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young at heart

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If I can be allowed a slight derail of my own thread (but related) please read on.

Can anybody tell me accurately to what extent both TC and ESC are individually mitigated or disabled in each of the three modes sport, track and drag strip?

I‘ve read plenty of speculation and opinions here but I’ve never seen a post from someone who actually knows.
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accel

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This almost happened to me yesterday. And I KNOW HOW TO DRIVE, as in, on a track, and I grew up snow driving and playing and drifting. I went to pass a slow SUV. Look in my sig… alignment and set up is way better then just good. I was already in 2nd about half throttle. I went 7/8 throttle and top of 2nd the rear completely snapped loose and I went over into her lane full sideways before I knew it, right in front of her probably 1 car length. And almost out of that lane into the curb. I had enough time to say shit 5 times as fast as I could before regaining control. Kept the wheel straight where I wanted to go. Didn’t overcorrect, let out easy even though my heart was in panic mode. I prob have it on my radar DashCam footage. (I’ll have to get a more accurate “shit” count on the replay) The pilot super sports aren’t great under 40 degrees, and mine are about due for replacement. Problem is nobody has them in 305/35/19 and 295/35/19 in stock because of Covid backlog. Same with winter (Michelin PS4 295 square) tires. You can’t get them in GT350 size right now, literally the only thing available are cup 2, worthless in winter cold, and those are terrible wear rating.
It can happen to anyone under the right conditions, out of nowhere, especially in cold weather with more than half to 3/4 worn tread. Granted I should not have been driving in tack mode without traction control. But with current tire wear it slips in just about any mode.
Yep. Happend to me with pirelly pzero, rears worn probably 9/10. Fronts 5/10. I did not even accelerate significantly, but got into an unfamiliar freeway entrance ramp with reducing radius and that was it. I managed to regain controll while fishtailing in front of another vehicle.

I do admit though that you can find much more YouTube videos on Mustang fails than any other car.

Edit: I replaced rear tires, went to car control class at nearby class and had issues reproducing what happened to me at that freeway ramp.
 
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Silver Bullitt

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If I can be allowed a slight derail of my own thread (but related) please read on.

Can anybody tell me accurately to what extent both TC and ESC are individually mitigated or disabled in each of the three modes sport, track and drag strip?

I‘ve read plenty of speculation and opinions here but I’ve never seen a post from someone who actually knows.
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Heard a good one other day;
”the problem lies between the steering wheel and the seat!”
 

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TrackMustang

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There’s a couple things at play. One, this is the most popular sports car of all time. With quantities like that, you’re going to have issues. While Camaros weren’t being made, mustangs were crashing into crowds. Even since Camaros have come back, mustangs outsell like 5:1 (guess, no idea actual numbers) so obviously they will crash 5:1.

Also, it’s a RWD V8 with 460hp and 420ftlbs stock. That’s a lot for someone who doesn’t know what their doing, and it can get away from people who do know what their doing. I grew up on the track (albeit on two wheels) and my car has puckered up my butthole a time or two.

And finally, you have ESC, advancetrac, TC, A10 etc etc etc. that’s a ton of the car making decisions for you, and the car doesn’t always know your intent and can cause issues. Unless you’re in a manual with all that nonsense turned off, the car literally has a mind of its own.

So we have a TON of inexperienced drivers, in a high horsepower RWD car, that makes decisions for the driver…
 

bnightstar

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When I first got the car it stepped out on me a lot most scary was in a rain on the highway because of aquaplaning but I manage to catch it. The scariest thing was when I jumped a curb on the street but this was the time that the car didn't stepped out I just didn't see that the road was merging and my lain disappeared totally my fault and escaped the barrier by inches. Ether way my car stopped doing that when I get good tires (not the crapy PZero's) and did a good alignment with some Total Toe In in the back. This helped the car to not slide and as my brother put it broke the car as now you can't slide it even if you want which sometimes is annoying. Ether way good alignment is all is needed and good tires.
 

ice445

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I read an NHTSA report that showed V8 S550's have DOUBLE the rate of serious injury crashes than the Ecoboost or V6 models. Similar rates to cars of 20 years ago. Just proof that a lot of power means people are driving much faster, and their skill is a much bigger factor in car control.
 

mangosmoothie

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I find the s550 to be pretty composed. My stock C5 seems a bit more rowdy - the wider rear tires and shorter wheelbase make it a bit more twitchy, and the higher torque (not necessarily peak torque but the LS definitely makes more torque before 2.5-3k in a considerably lighter car) make it step out easier IMO.
 

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My PP1 is very composed. I can drive like a total dick and it doesn’t let go. Perhaps the tires are still new ?
 

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Anyone who thinks S550s step out easily has never driven an S197....

As with literally any car from a Miata to a McLaren 720, if you don't understand the car and it's tendencies, it can get away from you. The Mustang GT is cursed with being cheap (relatively) power, and thus accessible to lots of people regardless of their aptitude for understanding driving dynamics.

Each car has it's own personality and if you go into driving a Mustang GT like you do a Subaru BRZ, you are going to have issues. High powered cars require you to learn the car, the limits of the car mechanically, and even more importantly than the characteristics of the car, the limits of the TIRES.

Most of these types of issues can almost guaranteed to be attributed to people not knowing the limits of their tires. Ford ESC/AdvanceTrac cuts power when detecting too much yaw, so it is a very forgiving system unless you have turned off the AdvancTrac via the stability control button or driving mode. People like to put cheap or used tires on these cars, drive in track mode, then act like surprise Pikachu when 420 ftlbs of torque makes their car go sideways.

When I think about my car, I think about the condition of the tires, the temperature outside, the weather, and other things to know how I should be driving that day. It's required. If you're not ready for that type of commitment, then go grab an EcoBoost. It's plenty quick and will get you into a lot less trouble.

/rant
 

Sivi70980

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My PP1 is very composed. I can drive like a total dick and it doesn’t let go. Perhaps the tires are still new ?
Same, my PP1 has always been composed. After 22.5k miles I still don't accidentally lose control and even on purpose it doesn't break the tires loose much. I do change tires out for winters so stock tires have maybe 7.5k miles on them. Even the Conti DWS06's with a 245 squared setup is very composed though. I read through threads like this and can only assume people be having heavy feet. I did just tell a non "car guy" friend the other day what traction control was because he complained about is new car bogging down when he would pull into traffic. Had to educate him that the pedals aren't on/off switches. Be safe out there!
 

Sivi70980

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Anyone who thinks S550s step out easily has never driven an S197....

As with literally any car from a Miata to a McLaren 720, if you don't understand the car and it's tendencies, it can get away from you. The Mustang GT is cursed with being cheap (relatively) power, and thus accessible to lots of people regardless of their aptitude for understanding driving dynamics.

Each car has it's own personality and if you go into driving a Mustang GT like you do a Subaru BRZ, you are going to have issues. High powered cars require you to learn the car, the limits of the car mechanically, and even more importantly than the characteristics of the car, the limits of the TIRES.

Most of these types of issues can almost guaranteed to be attributed to people not knowing the limits of their tires. Ford ESC/AdvanceTrac cuts power when detecting too much yaw, so it is a very forgiving system unless you have turned off the AdvancTrac via the stability control button or driving mode. People like to put cheap or used tires on these cars, drive in track mode, then act like surprise Pikachu when 420 ftlbs of torque makes their car go sideways.

When I think about my car, I think about the condition of the tires, the temperature outside, the weather, and other things to know how I should be driving that day. It's required. If you're not ready for that type of commitment, then go grab an EcoBoost. It's plenty quick and will get you into a lot less trouble.

/rant
My '11 GT500 scared me haha! Factory tires offered zero confidence and the electronic nannies were simply overpowered. Very fun car though!
 

Rinzler

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My '11 GT500 scared me haha! Factory tires offered zero confidence and the electronic nannies were simply overpowered. Very fun car though!
Yeah, I had a 12 GT and a 07 V6, and have driven SN95s as well. It's great that we have new people in the Mustang family, but not everyone is taking the time to learn what the car is about. It frustrates me that folks don't understand the heritage, history, and legacy of the car before complaining about it's flaws. The fact that these cars DO let you step out is a feature, not a bug!
 

JK XLR8

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4th Mustang GT......91 Saleen 400hp, 2003 Terminator 500hp, 2014 GT 500hp and now 2021 GT 750hp. In all my years never an issue. I believe a lot of the issues (with people that know how to drive) are with the tires, I could be wrong. I really enjoy the softer stickier tires for control...the Contis I have now are a real game changer, not sure how they do in the cold but they are excellent and predictable in the rain and warm weather.
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