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Grimace427

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I wonder how all those Ferraris, Lamborghinis, Porsches, Mclarens, not to mention countless motorcycles survive on 91 octane CA fuel.
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Spa2k

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Absurd ... absolutely absurd.

The manufacturer has no control over mods and no responsibility for the problems mods cause. And Ford isn't going to sell a vehicle that won't run on locally available gasoline.

This is way beyond wearing tin foil hats - now we're getting into full aluminum foil suits. :rolleyes:
 

Cruzinaround

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I wonder how all those Ferraris, Lamborghinis, Porsches, Mclarens, not to mention countless motorcycles survive on 91 octane CA fuel.
I know. Hey its not going to stop the progression of sales in any demographic its just food for thought.

But,

Maybe they are barely driven. ???

Considering these are exotic vehicles of the rich and famous. They likely don't get driven as much as say a mustang owner would drive their car.

In any case these countermeasures are not inclusive in order for us owners to enjoy cheaper gasoline. They were put in place to protect the car from damage and prolong the life of our depreciating investments...

Something else to consider when you buy from a collector.... where do they live and drive the car they are now reselling???? Its the details to this data that puts some extra bargaining bullets on your side.
 
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65Terdlingua

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The answer to your question....

No one really knows. And if they do know... there is no governing body charting it in a registry of known detonation issues for your information. Simply because the aftermath can be attributed to so many variables. ECU mods are only a part of the overall equation.

Detonation however still has to exist for any of this to compensate. And again when problems do occur it's not necessarily determined to be a detonation problem simply because.....


That would be the first mod I would look into in those areas where high octane

Or buy 2 GT350's. You can keep the second one for spare parts.
Man, relax a bit. I'm not buying a 350 or running 87 octane in one. Or arguing over how a ECU works. I know how it all works. I'm not totally convinced you do but it's irrelevant. Of course Ford has set this up to be able to run on lower grades of gas. And as has been said before, the efficiency of this engine far exceeds anything of the past. CR is not an equalizer for all engines. 12:1 in an LS1 is different than 12:1 in the Voodoo.

Also, if you think engine builders or engineers can't determine an engine failure was caused by detonation than you are kidding yourself.
 

krt22

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It doesn't retard the motor so you can enjoy lower octane fuel and save a few pennies on each gallon. It retards the motor to avoid the damage that is associated with running lower octane fuel in your car. PERIOD.


If you still want to run it on the lower octane fuel then the first mod I would look at (other than the e85 conversion suggested)is a Methanol injection kit... formerly referred to a water injection kits.
Seriously man, get out of here with this overly dramatic BS. The ECM is far more sophisticated than you are giving it credit for and the Ford engineers are far more intelligent than you.

They simply would not design and sell a car where more than 10% of them would end up in states with only 91.

Simply put, the ECM adjusts engine output to match the fuel available. And it absolutely does NOT have to experience knock in order to start adjusting ignition timing and/or valve overlap to change actual cylinder pressure. Every single ignition event is recorded and accompanied by a set of data, based on this data, the ECM can predict when knock is becoming a likely scenario and adjust accordingly, and of course these fault bands include plenty of margin.
 

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Cruzinaround

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^Ford set the ECU to compensate. That's just how it works. Its done to save your investment in your car while running it on cheap gas.

I get it.

Builders can speculate on the cause based on known variables only. If you mod the engine... its all on you as the owner. Then they can speculate on even more causes.

If your engine fails due to detonation then they would need to get to that conclusion by eliminating ...... all those sensors and the ECU as having failed.

Outcomes are all that matter.
 

krt22

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I get it.
Not quite.

You can think what you wish, but no need to try to convince others that their car is going to explode on 91 and even suggest a methanol injection kit on a bone stock mass produced motor. :headbonk::headbonk::headbonk::headbonk:
 

PP0001

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Seriously man, get out of here with this overly dramatic BS. The ECM is far more sophisticated than you are giving it credit for and the Ford engineers are far more intelligent than you.

They simply would not design and sell a car where more than 10% of them would end up in states with only 91.

Simply put, the ECM adjusts engine output to match the fuel available. And it absolutely does NOT have to experience knock in order to start adjusting ignition timing and/or valve overlap to change actual cylinder pressure. Every single ignition event is recorded and accompanied by a set of data, based on this data, the ECM can predict when knock is becoming a likely scenario and adjust accordingly, and of course these fault bands include plenty of margin.
krt22, with all due respect you are just wasting your time!

:frusty:
 
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65Terdlingua

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^Ford set the ECU to compensate. That's just how it works. Its done to save your investment in your car while running it on cheap gas.

I get it.

Builders can speculate on the cause based on known variables only. If you mod the engine... its all on you as the owner. Then they can speculate on even more causes.

If your engine fails due to detonation then they would need to get to that conclusion by eliminating ...... all those sensors and the ECU as having failed.

Outcomes are all that matter.
I don't know when this became a discussion on mods, or about this topic at all. But the computer on the stock vehicle is not ten year old technology. Again, assuming you don't know how it actually functions, it is more than capable of monitoring and adjusting for the given inputs. It does this actively, not seconds after it sees an input.

An engineer can tell you exactly why something fails. It won't be too often that a root cause can't be determined in part for a failure. Trust me, it's what I do buddy.
 

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krt22

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krt22, with all due respect you are just wasting your time!

:frusty:
Sadly, you are correct. It's like a bad car wreck, can't help but get sucked in to look.

An engineer can tell you exactly why something fails. It won't be too often that a root cause can't be determined in part for a failure. Trust me, it's what I do buddy.
You and me both :cheers:
 

Trackaholic

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911 GT3 has a 12.9:1 compression ratio and runs fine in CA. 100 degree track days and all. The Voodoo will be totally fine as well.

To get back on topic, the weight of the GT350 with Track Pack will be 3700 lbs or slightly more. IMO.

-T
 

krt22

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Porsche replaced every single 991 GT3 motor under a recall, perhaps this is why!
 

krt22

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Loose connecting rod bolts caused crankcase failure and engine fires.
Maybe initiated by excessive knock...who knows!

Sorry I was being facetious based on some of the silliness posted in this thread already :lol:
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