Incredibly stiff steering after Front sway Bars

[MartinNoHo]

I installed my CBR005 cradle lockout kit this week, and a front sway bar by megan racing (36mm thickness set to the middle setting, similar to steedas big bar kit). Raised my car's ST coilover setting to the maximum height setting (1.2" drop front and .8 rear) and the car drives much better than I thought it would. In addition, I aligned my car to front -1.7, rear -1.5 camber, front toe 0, rear toe .20 total. However, I've noticed the steering is quite heavy, not sure if this is normal or bad for the car? any thoughts?

Note:
St coilovers do not come with sway bar end links.
If I turn the steering wheel CCW or CW to the maximum and let go, it will rapidly center itself.

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[Norm Peterson]

I suspect that the additional front roll stiffness means that you're lifting more of the car's front weight upward as you steer (a consequence of positive caster being 7°-ish and the stiffer bar attracting extra lift force to the inboard tire).

I would guess that the EPAS might not be too happy about the driver repeatedly sweeping the steering wheel from right lock to left lock and back again without the car moving, and would probably limit the amount of assist to protect itself from overheating.


Norm

 

[Bluemustang]

That sounds right. Going stiffer on the front bar will do that. It's a preference thing imo. One thing I didn't like, much higher steering effort at low speeds and heavier self centering forces. But the stable feel at high speeds is very nice I must admit.

 

[NightmareMoon]

Are those alignment settings after the coilover ride height or before?

IMHO if the toe really is 0 up front the steering shouldn't be self centering too aggressively, but the super stiff swaybar will change the feel towards stiff and if your alignment was toe out than a 0 toe will feel stiffer by comparison

 

[Grintch]

? Never noticed a significantly difference in steering feel from new sway bars.

 

[NightmareMoon]

? Never noticed a significantly difference in steering feel from new sway bars.

yeah it sounds like his toe is off to me, or something is loose (dynamic toe)

 

[Norm Peterson]

I'm just guessing here, but perhaps it's an unrelated EPAS problem, or possibly the sta-bar removal/replacement procedure inadvertently disturbed some EPAS wiring. Might be worth having the EPAS system scanned for codes and the steering angle sensor re-centered because it does sound like steering assist isn't what it should be.


Norm

 

[MartinNoHo]

Are those alignment settings after the coilover ride height or before?

IMHO if the toe really is 0 up front the steering shouldn't be self centering too aggressively, but the super stiff swaybar will change the feel towards stiff and if your alignment was toe out than a 0 toe will feel stiffer by comparison

After

 

[NightmareMoon]

Well its hard to say my friend. Self centering is normal. What steering mode is your car set to (if you have that setting?)

sport steering is too heavy for me, I keep mine on normal.

 

[MartinNoHo]

Well its hard to say my friend. Self centering is normal. What steering mode is your car set to (if you have that setting?)

sport steering is too heavy for me, I keep mine on normal.

Normal when spirited, comfort in the streets. Maybe it's time I pick up weight lifting as a hobby

 

[TeeLew]

To find out if the FARB is your steering issue, just remove the strut-to-ARB drop link on one side of the car and drive it at some moderate pace. You'll know if the bar created your issue in 2 minutes.

 

[fatbillybob]

Every time I've made a significant swaybar stiffness increase on this car, the weight after the first few degrees is noticeably higher. It's not enough to make the efforts excessive, but it loads up really nicely with angle and grip level. After maybe 30-45 deg of lock it does not increase much, it's just that first few off center to 30 deg or so.

It all make sense given how the bar is connected to the struts. On a double wishbone car, there would not be the same thing happening.

Can you explain why ARB connected to strut vs. wishbone does this increased on center effort thing? Is this on center increase also the same reason or issue with why the PP1 front bar is bonded to the mounts?

 

[fatbillybob]

When you turn the wheel, the link will pull on the bar, putting it in a little bit of torsion just like roll. The reaction force wants to self center the wheel.

ahh....I guess this is true of any Mac Strut design but I never hear the BMW guys complain about this. Is there something different about what BMW does or because BMW has always been that way no one comments?

 

[moffetts]

BMW guys are too busy weaving in and out of traffic and taking advantage of their race spec turn signal deletes to notice stuff like that.

 

[TeeLew]

ahh....I guess this is true of any Mac Strut design but I never hear the BMW guys complain about this. Is there something different about what BMW does or because BMW has always been that way no one comments?

Porsche also has a similar design, and It's definitely the same on those with respect to steering effort/bar setting. It honestly didn't occur to me until Brian mentioned it. The ARB connected to the strut will be twisted (i.e. jacking weight) side to side due to caster lifting one side and allowing the other to drop. Stiffening the front bar makes it more efficient at jacking weight, which increases steering effort.

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