Deatschwerks X3 Fuel system

[svomadness]

So thanks to the info NGOT8R provided, I've been emailing back and forth with Carl at Aeromotive (who was formerly with VaporWorx). Sounds like he has a setup that will work for those of us that want to retain a factory like returnless setup with multiple pumps. I linked our thread here and hopefully we will see him here shortly if you guys have more questions

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[bankyf]

So thanks to the info NGOT8R provided, I've been emailing back and forth with Carl at Aeromotive (who was formerly with VaporWorx). Sounds like he has a setup that will work for those of us that want to retain a factory like returnless setup with multiple pumps. I linked our thread here and hopefully we will see him here shortly if you guys have more questions

I feel like KPM has this problem solved better than anyone else at this point. Interested to see what aeromotive has to offer, but their coyote efforts have been disappointing thus far.

 

[svomadness]

Looks like Aeromotive is now selling the KPM pumps along with VaporWorx controllers from their site now too

 

[beefcake]

the kmps are nice if your wanting a stock type system, and as always group specials on them

 

[NGOT8R]

I’ve yet to purchase the PWM from VaporWorx, but it’s one of four remaining items left on my parts list for the turbo install.

 

[CarlC]

Hello gents, Carl with Aeromotive - VaporWorx here.

OEM FPCM/FSCM/FPPM/etc. can be fickle things. Too much and too little power/voltage will make them unhappy and throw codes. Trying to fake them out by using dummy loads to try and keep the diagnostics functional has been found to not work.

Though we have a passion for our cars, developing a single high-power FPCM for low production volumes makes little financial sense for the OEM's. So, they will find creative ways around the issue. For example, the 2009-14 CTS-V2 has twin pumps that require more power than what the standard FSCM can handle during high fuel demand pulsing. To get around that a 74psi mechanical regulator (normal is 85psi safety overpressure) is installed in the fuel module and the pumps are latched on full speed + the electrical system voltage is increased. Fuel pressure is bounced off the mechanical regulator, but since the fuel pressure sensor allows real-time injector deltaP it all works. From a programming side, to protect the vehicle it is not possible to turn off this function.

Regarding the controller in the offline emails/internal discussions reference a VaporWorx piggyback (Ally) controller to work alongside the FPCM. In short, the FPCM controls the primary pump, the VaporWorx the 2/3 pumps by using the pulsed signal to the primary pump as a guide. Either a Pump+ or Pump- pulsed signal can be used.

There are two modes of operation available:

1) DualX: This controller drives the second pump all the time. This is needed, as mentioned earlier, where multiple pumps tie into a common manifold to prevent fuel backfeed. This controller type is used for Cadillac CTS-V2 dual-pump modules with high-output pumps and KPM1500. Adding a check valve to these pump designs is not practical since the overall length is short. There is no outlet neck like traditional aftermarket pumps, hence the pump module is shorter, hence the tank is shorter, hence there is insufficient height for necked pumps.

2) Auto-on: This controller turns on the second pump at 5psi boost using a provided MAP sensor/mounting block. Check valve pumps are needed. These are used with naked pump designs that are susceptible to slosh. Think Demon and Hellelephants where the crate engines come with a single FPCM but need help to drive dual/triple pumps.

Both systems do not provide a 1:1 ratio of primary vs. secondary output. We found on some FPCM's that providing too much help at lower DC's, or not enough help at higher DC's, would force a MIL code. In general, the VaporWorx controller will lag behind the FPCM during lower DC's, and out run it at higher DC's. The VaporWorx controller can comfortably handle two brushed pumps (450/525/s DW400's, etc.)

The VaporWorx Ally controller can operate up to 22v. There is also a SmartRamp controller available that uses the output duty cycle of the pump controller (VW or OEM) to provide a signal to the JMS FuelMax. This allows only enough voltage increase to meet the fuel pressure requirement and nothing more. It is, IMO, more elegant than using a TPS, MAP, or other indirect measurement.

Before being acquired by Aeromotive, VaporWorx was a dealer for KPM. KPM is the only real OEM type fuel module out there. Jet/siphon pumps, safety overpressure, sealed swirl pot, Bosch pumps, etc. It does require an inline filter. It's the choice for my new build that needs a larger pumping system. My tank is also very wide vs. modern so very susceptible to slosh.

The current KPM1500 is a completely different design than the prior StreetFigher. However, the KPM1500 lower pumping section (everything below the hat) is the same for all models so some conversion and adapters are needed to make it fit right, but KPM has done the homework here.

The wiring diagrams from earlier in the thread do not show which side is pulsed. However, GM and MOPAR both use positive pulse. It is easier to do current monitoring, short circuit, and diagnostics when the ground is not pulsed. Though the ground is not pulsed it is monitored by the FPCM. I've not had the opportunity to check a modern Ford chassis, but a voltmeter check with the engine running would tell which side is pulsed. Measure from Pump+ to ground with the engine running. Pump+ on GT cars is the larger outboard wire. The two center wires are Pump- and fuel level sensor low reference/ground. If the voltage is 13v/battery, then the negative is pulsed. If the voltage is lower than 13v/battery, then the positive is pulsed. The exact voltage is not important, just that it is substantially lower than battery. With a GT pump and 60psi the voltage will likely be around 8-9v.

 

[HKusp]

Thanks for stopping by and sharing your knowledge with us Carl. It's always nice when someone in the industry shares their insight with those of us that can't leave well enough alone.

 

[NGOT8R]

Anyone here with a voltmeter able to check for voltage and confirm whether we have oiler + or - ? I don’t have access to any tools at the moment and I also live in an apartment that doesn’t allow working on cars, or I would do it.

To anyone, who steps up to conduct this test for the good of the community, please coordinate with Carl, so he can come back here and list which system supports Returnless and Return style fuel systems, in order to make it easier for potential customers when placing orders.

Thanks

 

[svomadness]

Curiosity was killing me so I hooked up my cheapy multimeter and commanded the fuel pump on using FDRS. My 21 GT currently has the VMP blower pulled off to deal with injector issues, so I can't test things with the car running at the moment. I saw 10.7 volts at the pump at 11.6 battery voltage with FDRS commanding 75% duty cycle. I'm leaning towards our FPDM is positive pulsed but wouldn't say my test is definitive because Ford's software has been known to be inaccurate when it comes to commanding actuators. I'll hopefully have the car running later this week and will do a proper test with my good multimeter that's at work. I can also hook a scope up to see the square wave just to be certain. I plan on running dual pumps in a Radium hanger and it looks like the Ally controller will be an almost perfect fit for my setup. Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us Carl!

 

[SheepDog]

earlier in the thread do not show which side is pulsed.

I bet @engineermike or @mejohn50 knows.

Welcome to the forum Carl, and thanks again for all your help troubleshooting my system and getting me squared away.

 

[CarlC]

Glad to help. If possible reduce the commanded duty cycle to something like 40% to give a definitive average voltage reduction.

 

[mejohn50]

I bet @engineermike or @mejohn50 knows.

Welcome to the forum Carl, and thanks again for all your help troubleshooting my system and getting me squared away.

I‘m not near my car to test it and it’s not something I’ve tested. Mike has dug way deeper into the controls than I have.

 

[svomadness]

My choices for duty cycle were only 47% and 75% and it was acting more like an on/off switch between the 2 so I'm definitely suspect of the results

 

[CarlC]

47% should work.

 

[svomadness]

Ran to work on my day off in the name of science lol! I'm like a kid when it comes to these things. Anyway, 5.4 volts at idle on a running 24 stang (identical FPCM and wiring) and scope showed a square wave form on the power side

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