Is Magneride worth it to get the best of both worlds for a track car/daily driver?

[shogun32]

I'm not just making this stuff up. I've seen it over & over for the last couple decades.

I don't believe I intimated any such thing.

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[TeeLew]

I don't believe I intimated any such thing.

That bit I quoted seemed to. Maybe I read it incorrectly.

 

[Grintch]

Trying to convert an existing car is cost prohibitive for Magneride.

In choosing a car, step 1 what is your planned usage, step 2 what do the rules says if you plan to use it in competition, step 3 what is the real cost of the options/mods.

A lot of times Magneride is often only available with certain options you might not need or want, so it effectively cost more (remember installation costs and no warranty for aftermarket costs).

The big advantage of Magneride is you can just hit a button to go from comfort to track mode, but these modes are not optimum compared to a suspension designed to provide them from the beginning (especially as you start modding the car).

Good coilovers are better for all out performance, and are adjustable (but with more work). Plus if you have then dialed in, why would you ever want to "dial out" you shocks. It is a common complaint that OEM shocks never feel/work that good in any mode as part of trying to satisfy everyone and every use.

If you care more about the ride on the street, and won't modify the car much, Magneride is a good choice. As you care more about pure performance. and modify the car more, it starts losing ground.

There is no such thing as best of both worlds. Essentially, you need to pick what matters most to choose the right compromise. If you think different, drive a ZL1 1LE down a bumpy, narrow road and see how some of the most expensive and most sophisticated OE shocks in the world do outside their designed environment.

 

[TeeLew]

Well, EGP is going to get to try my DSC controller this weekend, so it'll be interesting to see what he has to say. He's going to spend time on the stock controller and then put in the other to compare. I think it will be a cool test.


(This things getting passed around more than my high-school girlfriend, Lol!)

 

[TeeLew]

(1) Trying to convert an existing car is cost prohibitive for Magneride.

(2) The big advantage of Magneride is you can just hit a button to go from comfort to track mode, but these modes are not optimum compared to a suspension designed to provide them from the beginning (especially as you start modding the car).

(3) Good coilovers are better for all out performance, and are adjustable (but with more work). Plus if you have then dialed in, why would you ever want to "dial out" you shocks.

(4) If you care more about the ride on the street, and won't modify the car much, Magneride is a good choice. As you care more about pure performance. and modify the car more, it starts losing ground.

(5) There is no such thing as best of both worlds.

1. Agreed

2. Yes, mode shifts are a big advantage, but the rest of what you're saying is the exact reason why the DSC controller exists.

3. There no debate about the better coil-over packages being best for track work. The reason to 'dial out' your shocks is because the street environment and goals are much different than when on track.

4. Again, a qualified agreement. If your goal is a dedicated racing car, then use the Multimatics like the GT4 car. Anything less will be a compromise on track. The Magneride is absolutely a compromise, but it's one offers docile street behavior with competent (not exceptional, but we aren't talking about dedicated racing dampers) track manners. It also allows the tuner to shift handling balance in ways that are simply not available when using passive dampers.

5. No, but there is such thing as a compromise which produces good (admittedly, not great or exceptional) performance in both track and street scenarios with mostly stock components and it's literally at the flip-of-the-switch. Whether an individual wants to take this particular path is one thing, but the path itself is, without question, a valid approach to a dual purpose car which sees both street/track duties.

 

[Egparson202]

Well, EGP is going to get to try my DSC controller this weekend, so it'll be interesting to see what he has to say. He's going to spend time on the stock controller and then put in the other to compare. I think it will be a cool test.

(This things getting passed around more than my high-school girlfriend, Lol!)

OK kids, I set out to make the car handle better on track (cornering, forward grip and stability under braking) while keeping it sporty but pleasant on the way to/from the track. Here’s what I tried. 2019 GT350 modified as follows:

OE magneride dampers, springs & anti roll bars

Tires/wheels

• Goodyear Super Cup 3 - 220 TW
• Front: 295/30/19 on OE 19x10.5 wheels
• Rear: 305/30/19 on OE 19X11 wheels

Front Suspension

• Camber bolts
• Camber plates (installed before prior event, yielding -2.5)
• Lower control arms - monoball

Rear Suspension

• Adjustable Toe Arms
• Adjustable Camber Arms
• Lower control arms - monoball
• Subframe Bushing Support kit
• IRS alignment kit

Chassis

• Front Subframe Support Brace
• Rear IRS Subframe Support Braces

Alignment

• LF -2.9 RF - 2.9
• 1/32” toe out in front
• LR -1.9 RR -1.9
• 1/16” toe in rear

“Test” results & observations

• Saturday
  • sessions were run with the above equipment but without DSC Sport to establish a baseline.
  • weather was typical summer in the south (mid-90’s with pop up showers mixed in)
  • all the suspension work really helped, cutting about 1.5 seconds off my previous best lap time
  • laps were more repeatable and speed came easier
  • tire wear on the front was about even outside, center & inside, mostly same for tire temps
• Sunday
  • dropped the DSC Sport module in; install was quick and easy
  • shortened sessions and rain marred the morning, but I got a lot of laps in the afternoon with minimal traffic on a dry track
  • afternoon weather was mid-80’s and sunny; constant temp changes had my chasing tire pressures throughout the day
  • there were two performance tunes, one geared slightly toward better front grip and he other geared slightly toward better rear grip
  • Both tunes really soak up curbs and make the car feel flatter in the corners with reduced brake dive
  • the rear grip tune was better than OE controller; the car was more stable under braking and quicker overall (-0.5 sec faster than Saturday’s best even with a 200 lb passenger)
  • the front grip tune was my favorite; I really liked the grip at corner entry; seat of the pants felt substantially quicker than OE controller and it was (-1.5 sec faster than Saturday’s best - no passenger)
• 4 hour ride home in race seats
  • not as plush as OE Normal Mode but certainly not punishing
  • comfortable but composed
  • could be used as DD or date night setting (except for the seats!)

Conclusions, opinions & disclaimers

• It seems to actually keep the promise Magneride makes; the tunes definitely feel different
• It’s tunable from a laptop (for those with knowledge of shock tuning and some patience)
• The performance gains were real, but there were some variables that aren’t factored in:
  • what if someone did just the DSC without all the upgraded suspension bushings?
  • what if someone did the DSC with some other combination of springs and anti roll bars?
  • the two tunes may be closer than they appear without the weight of a passenger in both
  • The gains may be even better than they appear because the fast Saturday time was set on lap 2 of the morning session, whereas the fast Sunday (DSC) lap was set on lap 2 of the 4:30 pm session when the track and ambient temps were 10+ degrees hotter
• High quality coilovers with double adjustable dampers would be faster in the right hands (but maybe not mine) and could possibly be softened enough to make the transit stages acceptable. But I’m really fond of the potential for crowd sourcing and/or engaging remote professional suspension tuning.
• With the right library of suspension tunes it should be possible to optimize for 200TW Streetable/Comp tires, R-Comps, or even take-off slicks as well as a variety of tracks or weather conditions.

Bottom line

• I’m going to invest in a DSC Sport because I like the availability of substantially improved track performance that can be converted to comfort at the push of a button.

 

[kz]

• 4 hour ride home in race seats
  • not as plush as OE Normal Mode but certainly not punishing
  • comfortable but composed
  • could be used as DD or date night setting (except for the seats!)

Since you can upload each of the "modes" independently into DSC (just one, not all three at once), you can upload (or leave on a new unit) stock DSC "comfort" map for daily driving - put under the mode you want which I think on GT350 may not matter much (on a GT modes are tied to throttle mapping).

 

[Egparson202]

Since you can upload each of the "modes" independently into DSC (just one, not all three at once), you can upload (or leave on a new unit) stock DSC "comfort" map for daily driving - put under the mode you want which I think on GT350 may not matter much (on a GT modes are tied to throttle mapping).

Good point, kz. I don’t use the Shelby as a daily driver, but I also don’t trailer it. So a good Normal mode is worthwhile.

I do recall hearing that the throttle mapping is different (more linear) for track than sport. And I think that’s true for the Shelby same as GT’s. If true, I’d lean to using the Track mode for my primary track tune. I’ve never been a big fan of throttle maps design to create the perception of extra power. That said, I really didn’t experience anything objectionable when I used the Sport mode on track.

 

[TeeLew]

So, I'm finally back from a work trip and can engage a little.

I'm stoked EGP liked the different damper tuning. That kind of helps to make the argument it's a good general starting point. So far the same controller/mapping developed on my Eco has also gotten favorable response on a GT & Shelby. There will definitely be room for improvements in all cases by tuning to the specific car/driver, but the fact that we've all found gains on track is encouraging.

 

[bullitt2]

Thanks for all of the informative answers. Just an update from my original post, I drove a used 2021 GT PP and while it was a fantastic car (and Magneride was excellent), it did not handle the same as my modified 2015 during spirited driving on the road. It was a good learning experience and I agree now that there isn't a good compromise between a daily driver and a track car. For the time being, I've opted to keep modifying my 2015 to make it a great track car because having a stiff suspension and loud brakes on the street are worth it to be able to tear up the track

 

[TonyNJ]

Magnaride....Yes.

 

[Norm Peterson]

Magnaride....Yes.

Even MagneRide has its limitations and compromises.

For most people, they probably don't matter at all.

Then again, there are those of us who at least sometimes want to enjoy driving outside what Ford's predetermined calibrations can handle.


Norm

 

[TonyNJ]

Even MagneRide has its limitations and compromises.

For most people, they probably don't matter at all.

Then again, there are those of us who at least sometimes want to enjoy driving outside what Ford's predetermined calibrations can handle.


Norm

I hear you and agree. I guess my general opinion is they are more than a gimmick, so why not for the guy who wants a variable driving experience.

 

[T.O.Bullitt]

Some cars that I think would do ok on a track that come with magnetorheological dampers standard (from list in Wikipedia):
Acura NSX
Audi R8
Corvette C6 ZR1
Corvette C7 ZR1
Corvette C7 Z06
Ferrari 458 Italia
Ferrari 599
Ferrari California
Ferrari F12 Berlinetta
Ferrari FF
Ferrari La Ferrari
Lamborghini Aventador
Shelby GT350
Shelby GT500

 

[Norm Peterson]

I hear you and agree. I guess my general opinion is they are more than a gimmick, so why not for the guy who wants a variable driving experience.

Agreed. Variable damping does have at least theoretical advantages. The DSC controller appears to extend the useful range of MR at least by some amounts.


We had a 1987 Maxima which featured a very crude form of variable damping in-car, user-adjustable damping. If the positions were actually labeled 'Firm', 'Normal', and 'Soft', they really felt like 'Normal', 'Soft', and 'Way too Soft', respectively.


Norm

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