Deatschwerks X2 Series Fuel Hat

[Dominant1]

What do you think of the return fuel system that Rodeheaver's Hotrod Shop offers for around $1,300 for a 2017 mustang stage 2 whipple with ID1050X Injectors?Drag Race Only

you need to call roadheavers. I did about a month ago to order a kit and they were backlogged on parts (covid19), so much so he couldn’t take my order. He Said it would be a couple of months wait. I called Terry Beefcake Reeves @ Beefcake racing and ordered a dual pump Fore fuel system for my car for just over $1500. He had everything ready to go..

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[Spoolingitup]

Glad to see you finally got your kit. i know from previous posts you were going on 3 months wait time. Did you change it over to Dw or did vmp just replace their original kit with Dw?

They made the change,it may be a new permanent deal due to supply vs demand and CV19

 

[Dominant1]

Crank hp? Maybe if you spin them hard. Definitely wouldn't try either of those with rwhp without a booster.

1000 bhp on a blown E85 setup is roughly 512 lph. 1300 bhp (blown E85) is roughly 666 lph.

The 400's (at 13.5v) will flow roughly 350 lph at 75 psi (50 or 55 base + system backpressure).
The 300's (at 13.5v) will flow roughly 290 lph at 70 psi. (50 or 55 base + system backpressure).

Keep in mind one of the pumps has to run the syphon (Radium estimates about 40 lph loss) and both have overflow requirements from the wasted return line. So you're talking 50-100 lph just to pay the bills and then injector consumption after that. You can run the syphon off the return line, but the draw from the passive tank is gonna suffer and be much slower. Even at 40 lph, if you make a long hard left turn, and most of your fuel moves to the passenger side, that means about 15 minutes + to move 1/4 tank back to the other side.

You can spin them harder and improve the output significantly and I like that DW actually under reports their pump voltage thresholds.

Read and tell me what you think.

https://www.deatschwerks.com/blog/introducing-deatschwerks-x2-series-mustang-module

 

[Angrey]

Read and tell me what you think.

https://www.deatschwerks.com/blog/introducing-deatschwerks-x2-series-mustang-module

Pump manufacturers quote power numbers that need clarification. 1) is the power number for gasoline or E-85? 2) N/A or turbo or supercharged? 3) Are the power levels quoted based upon flow rates at 3 bar (43.5 psi) or at pressures typically required in high hp applications?

Can two 400's support 1500 hp? Sure, if it's naturally aspirated, gasoline and at 43.5 psi. Show me a setup that can do such things? You can't.

In the real world, almost everyone who has to reach that level of power does so with a supercharger or turbo. Most people have to use race fuel or E-85 to reach those levels (again, INCREASING the flow rate required).

Go to any fuel calculator and you'll see. For example:

1500 horsepower for N/A gasoline: 525 lph. N/A E-85: 646 lph. Forced induction gasoline: 630 lph. Forced induction E-85: 769 lph.

So let's say you concede virtually the only REAL way to make 1500 crank horsepower is blown E-85 and we use 770 lph as our flow requirement.

Now the next step is to look at the pump manufacturers curve/data for the pump (unless you've found a tuner that likes injector pressures at 43.5 psi). Most tuners prefer 50-55 psi as a base of pressure, indexed for boost (meaning if you're running 20 psi, the fuel has to run 20 psi extra to yield a net differential of 55 psi at the injector).

My post was based off DW's own tech sheets which show, at 75 psi, the DW 400 flows roughly 360 lph.

And again, because this is a saddle tank application we're talking about, PART of the pump output is wasted on the syphon (there's an additional nipple that's drilled out to flow the syphon, which acts like a "leak" in the pump). Rough numbers from Radium indicate a loss of about 40 lph at 3 bar (worse at higher pressure).

I incorrectly added the flow of the return line because at absolute maximum flow, the return side feed comes close to zero (in essence, it either makes 75 psi and the flow to the injector or it falls short and there's no return feed at all).

Having said ALL that, realistically, with REAL numbers and not rosy assumptions, twin 400's on E-85, with a jet syphon loss and 20 psi of boost will support (theoretically) about 680 lph (or about 1325 crank hp). With a 12.5% drivetrain loss that translates to about 1150 to the wheel.

As I said, both setups can be made to support WAY more, but with a voltage booster and DW will confirm their pumps have been abuse tested well beyond their stated voltage limits.

I'm not knocking DW at all, love their gear. What I'm pointing out is that hp claims and pumps don't always include all the relevant details

 

[imrex613]

Just ordered the X2 to do my fuel system seems like the best option for me. It should be more than enough fuel for even on e85, I don't think
ill ever see 4 digit power numbers

 

[Whitedevil95]

Just ordered the X2 to do my fuel system seems like the best option for me. It should be more than enough fuel for even on e85, I don't think
ill ever see 4 digit power numbers

Have you installed yet?

 

[imrex613]

Have you installed yet?

I did and I love it. Install is smooth if you have mechanical knowledge. I believe since it uses the stock hat you don't have the issue with running lean at 1/4. I just ordered an 8AN and 6AN PTFE hose line kit from amazon, both came with fittings. Just went with a basic Holley FPR and fuel filter. I believe DW sells a kit but this was the most cost efficient route. I only took pics during the install but nothing of the finish product but I'll attach those below. Total fuel system was around 1100 I believe and it will support 1000+on e85. Any questions I'd be more than happy to answer.

 

[Whitedevil95]

Awesome. I do have some questions. What did you do for wiring and did you have to pull the bucket off of your stock pumps?

 

[imrex613]

Awesome. I do have some questions. What did you do for wiring and did you have to pull the bucket off of your stock pumps?

For wiring I just used (2) 4-wire relays. It's literally the same thing such as the Lethal wiring kit minus the plug and play adapter which is nice but IMO highly overpriced because it's so simple to remake yourself. My wiring setup with fuse holders maybe cost $10? Their kit is $159.99 and we have the exact same components. I could make a little diagram for you if you wanted to do it yourself.

You do have to pull the bucket off your stock pump. The hardest part is getting the 3 tabs to release together so you can separate it but overall not a bad job.

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