Why no V6 Ecoboost?

[Wildcat]

No, the V6 turbo will be a SVT and slot in, above the GT.

Well thanks a lot of ruining my day.

Just kidding. I figured that was probably the case. Oh well. Maybe it will be an option if finances allow. Since you said above GT, am I correct in assuming the price would a few thousand north of a premium GT, then? Somewhere around 45K?

Sponsored

 

[w3rkn]

Are you a Ford insider?
The current ecoboost 4 cylinder is not an SVT offering, why would a 6 cylinder ecoboost be?

Granted, I feel confident that the SVT group will make some interesting things happen to the ecoboost Mustang in the future but that doesn't mean every ecoboost 6 cylinder would be SVT (once such a motor becomes an option in the Mustang).

The GT will remain naturally aspirated for a good many years (DFI in a couple of years). That has nothing to do with specialty cars, that offer high torque engines based on turbos.

A 3.5L turbo engine is easily capable of 450ft-lbs of torque.. Much higher than the V8. So of course it will be in special vehicle (ie: svt).

Not hard to understand.. or anticipate.

 

[Twin Turbo]

OK, so the GT will likely remain a n/a V8...........but is there room for a forced induction V8 above the GT?

 

[w3rkn]

Depends on how many special vehicles Ford wants to make.

One of those at the nurb might be supercharged.

 

[JoeDogInKC]

w3rkn,

Everything you post comes along with a sense of conviction that you are "in the know". Are you, or are you not?

 

[Tim Hilliard]

One of the reasons Im buying a GT instead of another car is I want the last great generation of purebred V8. The V8 is going the way of the dodo bird. The crazy Cafe standards are coming. The intoxicating sound, the massive N/A HP all take me back to my youth and I need one last great American V8...

Make no doubt if ya got'em or can get'em you better smoke'em.

Is everyone listening? I'll buy an EcoBoost down the road, but I want a N/A screw you world V8 while they are still 'legal'

 

[Tim Hilliard]

The GT will remain naturally aspirated for a good many years (DFI in a couple of years).
Not hard to understand.. or anticipate.

I honestly don't think the gains will be worth the expense for DFI in this particular engine. It's a lot of hardware for a car with huge specific output, rpm capability and gearing not conducive to fuel mileage. Let's be honest it's a dinosaur. That is the visceral appeal of any performance V8 car.

As the late great Tom Hnatiw was famous for saying "Do you need a car like this? No. Do you want a car like this???" I do, I do Tom

 

[w3rkn]

I honestly don't think the gains will be worth the expense for DFI in this particular engine. It's a lot of hardware for a car with huge specific output, rpm capability and gearing not conducive to fuel mileage. Let's be honest it's a dinosaur. That is the visceral appeal of any performance V8 car.

As the late great Tom Hnatiw was famous for saying "Do you need a car like this? No. Do you want a car like this???" I do, I do Tom

I didn't suggest a 5.0 DFI engine, I just said the GT will remain NA.


Additionally, am not "in the know", but I know what efficiency future engines will target, so it is easy to know what hardware is required. You can also easily follow BMWs lead, as their 2.99L engine powers the $60k M3/4.

To compete in the future, Ford will have to do the same. A turbo v6 Mustang is inevitable.. anyone who can't see/know it, is a new to cars.

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

To compete in the future, Ford will have to do the same. A turbo v6 Mustang is inevitable.. anyone who can't see/know it, is a new to cars.

Yeah, agreed, but I think they'll also offer a V8 for next few decades, although it might have to be a 3.99 litre for tax purposes.

 

[scottpe]

Depends on how many special vehicles Ford wants to make.

One of those at the nurb might be supercharged.

Never heard even a hint of supercharger whine on any of the video I've seen, so I doubt it. If I've missed something, feel free to enlighten me.

I have a feeling the next FI V8 in the stable will be an Ecoboost. Given that we know the Trinity is history, turbocharging will be the most efficient way to exceed its power levels with a lower displacement motor (e.g. the 5.2), if that is their intent. Not to mention, Ecoboost is their big "thing" now. A halo model to showcase the true capabilities of their technology makes sense, IMO.

 

[Twin Turbo]

A V8 Mustang just has to be top dog.

The M3/M4 reverting to 6-cylinder power is fine because the M3 has been a 4, a 6 and 8 and now back to a 6 again.

I hope there's a future for the Mustang V8 after Coyote........hence my wish for a 4-4.5 litre ecoboost V8.

I'll welcome an ecoboost V6, but only if a V8 remains top of the tree.

 

[w3rkn]

Never heard even a hint of supercharger whine on any of the video I've seen, so I doubt it. If I've missed something, feel free to enlighten me.

I have a feeling the next FI V8 in the stable will be an Ecoboost. Given that we know the Trinity is history, turbocharging will be the most efficient way to exceed its power levels with a lower displacement motor (e.g. the 5.2), if that is their intent. Not to mention, Ecoboost is their big "thing" now. A halo model to showcase the true capabilities of their technology makes sense, IMO.

Understand, to have TUrbo, you need DFI, or it's a waste of engineering.

DFI adds UP TO 20% gains, depending on how inefficient the original design was. But Companies split those gains to be consumer friendly. So 10% more HP, & 10% more MPG.. Or, 5% more HP and 15% mpg!! Not exact, but you get a layman's understanding of what they can play with.


Ford is obviously working on a DFI V8, but it will not be a 5 liter engine. It will most likely be a 4.0 DFI engine.

THEN... after a few years they will slap a turbo on THAT^ engine.




*Expect the Whipple SC to sell like hotcakes for the 5.0 crowd.

 

[Twin Turbo]

Ford is obviously working on a DFI V8, but it will not be a 5 liter engine. It will most likely be a 4.0 DFI engine.

THEN... after a few years they will slap a turbo on THAT^ engine.

Interesting..........I could live with that.

However, I would expect Ford to give the Coyote DI, especially for the '18MY refresh to see S550 through to the end of production...............and then an all new (smaller capacity) V8 for the all new S550 replacement, whenever that may be.

That's pure speculation on my part though

 

[mustang#16]

If the future for Mustang means small displacement 4 and V6 Eco-boosted engines, I understand that. But the Mustang has never been exclusively about practicality. It's also an emotional car, a fun car, a car that means different things to different folks. For me, I can't imagine a Mustang without a V8. The sound and feel of a V8 is such a big part of driving this car and what makes it somewhat exclusive today. If keeping the V8 within upcoming EPA rules means Ford has to significantly downsize the V8 I would be for that.

I remember renting a 2004 T-bird with the 3.9L V8 engine. The 3.9L V8 was a Jaguar design but used exclusively in the Lincoln LS and T-bird cars. Made in Lima OH, it produced 280HP which, when you compare it to the 4.6L 260HP V8 used in the Mustang GT at that time, is very good. The engine also had that great V8 sound that adds so much to the emotional enjoyment of driving a car.

If the 3.9L V8 made 280HP in 2004, I would expect it could do significantly better today. A N/A 3.9L V8 would likely not have as good of a performance as an Eco-Boost V6 engine but, for those that don't race their car at every stop light or don't take their car to the track, a N/A small V8 would be a nice option in a "Heritage" edition of Mustang.

If upcoming EPA rules mean the V8 will eventually no longer be the top engine in the Mustang, so be it. But Mustang should never ditch the V8 -- it's part of the Mustang's appeal. Just resize and offer it in a "Heritage" edition (or something like that).

 

[Tim Hilliard]

I honestly don't think the gains will be worth the expense for DFI in this particular engine. It's a lot of hardware for a car with huge specific output, rpm capability and gearing not conducive to fuel mileage. Let's be honest it's a dinosaur. That is the visceral appeal of any performance V8 car.

As the late great Tom Hnatiw was famous for saying "Do you need a car like this? No. Do you want a car like this???" I do, I do Tom

I know I am quoting myself - SAD

Because I work in a different industry I need to correct my statement. I reached out to a friend who lets just say has a better understanding of where we are with DI. I asked him for his thoughts based on what my thoughts were. I had touched on some of them on another thread but even though I thought it through it I failed to think through all the advantages.

He corrected me on the following:

1. DI system hardware is now cheap and sorted.
2. No fuel lost through the exhaust during valve overlap (exhaust/intake valve open at the same time) because fuel is injected into cylinder not intake. -Fuel Economy/Emissions
3. No fuel in intake allows more air flow into cylinder (more room) increasing VE (volumetric efficiency) - Power
4. DI injection sprays cool fuel(not preheated by intake air) directly onto piston causing a cooling effect allowing higher compression ratio (He estimates a 1/2 point) This also is a huge bonus for Supercharger/Turbo installs - As I said before running the engine right on the knocking line.
5. He estimates 2% More Power with 3% Less Fuel. - On an engine that is already extremely efficient today.

So, I stand corrected but know enough to know when I don't know everything. So if Ford adds DI to the existing engine it may very well survive the new regulations. This makes me happy, those of you waiting for what ever the next statement car is can safely assume it will have the latest technology whether it is N/A or not.

It will be intersting to see what comes next, slighter larger/smaller N/A's
or smaller blown V8's. Hopefully they can engineer around the regs. I would like to thank all of you who ordered V6 and EcoBoost's so I can have my 5.0. :ford:

Sponsored