Methanol injection question...

[ahl395]

Ok so you’re basically activating it as soon as you hit boost. I’m not fully turned up since I have my initial is where Julio set it and gain was 5.5, but Jon wasn’t even seeing it’s effects in my log with the 10gph (630ml/min) nozzle. Afr stayed the same, stft’s weren’t crazy, timing was the same as on straight e85 and iat dropped some but not 20-30* that he’d expect, especially with 100% meth. I’m hoping the nozzle to 1200 ml/min and going to go 50/50 blend of the afr goes crazy on the hit. You might wanna try a larger single nozzle too before going with two. Thanks for the info bro!

Yep, as soon as boost comes on the Alky does. At part throttle if it goes into boost for a sec before downshifting into vaccuum again I can see the red alky light come on for a second. That's what Lund recommended and it makes sense to me as long as theres no bogging issues.

I have a ~10gph (snow perf) nozzle and it's been doing work and caused misfires till fuel was pulled. But since turning up the boost it doesnt seem to be hitting max timing. Snow doesnt make a larger nozzle so I think I'm going to go with one 10gph and one 5gph. I'm going to take apart and clean all my filters/check valves too for good measure.

FWIW I'm running 60/40 meth/water. Lund recommended me 50/50 too but I like the little bit of extra octane in there. My IATs dropped 15-20F depending on the pull. Running 93 also, not E85.

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[BlownOne]

Yep, as soon as boost comes on the Alky does. At part throttle if it goes into boost for a sec before downshifting into vaccuum again I can see the red alky light come on for a second. That's what Lund recommended and it makes sense to me as long as theres no bogging issues.

I have a ~10gph (snow perf) nozzle and it's been doing work and caused misfires till fuel was pulled. But since turning up the boost it doesnt seem to be hitting max timing. Snow doesnt make a larger nozzle so I think I'm going to go with one 10gph and one 5gph. I'm going to take apart and clean all my filters/check valves too for good measure.

FWIW I'm running 60/40 meth/water. Lund recommended me 50/50 too but I like the little bit of extra octane in there. My IATs dropped 15-20F depending on the pull. Running 93 also, not E85.

Yea as long as it doesn’t sputter or bog, spraying it as early as possible sounds logical.

I ordered my larger 1200ml/min nozzle (20gph) from Devils Own so check them out before you buy something else. They have 1/8” npt threads on the nozzle tip so you can thread it into your I/c pipe (they fit any 1/8” nozzle holder too) which I really like and their nozzles have the most atomized spray on the market supposedly. Yea getting the highest meth % in the mix without having the afr dip rich is probably the best bet, especially if you want some extra octane on pump gas. Back in the day I ran 80/20 meth/water on a Snow kit on one of my evo’s with 91 octane and it worked well.

Does the 15-20* drop start on the hit and stay or does it climb back up slightly during the pull?

 

[ProChargerTECH]

Ok cool thanks for adding some general info info on meth injection. I’m just setting up my kit for a “light spray” to help keep iat’s happy. I messaged my tuner for more input also and he suggested me using 50/50 meth/water blend so it has less of an effect on afr than 100% methanol, plus the water helps cool iats quickly.

Figured I’d get as much info as possible from the manufacturer (Alky), my tuner and any forum members running an injection system, then I could make some adjustments to the settings with as much knowledge as possible.

Solid Plan!!! Have fun!!!

 

[ahl395]

Yea as long as it doesn’t sputter or bog, spraying it as early as possible sounds logical.

I ordered my larger 1200ml/min nozzle (20gph) from Devils Own so check them out before you buy something else. They have 1/8” npt threads on the nozzle tip so you can thread it into your I/c pipe (they fit any 1/8” nozzle holder too) which I really like and their nozzles have the most atomized spray on the market supposedly. Yea getting the highest meth % in the mix without having the afr dip rich is probably the best bet, especially if you want some extra octane on pump gas. Back in the day I ran 80/20 meth/water on a Snow kit on one of my evo’s with 91 octane and it worked well.

Does the 15-20* drop start on the hit and stay or does it climb back up slightly during the pull?

I feel like two smaller nozzles can probably get a better atomization than one huge injector which will probably have larger droplets to be able to inject so much. Just my gut telling me that though no science behind it lol.

My IAT drops a few degrees below cruise temp and then climbs. It just doesn't climb as high/fast as no meth does.

 

[Slamdcoop0428]

When I had my JTB I did a long 3rd gear pull and my IAT’s got colder all the way to redline. Never increased. My IAT sensor is in the rear drivers side runner.

 

[Bartly]

Sounds like you guys are “tuning for meth”, being that you are having the PCM lower fuel to reduce AFR when the meth is spraying? If this is the case how do you prevent going lean if there is a problem with the meth system when WOT?

 

[ahl395]

Sounds like you guys are “tuning for meth”, being that you are having the PCM lower fuel to reduce AFR when the meth is spraying? If this is the case how do you prevent going lean if there is a problem with the meth system when WOT?

To prevent that I run the best meth system out there (IMO) so failure is very unlikely. I have an Alky Control system, braided lines, IAT moved post-meth so I can see it spraying, and a low level indicator.

Also I'm not running over the edge. 21* timing @ 13-14psi on meth versus 18* timing @ 12 psi no meth. I believe the knock sensors could pull enough timing to not blow the motor if the meth didn't come on. Also the tune will only advance timing if it can take it, it's commanded for much less and then will advance if possible.

 

[BlownOne]

Solid Plan!!! Have fun!!!

You know it!

I feel like two smaller nozzles can probably get a better atomization than one huge injector which will probably have larger droplets to be able to inject so much. Just my gut telling me that though no science behind it lol.

My IAT drops a few degrees below cruise temp and then climbs. It just doesn't climb as high/fast as no meth does.

Makes sense even without any science research lol. Ok sounds like we both are having a similar result with iat dropping, then gradually climbing. I’m not getting all my timing tho and afr isn’t fluctuating so I definitely need to turn mine up!

When I had my JTB I did a long 3rd gear pull and my IAT’s got colder all the way to redline. Never increased. My IAT sensor is in the rear drivers side runner.

Now that’s the kid of iat swing I want to see with my setup!! My iat sensor is in the same location too and your old blower is about the same size as my f1a so I should be able to duplicate that, hopefully hahaha.

Sounds like you guys are “tuning for meth”, being that you are having the PCM lower fuel to reduce AFR when the meth is spraying? If this is the case how do you prevent going lean if there is a problem with the meth system when WOT?

I’m not having my tuner adjust the pcm for the methanol at all, nor is slammed from what I read. Alh is the only one who had some fuel removed from his original tune since the pcm wasn’t able to pull enough fuel to reach target lambda on its own. The pcm is able to both remove and increase fuel based on parameters the tuner setup, which more than likely is +/-10%. There’s a prime/turn-on led light that will let you know if it’s working or not.

 

[ahl395]

Makes sense even without any science research lol. Ok sounds like we both are having a similar result with iat dropping, then gradually climbing. I’m not getting all my timing tho and afr isn’t fluctuating so I definitely need to turn mine up!


Now that’s the kid of iat swing I want to see with my setup!! My iat sensor is in the same location too and your old blower is about the same size as my f1a so I should be able to duplicate that, hopefully hahaha.


I’m not having my tuner adjust the pcm for the methanol at all, nor is slammed from what I read. Alh is the only one who had some fuel removed from his original tune since the pcm wasn’t able to pull enough fuel to reach target lambda on its own. The pcm is able to both remove and increase fuel based on parameters the tuner setup, which more than likely is +/-10%. There’s a prime/turn-on led light that will let you know if it’s working or not.

I think that is fairly normal. Julio says in the Alky tuning manual that IATs will still climb, just less with meth. I'm kind of wishing I tapped the last runner like you guys did, would probably be more accurate than mine in the charge pipe before the throttle body.

I'm going ahead and adding a second nozzle, just waiting on Dakota @ Lund's recommendation as far as nozzle size. I have a 625ml/min (~10gph) now, thinking I'll add a 375ml/min (~5gph).

Yes almost forgot about the turn-on LED. Indicates when the pump starts running and also when it builds pressure.

 

[Brostang]

Not a 5.0 FI owner, but I like lurking this forum.

I'm interested in WMI as a subtitute for race fuel on the stock GT350 tune. With everything stock we don't even get full advance due to the high compression and safe KR.

Before photobucket wrecked everyone, there was a comparison dyno on another forum showing a healthy hp gain through the curve with 98 vs 93. What do you guys think about running the smallest nozzle just for cooling and knock reduction?

 

[BlownOne]

I think that is fairly normal. Julio says in the Alky tuning manual that IATs will still climb, just less with meth. I'm kind of wishing I tapped the last runner like you guys did, would probably be more accurate than mine in the charge pipe before the throttle body.

I'm going ahead and adding a second nozzle, just waiting on Dakota @ Lund's recommendation as far as nozzle size. I have a 625ml/min (~10gph) now, thinking I'll add a 375ml/min (~5gph).

Yes almost forgot about the turn-on LED. Indicates when the pump starts running and also when it builds pressure.

Yea I know it will start to climb eventually, but I want to make sure I get the largest iat drop/hold as possible. You could easily move the sensor into the manifold, plug the intake pipe and Lund can change the iat sensor settings like he did for me. Manifold is where Jon recommended I put it and should be the most accurate location for post meth air temps.

Second smaller nozzle should work perfect for ya, but I still think a larger single will do the trick as well.

Where’d you put your turn-on led light btw?

Not a 5.0 FI owner, but I like lurking this forum.

I'm interested in WMI as a subtitute for race fuel on the stock GT350 tune. With everything stock we don't even get full advance due to the high compression and safe KR.

Before photobucket wrecked everyone, there was a comparison dyno on another forum showing a healthy hp gain through the curve with 98 vs 93. What do you guys think about running the smallest nozzle just for cooling and knock reduction?

Welcome to the dark side lol.

As long as the Gt350 has active o2 feedback fuel adjustment like the 5.0 you should be fine adding a small nozzle (start at 5gph) to bump octane and cool things down. You could also add BOOSTane (or any well known octane booster) as that seems to work pretty well in some independent testing I saw.

 

[Brostang]

Thanks! Yeah power adders just create more productive discussions related to fuel and tuning. Plus this is a big group with lots of ideas. The Voodoo reliability seems too hit or miss to throw boost at it for now.

Where is everyone mounting their tanks/pumps? Seems like trunk mounting is ideal due to space restrictions

 

[BlownOne]

Here’s a good vid on fuel, supplemental additives and injection.

 

[BlownOne]

Thanks! Yeah power adders just create more productive discussions related to fuel and tuning. Plus this is a big group with lots of ideas. The Voodoo reliability seems too hit or miss to throw boost at it for now.

Where is everyone mounting their tanks/pumps? Seems like trunk mounting is ideal due to space restrictions

No prob!

I mounted my pump to my under-tray behind my washer fluid tank, which is what I used for my methanol reservoir. It was a tight fit, but works with a little patience. If you check the last page of my build thread I posted several pics with some general info on installing it.

 

[08StangGT_CS]

No prob!

I mounted my pump to my under-tray behind my washer fluid tank, which is what I used for my methanol reservoir. It was a tight fit, but works with a little patience. If you check the last page of my build thread I posted several pics with some general info on installing it.

To your build thread I go!

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