Phenolic thermal spacer for PD

[BlownGP]

After my FI interchiller setup, when I mash the IAT2 goes DOWN not up. When cruising and the blowe is largely in bypass, the IAT2's still hover just above ambient (once it's fully heat soaked) but once I mash the go lever, I can watch the IAT2's start dropping........quickly.

It's a weird phenomenon that I've tried to make sense of, but I guess with the motor at low load, the air charge doesn't have enough density or dwell time to get fully cooled as it flies by the intercooler core. Once the air load goes higher and boost is created, it must somehow greatly improve the thermal transfer inside the intercooler brick.

I have yet to install a temp sensor on my IC system so to have all the information that's probably a next step at some point. I just don't have any external gauges outside of boost gauge anymore (Ngauge is gone) so I'm not sure where I'd send the output and I don't want to add to the instrumentation.

Point is, I'm seeing IAT2 drop under a pull, not rise.

I think I've seen you post that before.

It definitely is strange but at the same time your theory makes sense.
What blower do you have?

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[Ruiner46]

After my FI interchiller setup, when I mash the IAT2 goes DOWN not up. When cruising and the blowe is largely in bypass, the IAT2's still hover just above ambient (once it's fully heat soaked) but once I mash the go lever, I can watch the IAT2's start dropping........quickly.

It's a weird phenomenon that I've tried to make sense of, but I guess with the motor at low load, the air charge doesn't have enough density or dwell time to get fully cooled as it flies by the intercooler core. Once the air load goes higher and boost is created, it must somehow greatly improve the thermal transfer inside the intercooler brick.

I have yet to install a temp sensor on my IC system so to have all the information that's probably a next step at some point. I just don't have any external gauges outside of boost gauge anymore (Ngauge is gone) so I'm not sure where I'd send the output and I don't want to add to the instrumentation.

Point is, I'm seeing IAT2 drop under a pull, not rise.

The reason is during cruise and idle, most of the air in the manifold is recycled through the bypass. The IAT's dropping when the throttle is mashed is simply the inflow of a bunch of outside air at near ambient temps which is then further cooled through the IC.

 

[Angrey]

I think I've seen you post that before.

It definitely is strange but at the same time your theory makes sense.
What blower do you have?

Gen5 3.0.

 

[illtal]

I had the Harrop spacers on my 2650, they are fantastic. I dropped 25 degrees on average and temps where never above 10 over ambient unless continuous flogging

 

[DougS550]

After my FI interchiller setup, when I mash the IAT2 goes DOWN not up. When cruising and the blowe is largely in bypass, the IAT2's still hover just above ambient (once it's fully heat soaked) but once I mash the go lever, I can watch the IAT2's start dropping........quickly.

It's a weird phenomenon that I've tried to make sense of, but I guess with the motor at low load, the air charge doesn't have enough density or dwell time to get fully cooled as it flies by the intercooler core. Once the air load goes higher and boost is created, it must somehow greatly improve the thermal transfer inside the intercooler brick.

I have yet to install a temp sensor on my IC system so to have all the information that's probably a next step at some point. I just don't have any external gauges outside of boost gauge anymore (Ngauge is gone) so I'm not sure where I'd send the output and I don't want to add to the instrumentation.

Point is, I'm seeing IAT2 drop under a pull, not rise.

I am currently running 14lbs boost but switching to 16 over the winter. What is your coolant temps going into your blower? In stop and go traffic mine goes to around upper 30s to low 40s with A/C off and upper 40s to low 50s with A/C on in stop and go traffic. When I cruise it does drop some more.
- Did you install plenum Heat Spacers on yours yet? Just for added benefit I will install a set this winter, but I will have to modify/extend the whipple pulley mount upper leg to make up the difference in increased height. Take care

 

[Angrey]

I am currently running 14lbs boost but switching to 16 over the winter. What is your coolant temps going into your blower? In stop and go traffic mine goes to around upper 30s to low 40s with A/C off and upper 40s to low 50s with A/C on in stop and go traffic. When I cruise it does drop some more.
- Did you install plenum Heat Spacers on yours yet? Just for added benefit I will install a set this winter, but I will have to modify/extend the whipple pulley mount upper leg to make up the difference in increased height. Take care

It's a bit apples/oranges. I didn't set the IC up the way they recommended. I retained my heat exchanger so that if the A/C system ever takes a shit (which it already has thanks to Ford's ****ed up continued contracts with parts suppliers) I'm not stuck. So essentially, my setup is for more sustained use than maximizing low IAT's for a single drag pass. I have my loop setup in series, so heated fluid goes from the blower/intercooler, through the heat exchanger, then from the heat exchanger through the chiller, then from the chiller to a rear mounted reservoir/pump, and then it gets routed back to the blower in a series loop.

By keeping the Whipple HE, what happens is that if the fluid leaving the intercooler is still below ambient, then the Heat Exchanger acts like a heat source (actually heats the fluid rather than cooling it). The end result is that my entire system won't be able to achieve the lower IAT's, however, not only am I setup with fallback redundancy (if the IC goes out, I'm back to "normal" and the tune is setup to run without the IC), but also, while I won't get the icy cold IAT's I can run my car harder longer and not end up with elevated IAT's (essentially I'm setup to run long and hard and have a more narrow band of fluid temps, rather than a few pulls at low fluid temps and then have it steadily climb).

It's quite the marketing myth that for guys on E85, that having super chilly IAT's makes much of a difference. My setup on 19 lbs and E85 is fairly temp knock resistant and it's only in the high triple digits that experienced tuners start to worry about pulling timing (on E85). Pump 93 is another matter. But for E85, you don't start seeing heat induced timing reductions until you're 140,150,160F.

I never wanted chilly IAT's, I just wanted them to not climb to high triple digits under sustained, continuous, back to back to back use. And as such, my system works as I intended for it to work.

I only see sub ambient IAT's when the car is cold and warming to equilibrium, after that, behaves pretty similarly to without the IC (steadily rising at stop lights in hot traffic). But curiously, once I mash and the bypass closes and boost builds, the IAT's on my rips don't go up, they go DOWN, rapidly. I've tried to explain or rationalize it and the only thing I can come up with is that when it's not making boost, the incoming air doesn't have enough time to "dwell" across the intercooler. Or maybe it's a thermal exchange effect that denser air allows more exchange (or both).

In any case, I run mine all the time with cabin A/C on (it's South Florida) so I haven't tried to get any data with turning off the cabin loop.

I haven't tried or even seen anyone with data on the phenolic spacers for a whipple. I'm assuming they're not worth much benefit given that virtually no one utilizes them.

 

[markmurfie]

https://mainforceperformance-com.myshopify.com/products/ford-coyote-and-fpv-miami-intake-spacers

I believe its these. MFP just restocked them in August. I got mine from VMP when they sold them.
Huge difference in manifold IAT. on hot 95*+ days at the drag strip, I think I went from 135-140* down to 105-110*. Nothing I tried made as much of a difference.

Not sure about the Harrop gaskets, they may work, they may not be thick enough. Those 7mm thick spacers were not what I would call a gasket. lol. You can contact MFP and get custom thicknesses.

Ice chest in the trunk or interchiller was the next step past these, but for the price modding a simple street driven pump gas car, those spacers worked.

 

[DougS550]

https://mainforceperformance-com.myshopify.com/products/ford-coyote-and-fpv-miami-intake-spacers

I believe its these. MFP just restocked them in August. I got mine from VMP when they sold them.
Huge difference in manifold IAT. on hot 95*+ days at the drag strip, I think I went from 135-140* down to 105-110*. Nothing I tried made as much of a difference.

Not sure about the Harrop gaskets, they may work, they may not be thick enough. Those 7mm thick spacers were not what I would call a gasket. lol. You can contact MFP and get custom thicknesses.

Ice chest in the trunk or interchiller was the next step past these, but for the price modding a simple street driven pump gas car, those spacers worked.

I know what you mean. I called Harrop and the guy measured them and said they looked like plastic and were 4mm thick. That to me is very thin. FI Intetchillers are not plastic but would not tell me what material they were made of. and they said theirs are 10mm thick and they give insulation for the underside of my whipple. I will probably go with them and buy 10mm longer bolts for the whipple and extend the front pulley mount upper bolt leg.

 

[illtal]

I know what you mean. I called Harrop and the guy measured them and said they looked like plastic and were 4mm thick. That to me is very thin. FI Intetchillers are not plastic but would not tell me what material they were made of. and they said theirs are 10mm thick and they give insulation for the underside of my whipple. I will probably go with them and buy 10mm longer bolts for the whipple and extend the front pulley mount upper bolt leg.

They are 3.5 mm. I forgot the exact material but it is a fire resistant flexible plastic with a fibrous material between it. I had extremely good results with it when I ran it. Also there was no need for longer bolts either. In GA high ambient temps would not cause IATs to go over ambient unless constant boost-footing it.

 

[DougS550]

They are 3.5 mm. I forgot the exact material but it is a fire resistant flexible plastic with a fibrous material between it. I had extremely good results with it when I ran it. Also there was no need for longer bolts either. In GA high ambient temps would not cause IATs to go over ambient unless constant boost-footing it.

So even though they thin, you seen actual lower AIT2 temps?

 

[illtal]

So even though they thin, you seen actual lower AIT2 temps?

Yea, you can see it on the dash. I also measured the rate of increase just at idle from overnight to morning cold start. It would take something like 35-45 mins to reach ambient IAT. That's how well it worked. Obviously the cooler it is out the longer it would take. When I took them off they looked brand new.

After I added WMI. I would have to do too speed runs to get it to go over ambient. I once got it up to 130 degrees on methanol but I took it up to triple digits several times with no cool down. Before I did any of that I would see 130 on one hit.

On a dyno visit the Operator was surprised how low the IATs stayed.

I think the material started with a V. I'll have to look it up again when I get home.

 

[GenF-GTS]

The Mustang Coyote spacers from Forced Induction Interchillers will lower your blower running temp by about 40 degrees.

The material is a custom made composite plastic which far exceeds the operational temp of the engine, the strength is extremely high and will outlive you. Made up of glass, carbon, nylon and a few other exotics - This is far superior to bakerlite aka phenolic materials.

You can see a before/after temperature video of the same material being used here on the hellcat platform:

Keep in mind that lowering the blower running temp is the goal, this in turn lowers the amount of heat being absorbed into the intercooler, which then allows the fluid to operate at a colder temp and that then lowers intake air temperature.

The spacers themselves can be found here: https://fiinterchillers.com/product/ford-mustang-coyote-blower-spacer-plate-kit/

A tech article about spacer strength can be found here: https://fiinterchillers.com/tech_articles/lsa-lid-spacer-strength-test/

 

[GenF-GTS]

After my FI interchiller setup, when I mash the IAT2 goes DOWN not up. When cruising and the blowe is largely in bypass, the IAT2's still hover just above ambient (once it's fully heat soaked) but once I mash the go lever, I can watch the IAT2's start dropping........quickly.

It's a weird phenomenon that I've tried to make sense of, but I guess with the motor at low load, the air charge doesn't have enough density or dwell time to get fully cooled as it flies by the intercooler core. Once the air load goes higher and boost is created, it must somehow greatly improve the thermal transfer inside the intercooler brick.

Point is, I'm seeing IAT2 drop under a pull, not rise.

What is occurring is the IAT2 sensor is in a dead air location.
When you enter any level of boost you are then blowing fresh air across the sensor and cooling the sensor off, which is why you see a reduction in temp when you go into boost.

This IAT2 sensor will be heat soaked being in the dead air location.

The bypassing of air is a good thing, the air is cooled down, then recirculated back into the snout for multiple passes which further cools the same air again and again and making it colder an colder.

 

[thelostotter]

Will these 10mm thick spacers still let the 15-17 hood shut with standard height motor mounts? Dont really want to drop the engine.

 

[stang17]

Will these 10mm thick spacers still let the 15-17 hood shut with standard height motor mounts? Dont really want to drop the engine.

You have to remove the fire mat on under side of hood. Bonus you get the mustang logo to look at.

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