Hellion Street Sleeper VS. Twin screw dyno!

[jhatley7]

Yes. We have used them for years on that fuel

You aren’t getting the swelling issues out of the Dw injectors by using fuel containing MTBE? All the big injectors clearly state, not compatible with MTBE.

Sponsored

 

[grabber_17]

Hey guys.

Please see the attached video of Ken from PBD testing their first Street Sleeper kit, 746 rwhp on pump gas. This was done at sea level. Very comparable to the results we have here at 5500 ft of altitude. We stand by our use of the correction factor to compare vehicles. Please let us know if you have any other questions.

What injectors were used on this car?

 

[Tommy V]

Im.sorry i just cant see 750 rwp on 91 octane and being reliable,and this is with seeing hundreds of logs with different setups and lets just say the best tuners!!.Unless the 18's and up have some new magic with that direct injection.

 

[Black Dog]

As a present Hellion customer with a 2018 GT that installed a Vortech JT V7 blower in June running 14 lbs. Now after purchasing the 62/66 Sleeper kit from Beefcake (purchased both from Beefcake) and now running 7-8 lbs. same setup with Fore Stage 2 E85 ID 1050x. Now with this said on 14 lbs. with Vortech made 920/700 This Sleeper kit feels very very very close to this on 7-8 lbs. If I were to put boost controller to 14 lbs on this Sleeper kit I have no idea what it would make but I can say it would make way more than 920/700 Thank you Hellion.

 

[HELLION TURBO]

As a present Hellion customer with a 2018 GT that installed a Vortech JT V7 blower in June running 14 lbs. Now after purchasing the 62/66 Sleeper kit from Beefcake (purchased both from Beefcake) and now running 7-8 lbs. same setup with Fore Stage 2 E85 ID 1050x. Now with this said on 14 lbs. with Vortech made 920/700 This Sleeper kit feels very very very close to this on 7-8 lbs. If I were to put boost controller to 14 lbs on this Sleeper kit I have no idea what it would make but I can say it would make way more than 920/700 Thank you Hellion.

Your welcome!!!

 

[HELLION TURBO]

What injectors were used on this car?

Hello,

We have 1000cc injectors in that car.

 

[Tapatio]

First off, not calling BS.

However, I’m trying to understand how on the same boost - 8.3 psi, the twins made 370 more horsepower!! That is a HUGE difference! Did I read that correctly though, same boost!?

8.3 PSI is still 8.3 PSI. Even factoring in HP loss due to driving the supercharger and perhaps a little higher IATs (unknown though), I don’t see how that much of a gain is possible, at the same boost pressure. Unless their were other changes of course.

I do understand hp losses driving the supercharger and belt slip etc, efficiency... I just think 370 is really high for the same boost level.

If even half of the 370 difference, that would still be amazing at the same boost level!

So, I’m thinking that there were more changes or his supercharger was broke or the belt was actually just spinning and not really turning the supercharger very hard.

Make me a believer!! My winter project is FI.

I dont know if you got an answer yet, so i apologize if you did, i know it’s been a while since this post but i just joined this forum.

I believe the reason a bigger turbo makes more power at the same boost level isnt because of the amount of air that goes into the manifold, it’s because of the speed at which that air enters the intake port itself.

Because a bigger turbo has more surface, it then can move more air, but not all that air can enter the manifold at once, capping at that one boost level, but when the ports open for whatever ammount of time, the air in the manifold can then circulate quicker because its moving at a faster speed, which means it can enter the ports at a faster rate during the ammount of time that the ports open up, resulting in a ton more air and a ton more power. So boost level is one thing, but the ammount of air that its actually using is another.

That being said I’m no tuner or even mechanic haha so dont ask about the displacement number of either turbos to prove what i just said. Thats just how ive always been explained it. And i’d say it makes sense.

You can also think about it this way, think of a hose attached to a spicket, put your thumb at the end of the hose so no water comes out, open the valve half way and let the hose fill up itll get to a certain pressure and stay there, then move over your thumb just a little bit allowing water to come out at a certain speed. Now cover the exit shut again and open the valve all the way, that pressure will not change because thats all the hose can hold, but if you move your thumb over again just slightly the water will come out at a faster speed because theres more water coming from the source.

 

[Torinate]

Unfortunately, this theory does not hold true.

The actual boost number is a measure of restriction. There is no way a bigger turbo could flow more air if the restriction is the same. Certainly a bigger turbo flows more air, that is not in debate. However, if the restriction is the same, by flowing more air, the boost pressure will rise.

Hence, when you add some free flowing headers and intake to your car and your boost level actually goes down but your horsepower goes up. Less restriction.

At the same boost level (restriction level) there has to be other reasons for the 370 more horsepower. That number is highly exaggerated. Supposing the Centri takes 75 horsepower to spin it at the 13 pound boost level (likely fairly accurate) that would mean a theoretical gain by the turbos of 75 horsepower. Let’s also suppose the turbo has a cooler intake charge (unknown though...) that could also add in to the difference. But 370? Not at these boost levels. Maybe a pro-mod running 30+ pounds of boost running a cog system. I’m sure they take that amount to turn them.

The point I am making, a 370 horsepower difference between these 2 examples is nonsense. I think if it were that much or even close to that amount, one of the vendors or manufacturers etc would have stepped up and shown this to be true or would have taken me up on my different offers to prove the point.

Again, not flaming anyone and certainly not wanting to offend anyone in any way, but I still cannot fathom how in these specific 2 examples there could be a 370 horsepower DIFFERENCE. Would either of these power adders add 370 horsepower total? Sure. I think they have the potential!! But not 370 more than the other power adder.

Seriously. Maybe it’s just me not knowing jack. IF I am wrong, so be it. Just show me the error of my ways...

 

[dg98gt]

As far as I can tell from the original post....the 370rwhp difference is 16-17 psi of boost.

Derrick

 

[Torinate]

Ok. 16.3 to 16.9 pounds of boost versus 13. As long as both are running the same boost, the restriction is the same.

Now Derrick, if you’re saying the 16 or 17 pounds of boost versus no boost adds the 370 horsepower, I would agree. But if both the supercharger and turbo run 16-17 pounds of boost, I cannot see how there is a 370 horsepower difference! Again, maybe I don’t know squat... but 370. Difference. At the exact same boost level? Why would anyone buy a supercharger? Why would car manufacturers even make a model with a supercharger if they could add another 370 horsepower by going turbo instead?

Am I the only one thinking 370 is a crazy amount of difference?

This would stand to reason that every turbo out there is making a minimum 970+ HP when darn near every supercharger is making 600.

 

[SiMuL]

You guys are all forgetting about volume. Larger turbos can be compared to larger water hoses pushing the same pressure of water as a smaller water hose. It's just a helluva lot more water coming through the larger hose. It's the same amount of pressure, though.

Restriction is exactly as you summarize above, however. The higher the restriction, the higher amount of pressure is required to flow the same volume of substance (air/water/whatever).

10lbs of boost is not equal to 10lbs of boost between different turbos. Unless they flow the same amount of air.

NOTE: I'm not considering the flow capabilities of the engine here, I'm just referring to the volume of two different sized turbos (or SC) at the same boost level.

 

[Torinate]

Except the water hose in this case is the exact same size - the throttle body and intake.

To flow more water or air in either, the pressure must go up.

 

[Torinate]

If I was a blower guy and knew the same boost with a turbo would net me 370 more horsepower I’d be ticked. And likewise, if I was a turbo guy and saw only 750 horsepower to my buddies supercharger at 650, I’d be ticked!

 

[SiMuL]

Except the water hose in this case is the exact same size - the throttle body and intake.

To flow more water or air in either, the pressure must go up.

Correct. I wasn't taking into consideration any specific engines or other restrictions. I was trying to correct some of the thinking here that boost is boost no matter what it producing it. Some people have a difficult time wrapping their heads around volume and boost.

 

[dg98gt]

Here is a good example:

Add long tubes to a NA car and gain say 30rwhp. Take only that same change on a supercharged car and gain say 50rwhp.

Same thing here I believe. Also a turbo has no parasitic loss like a belt driven supercharger so there’s that too. This is a max build...built motor, cams, etc. this is not a bolt on turbo vs. supercharger comparison at stock boost that the average joe has.

Now, I’m not saying that it’s accurate...just giving my thoughts on why ther could be differences.

I’ll be going twin turbo when the time comes!

Sponsored