GT500 testing in Arizona

[l'Ingegnere]

Wait... an official "Ring" time for the GT350R?... say it ain't so, Joe...

There isn't one. Ford doesn't release performance numbers from internal testing.

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[9secondko]

There's more to a car then just raw hp. The gt500 was very fast and should with 662hp. So it was much lighter and 80+ more hp then the zl1. But the zl1 held its own or better on the track and road handeling even being underpowered and heavier. The new ZL1 puts the old one to shame in every category, so has raised the bar. And you have it backwards, the zl1 beat the R at the ring, not the way you said. Now I would expect the new gt500 to be better then the ZL1 now that it has a benchmark to go after. To many just look at drag times as defining how good the car is when there are many more things that make up the whole package.

The "published" time for the R is anything but. It's not an instrumentally measured number with any real bearing.

That said, a car meant for the track with 124 more horsepower and 221 more ft-lbs of torque had better be orders of magnitude faster. Otherwise it would be a laughing stock.

Ford did do some ridiculous things with the '13 500 in terms of tire. The engine simply ran away from the zl1. The suspension held its own. But the car was severely handicapped with a ridiculous tire choice. Therefore tested with stock tires, there were a few instances that the zl1 with better tires (or shaved in some cases... don't forget that one...) could actually corner better on certain courses.

Of course that was dealt with by installing better tires. But then it wasn't a true "factory stock comparison. And it's there where the Ford marketing guys really needed to be listened to more by the bean counters. As mentioned ch as magazine bench racing isn't supposed to matter, in the minds of your average joe, it definitely does. Ford had the better car. And they stabbed it in the back with pathetic tires. And that live axle. Great for straight lines on smooth roads. Nightmares for bumps, potholes, curbs, etc. that thing was like tigger from Winnie the Pooh if you hit even the small curb at the track.

Let's see what the new boosted Mustang does with the new boosted Camaro.

Lots of respect for the new ZL1. It looks great, drives great, runs blazing fast, and corners like mad. It's one of the greatest sports/pony cars south of the z06 that is available today. I'd take it over the gtr any day. I also have much respect for dialing in the toque and horsepower figures matching so well. Certain engineers have done themselves very proud.

Ford definitely has their work cut out for them.

But building off the 350r, with the English be tech at their disposal, it may be a rerun of 2013, but prayerfully, no more inexplicable gimpy tire syndrome. The IRS is in place, so no live axle bump and lift over bumps either. Should be quite the performance machine.

 

[02gtnh]

What numbers are y'all comparing for the Ring?

http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife
:cheers:

 

[02gtnh]

The "published" time for the R is anything but. It's not an instrumentally measured number with any real bearing.

That said, a car meant for the track with 124 more horsepower and 221 more ft-lbs of torque had better be orders of magnitude faster. Otherwise it would be a laughing stock.

Ford did do some ridiculous things with the '13 500 in terms of tire. The engine simply ran away from the zl1. The suspension held its own. But the car was severely handicapped with a ridiculous tire choice. Therefore tested with stock tires, there were a few instances that the zl1 with better tires (or shaved in some cases... don't forget that one...) could actually corner better on certain courses.

Of course that was dealt with by installing better tires. But then it wasn't a true "factory stock comparison. And it's there where the Ford marketing guys really needed to be listened to more by the bean counters. As mentioned ch as magazine bench racing isn't supposed to matter, in the minds of your average joe, it definitely does. Ford had the better car. And they stabbed it in the back with pathetic tires. And that live axle. Great for straight lines on smooth roads. Nightmares for bumps, potholes, curbs, etc. that thing was like tigger from Winnie the Pooh if you hit even the small curb at the track.

Let's see what the new boosted Mustang does with the new boosted Camaro.

Lots of respect for the new ZL1. It looks great, drives great, runs blazing fast, and corners like mad. It's one of the greatest sports/pony cars south of the z06 that is available today. I'd take it over the gtr any day. I also have much respect for dialing in the toque and horsepower figures matching so well. Certain engineers have done themselves very proud.

Ford definitely has their work cut out for them.

But building off the 350r, with the English be tech at their disposal, it may be a rerun of 2013, but prayerfully, no more inexplicable gimpy tire syndrome. The IRS is in place, so no live axle bump and lift over bumps either. Should be quite the performance machine.

Don't disagree, the gt500 was a beast and tires were a let down, but so were the brakes. They could do a hero lap, but kept fading each lap after. But other then those two items, she would do well.:cheers:

As far as ring time goes, I know Ford never released, but it is listed as a time and I was just correcting the other guy who said the R was faster. And as you said, the ZL1 should of been. It was over 100lbs heavier, but has over a 100 more hp and torque.

 

[9secondko]

Don't disagree, the gt500 was a beast and tires were a let down, but so were the brakes. They could do a hero lap, but kept fading each lap after. But other then those two items, she would do well.:cheers:

As far as ring time goes, I know Ford never released, but it is listed as a time and I was just correcting the other guy who said the R was faster. And as you said, the ZL1 should of been. It was over 100lbs heavier, but has over a 100 more hp and torque.

Yep. Forgot about the brakes. Total facepalm.

And the new zl1 has great torque. I think it's the likely differentiator on a long track with some slow corners. The torque simply launches that thing right back where it started. The 350r needs to build since it can't maintain the high revs in some spots. A 124 horse difference can be managed considering the weight. But that supercharged torque won't be denied. The difference is too great. And it comes on quicker.

Of course the 350 may see increased output, but let's be real here. Both are track cars. The 350r is a triumph of an NA track car. But the zl1 is supercharged and they aren't direct competitors in that sense. Yet it's all there is for Joe. The top camaro is the boosted zl1 and the top mustang is the NA gt350r.

It's not apples to apples, but they're the best you can get from the factory on either side.

It's time for Ford to reveal the Cobra and chevy the z28 so we can get some proper comparisons and see what's what.

 

[GuardGT]

It's time for Ford to reveal the Cobra and chevy the z28 so we can get some proper comparisons and see what's what.

QFT

 

[DrumReaper]

http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife
:cheers:

Smh... that's the made up HPKingsdotcom time. No official time has been published for the R on that track.

No doubt, the ZL1 out performs the it on the Ring, but what does it do on different courses and what happens when the infamous heatsoak comes to play?... or one of the 10 radiators goes kaput?

 

[Grimace427]

http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife
:cheers:

Smh... that's the made up ******************** time. No official time has been published for the R on that track.

+1

That 'Ring time was made up by H-PowerKings.com and was circulated by all the other buzzfeed-level auto sites.

 

[machsmith]

I have zero doubt the new ZL1 competitor will beat it in every facet. Ford only needs to do some weight management and cool it well. Brakes will be there and tires will be there. Make no mistake it will blast this zl1. The only place where the zl1 will be competitive is a course. Ford will pound it on the strip, looks department and in sales.

 

[ttime500]

Smh... that's the made up ******************** time. No official time has been published for the R on that track.

No doubt, the ZL1 out performs the it on the Ring, but what does it do on different courses and what happens when the infamous heatsoak comes to play?... or one of the 10 radiators goes kaput?

The Z06 time on there was also made up, it was never officially published either. So far there has been no signs of heatsoak or overheating. When a radiator goes kaput?.... Doesn't that qualify as a warranty claim? No different if it happens on a 350! It doesn't come from the factory that way.

 

[BmacIL]

The 500 will blitz the new ZL1 pretty easily around any track. The specs are pretty awesome.

 

[Clink]

The 500 will blitz the new ZL1 pretty easily around any track. The specs are pretty awesome.

:gossip: please lol

 

[DrumReaper]

The Z06 time on there was also made up, it was never officially published either. So far there has been no signs of heatsoak or overheating. When a radiator goes kaput?.... Doesn't that qualify as a warranty claim? No different if it happens on a 350! It doesn't come from the factory that way.

I don't think you're tracking well.

10+ radiators on a track car... pardon the pun, but let that soak in a minute. A 350 has 3 or 4. I love it when someone calls out a Chevy issue... they attack the 350. Sorry bud, but the 350 doesn't have a S/C to cool.

10+........ that's a lot of problem points on a "track" car.

 

[PatrickGT]

No, it's a lot of engineering solutions on a track car. Like one that was actually built, tested, revised, and properly made for the track so the manufacturer doesn't end up in a class action lawsuit because their track-oriented vehicle melts itself on the track.

It's stupid to think that the engineers actually bothering to properly cool the vehicle, putting in the time and effort, is somehow a failure. Zero engineering prowess would arrive there, or a severe lack of logic and reasoning.

 

[DrumReaper]

Really?... so you think I'm referring to the car as an engineering failure? Smh... C'mon man, be for real.

How much weight goes into that S/C and that 10+ Radiator handicap?... while referring to said application as a "track car".

Think about it... from an engineering standpoint, is the powerplant+cooling unit appropriate for the application?

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