Oversteer; stiffer front sway bar?

[OzS550]

In standard spec, the Mustang is easily provoked into oversteer; should Ford have had a stiffer front bar (or even less stiff rear)?

My car just has the excellent BMR SP089/82 spring combo but is other wise standard. I'm soon to add the CB005 and CB007 which I don't anticipate will effect oversteer.

After a decade of AWD, the way this car's rear will step out, whilst fun, can be a little unnerving.

What's been the experience of others trying to tame the rear end?

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[BmacIL]

In standard spec, the Mustang is easily provoked into oversteer; should Ford have had a stiffer front bar (or even less stiff rear)?

My car just has the excellent BMR SP089/82 spring combo but is other wise standard. I'm soon to add the CB005 and CB007 which I don't anticipate will effect oversteer.

After a decade of AWD, the way this car's rear will step out, whilst fun, can be a little unnerving.

What's been the experience of others trying to tame the rear end?

CB005 Lockout kit will help make the rear feel much more connected and the oversteer far more manageable. Instead of being unsure of what it'll do, it'll tell you and will be responsive to inputs how you'd expect.

 

[West TX GT]

You should definitely Solidify the rear with cb005 plus lca and toe link bearings. The car will communicate much better and then you can enjoy the feeling of driving a car with a front engine and rear drive as God intended. AWD cars usually have significant understeer, it will just take you a while to get used to rwd.

 

[Lost Cosmonaut]

You'd be better off taking the money you'd be spending on ruining the handling dynamics of the car and putting it in to track instruction time to learn how to push the RWD and drive it to the limits properly.

I know the feeling, I came from a long line of AWDs. But the Mustang is very neutral and communicates well, and modern traction control does a good job keeping you from stuffing it if you bone it.

 

[NightmareMoon]

The car is only prone to power-on oversteer, due to the massive rwhp and torque.

Its not prone to steady state oversteer, in fact my PP exhibited significant understeer in stock form. Also, alignment settings can vary from the factory though, so YMMV.

Like 0.0% of car manufacturers set up cars to oversteer at the limit, and Ford is no exception here. Otherwise we'd have a carpocalypse of wrecks everywhere. Most people's gut instincts will save them if the car understeers (just slow down a bit, which transfers weight forward and you're good). That's not as often to be true for a car which is oversteering.

So no, it really doesn't need a stiffer front bar to be better balanced, in my opinion, although driving styles do differ.

 

[NightmareMoon]

All that said, if you are having trouble adjusting to RWD, then a stiffer front bar might help while you adapt your driving style to RWD.

Make sure you're opening up the steering angle as you're smoothly applying power. If you hit the gas too suddenly in a corner without removing some steering angle its more likely to come around on you.

Driving a high HP RWD car does take some practice. I like autocross events to help teach the dance at reasonable speeds in a safe environment. Learning those lessons on the street is not so good.

Also make sure your rear toe is turned in slightly on both sides. That has a big effect on stability when putting down power in a straight line and in corners.

 

[kz]

You'd be better off taking the money you'd be spending on ruining the handling dynamics of the car and putting it in to track instruction time to learn how to push the RWD and drive it to the limits properly.

This x1000.

I completely don't understand advice of throwing parts on the car that fundamentally does not oversteer unless provoked with a throttle.

In addition what Nightmaremoon wrote - if anything, this car understeers in the corners, like most.

 

[VinnAY]

Like a few above that mentioned lockouts, taking out the wheel hop in this car is of utmost importance before you move on to other things, the wheel hop is what's going to get you in to trouble way before over/understeer.

 

[kz]

Like a few above that mentioned lockouts, taking out the wheel hop in this car is of utmost importance before you move on to other things, the wheel hop is what's going to get you in to trouble way before over/understeer.

Somehow it never got me in trouble... And yes, launch it as hard as traction allows every weekend.

 

[Lost Cosmonaut]

The car is only prone to power-on oversteer, due to the massive rwhp and torque.

Its not prone to steady state oversteer, in fact my PP exhibited significant understeer in stock form. Also, alignment settings can vary from the factory though, so YMMV.

Like 0.0% of car manufacturers set up cars to oversteer at the limit, and Ford is no exception here. Otherwise we'd have a carpocalypse of wrecks everywhere. Most people's gut instincts will save them if the car understeers (just slow down a bit, which transfers weight forward and you're good). That's not as often to be true for a car which is oversteering.

So no, it really doesn't need a stiffer front bar to be better balanced, in my opinion, although driving styles do differ.

For some reason, AWD performance car owners seem to think RWD = Crash and die whenever it's wet or the car is pushed to the limit. You should have seen the crying over the Subaru BRZ/Toyota 86/Scion FR-S being RWD, especially by the Subaru crowd.

A major issue is for some reason people feel the need to turn off all the electronics and drive like a moron. In an AWD car you can do that and not feel consequences as much as with a high-powered RWD car.

This is why Mustangs have such a bad reputation for not being able to leave Cars and Coffee in one piece.

 

[TNcoupe]

Less right foot=less oversteer.

 

[JKL1031]

Not if you less throttle mid turn

 

[OzS550]

The car is only prone to power-on oversteer, due to the massive rwhp and torque.

Its not prone to steady state oversteer, in fact my PP exhibited significant understeer in stock form.

I agree, the oversteer is only power induced, and I wonder if the stock Pirelli tyres have a big influence here. I've always found the rear easy to catch, the car is great fun from that perspective. You just can't power out of a corner too early I guess.

I 've been very impressed with the turn in, I find the front end very faithful.

I'm also looking forward to some more track time. I have done a fair bit in past cars (mostly AWD). I did do a hillclimb in the Mustang on a tight tarmac track and was impressed then. The track was dry and warm. I think any hint of moisture and these stock tyres need caution.

I'll be interested to see what changes with the CB005.

 

[CTH621]

IMHO, this car UNDERSTEERS heavily. It would require quite a bit of effort to induce even power oversteer.

 

[NightmareMoon]

I agree, the oversteer is only power induced, and I wonder if the stock Pirelli tyres have a big influence here. I've always found the rear easy to catch, the car is great fun from that perspective. You just can't power out of a corner too early I guess.

I 've been very impressed with the turn in, I find the front end very faithful.

I'm also looking forward to some more track time. I have done a fair bit in past cars (mostly AWD). I did do a hillclimb in the Mustang on a tight tarmac track and was impressed then. The track was dry and warm. I think any hint of moisture and these stock tyres need caution.

I'll be interested to see what changes with the CB005.

Do you have the all-seasons or the summer PZeros? The car does feel a lot better with sticky tires, that's for sure.

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