had these same issues and quirks with a LPX and LPX HD. I find it really hard to believe that we are all dealing with air trapped in our hydraulics. I just don't believe it... I bench bled the slave, replaced slaves, vacuum bled the system, installed a stainless clutch line, pushed the clutch pedal thousands of times, all the typical stuff people try. Like others, it always felt decent when new, but during break-in or shortly after, it started to get worse and worse. I had zero issues with the stock clutch setup.

The reason why you don't notice it as much when new is that the clutch material is thicker. As you break the clutch in during the first 500-1000 miles, you wear off some initial material and the clutch discs become thinner. So when the clutch is fully engaged, the pressure plate fingers are actually a little further out as the clutch wears in. Which means the pressure plate fingers need to travel a bit further to fully disengage the clutch than it did when new. Well, you only get so much travel of the slave cylinder due to our hydraulic clutch system only pushing 'X' amount of fluid when you push the clutch pedal all the way down. So, technically you are not pushing the pressure plate clutch fingers in as much as you were when it was new to disengage the clutch. (hopefully this makes sense, I might not be explaining this all that well)

As others have mentioned, high rpm shifting was always fine. I think there is some voodoo magic happening with airflow when the clutch is spinning at 7000+rpms that is assisting in the disengagement of the clutch discs. (total guess on that, but maybe there is some truth to it)

I had issues with my MT82 and moved over to a Magnum XL. I installed a McLeod RXT setup with that trans and I'm having better luck with it, but it's not perfect either as the engagement is strange at times. Sometimes friction point will be close to the floor, other times it's midway or high on the pedal. I know my slave cylinder is sitting in the right place as I took all the measurements that McLeod suggested. I'm guessing the floater plate between the clutch discs is dragging at times. High rpm shifts are always fine.

Morale of the story in my opinion, either QC is garbage at McLeod (they make the LPX line), or the clutches are just setup wrong for these cars from the get go, or there is some strange variability from car to car where the slave is siting in relation to the clutch pressure plate (if it's sitting too far away from the pressure plate, that spells trouble for disengagement, too close is not good either). The clutch air gap to disengage is very small, so even very minor variability can make a big difference the way the clutch behaves.

Sorry for the long post. Maybe some of this helps in making sense of it or I could be totally wrong in my thinking. It does seem hit or miss across all clutch manufacturers. Some love their setup and things work as expected, but then the next guy has all sorts of trouble. Frustrating for sure considering what this stuff costs and the effort involved!

 

[Zrussian13]

Does anyone else's issues go away after hard pulls? If I open my gt up and run it hard through at least top end of 3rd gear, my clutch pedal is soft and shifting is buttery smooth for the rest of my drive. No engagement issues from a stop after that. Next drive I have to open her up to get that silky feel back.

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