Upgrade Roush cooling or upgrade/swap to ESS G3X or whipple 3.0?

[FunkyMuffler]

Hello all, so recently ive been disliking my roush blower a lot more due to finally seeing just how bad these things heat soak, ive been thinking about either upgrading the cooling system with the roush max cooling kit and the jokerz intercooler brick. Car does seem to slow damn badly after 95-100mph during high pulls, especially after 110 it looks like its hitting a wall, ive posted a recent dragy run and countless people have been saying to switch tuners(which i already have) and swap blowers but knowing that option will cost a lot more, This is my daily driver and car was last tested at 678 whp before the tuner swap 2 days ago. Still yet to test the new 60-130. When I was doing the datalogs with the new tuner, on the pulls he showed the IAT2 were at 135 which were higher than what he wouldve liked to see, intake temps are defitely these blowers biggest issue and is causing power and timing loss above 100, the 60-100 feels good for the most. Regardless of what route i take in the future, i plan on converting to e85 sometime soon. main goals in the end are to be in the low 5's 60-130 but idk where the estimated hp number would need to be to get there. Attached is the before 60-130 with previous tuner, currently don’t know where the car is at power and dragy time yet after the new tune switch

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[JoeCee]

Do you have a stock heat exchanger? If so upgrade it. Talk about heat soak and high iat’s, try owning a pre 2013 GT500 with that awful m122 blower and minuscule heat exchanger! I’m sure that is way worse than your set up.

 

[robvas]

If by 'upgrading cooling' you mean add an interchiller, do that.

 

[engineermike]

Don’t make any changes until after you switch to e85. E85 almost completely negates the poor intercooling. If that’s not enough power, drop it to a 2.8” pulley. You’ll be surprised at how much performance you gain. It might require a ported blower to get into the low 5’s 60-130. @Autopart101 has gone down this path recently with great results.

 

[HKusp]

What Mike said. I'll second that statement on the old GT500 and m122 Eaton. It was really bad. The VMP Gen2R with their tipple pass HE and a Davies Craig inter-cooler pump upgrade was night and day better. If you could do an HE upgrade to that triple pass VMP unit on your Roush, it would make a HUGE difference even without going to E85. E85 will make a big difference because the combustion event is so much cooler compared to 93, like 2-300 degrees cooler.

 

[mepawn]

What Mike said. I'll second that statement on the old GT500 and m122 Eaton. It was really bad. The VMP Gen2R with their tipple pass HE and a Davies Craig inter-cooler pump upgrade was night and day better. If you could do an HE upgrade to that triple pass VMP unit on your Roush, it would make a HUGE difference even without going to E85. E85 will make a big difference because the combustion event is so much cooler compared to 93, like 2-300 degrees cooler.

You could also go for an FI Interchiller kit and have your IATs at or below ambient at all times.

 

[DougS550]

You could also go for an FI Interchiller kit and have your IATs at or below ambient at all times.

To me, installing a highly efficient Interchiller system with an added condenser (might not be necessary), and thermal phenolic intake plenum spacers, thermal SC blanket, would help the most in controlling high IAT temps but, a 3-core radiator, a higher volume flow rate intercooler pump?. When I installed my interchiller I budgeted in my project, to upgrade all components related to radiator, intercooler system, AC system etc to remove/reduce the possibility of heat soak issues by maximizing cooling efficiency within the system.

 

[JoeCee]

What Mike said. I'll second that statement on the old GT500 and m122 Eaton. It was really bad. The VMP Gen2R with their tipple pass HE and a Davies Craig inter-cooler pump upgrade was night and day better. If you could do an HE upgrade to that triple pass VMP unit on your Roush, it would make a HUGE difference even without going to E85. E85 will make a big difference because the combustion event is so much cooler compared to 93, like 2-300 degrees cooler.

Agreed! On my 2011 I got the vmp triple pass with fans and it was night and day difference! I worship the ground Engineer Mike walks on, but switching to E85 will require many more $$ upgrades compared to a simple heat exchanger swap. Although it will also add more power.

 

[engineermike]

.... switching to E85 will require many more $$ upgrades

This is the part that annoys me. With the Roush kit you could run E85 at stock boost on the stock fuel pump with a BAP and tuning. I'm certain no tuner will "allow" that, though. Even with a 2.8 pulley you could get by with just a DW400 and BAP, but again you're on your own for tuning. This should be a <$600 upgrade if you factor in the BAP, pump, then add the tuning, but instead the tuners require a several thousand dollar fuel system plus the cost of tuning and device.

 

[JoeCee]

This is the part that annoys me. With the Roush kit you could run E85 at stock boost on the stock fuel pump with a BAP and tuning. I'm certain no tuner will "allow" that, though. Even with a 2.8 pulley you could get by with just a DW400 and BAP, but again you're on your own for tuning. This should be a <$600 upgrade if you factor in the BAP, pump, then add the tuning, but instead the tuners require a several thousand dollar fuel system plus the cost of tuning and device.

That is why we need all new for 2026 Engineermiketuning.com!

 

[DougS550]

This is the part that annoys me. With the Roush kit you could run E85 at stock boost on the stock fuel pump with a BAP and tuning. I'm certain no tuner will "allow" that, though. Even with a 2.8 pulley you could get by with just a DW400 and BAP, but again you're on your own for tuning. This should be a <$600 upgrade if you factor in the BAP, pump, then add the tuning, but instead the tuners require a several thousand dollar fuel system plus the cost of tuning and device.

I thought Wengerd would make a tune for that combo. I just emailed him asking if he would. E-85 definitely reduces IAT2

 

[DougS550]

Wengerd said as long as fuel pressure is good, he sees no issue tuning with either a stock boost and BAP or 2.8 pulley and DW400 PUMP

 

[Mach1Racer]

I thought Wengerd would make a tune for that combo. I just emailed him asking if he would. E-85 definitely reduces IAT2

Correct me if I’m wrong.

E-85 will lower the temp of the mixture entering the cylinder on the downward piston stoke with port injection. However, depending on location of the IAT sensor, the stock computer wouldn’t notice it the cooling effect.

Only reason I’m saying this is because my Odin kit has a IAT in the back of the blower after the intercooler bricks. I noticed 0 changes in IAT (on the dash) changing from 93 pump to E-85. Either way, the E-85 is still a benefit when tuning for more power.

I have seen a difference in IAT with the Water/Meth injection after the T/B.

Where is the sensor on the Roush TVS2650 kit?

 

[FunkyMuffler]

Don’t make any changes until after you switch to e85. E85 almost completely negates the poor intercooling. If that’s not enough power, drop it to a 2.8” pulley. You’ll be surprised at how much performance you gain. It might require a ported blower to get into the low 5’s 60-130. @Autopart101 has gone down this path recently with great results.

Im on a 2.8 before and after tune switch!

 

[FunkyMuffler]

This is the part that annoys me. With the Roush kit you could run E85 at stock boost on the stock fuel pump with a BAP and tuning. I'm certain no tuner will "allow" that, though. Even with a 2.8 pulley you could get by with just a DW400 and BAP, but again you're on your own for tuning. This should be a <$600 upgrade if you factor in the BAP, pump, then add the tuning, but instead the tuners require a several thousand dollar fuel system plus the cost of tuning and device.

I should already mentioned my mod list so that’s my bad but I’m currently already on a BAP, 2.8 pulley, catless headers, and an catback borla exhaust, I still have the roush 47lb injectors in

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