Mustang System 2.0

[StangTime]

You guys are awesome. Thank you very much @Cathul and @StangTime

I'm going to finish up the physical install (get the trunk floor supports installed) so that part of the overall build will be finally completed and I have full use of the car again, and I'll move to tuning. I'm going to have lots of questions, I'm sure.

No problem. You will get it sounding great in time. No doubt.

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[mikes2017gt]

Your reassurance is important to me b/c right now it sure looks like a daunting task. But you're never too old to learn new tricks and this is something I've always wanted to know how to do. It's the math that scares me...that's why I need all the automated tools. For me, spreadsheets are what you use to catch oil dripping from the car. LOL!

Well, the physical install is 100% done. Trunk floor supports are in place and it's very solid. In fact, I"m going grocery shopping today and will be throwing all kinds of stuff into the trunk. I have no worries about the floor caving in.

Shot of one set of threaded inserts installed.

One tool that I've found invaluable over the years is this hand-held drill guide. It helps you drill straight holes when you're free-hand drilling. I use a drill press whenever possible, but sometimes the work piece doesn't fit in the drill press, or you need to drill straight holes in an inconvenient location b/c you were too stupid to do it beforehand, when the amp rack wasn't in the car. It even has a v-groove on the bottom for drilling into dowel rod or pipe.

And here we have a nice, clean trunk. Stereo system? What stereo system?

 

[StangTime]

Your reassurance is important to me b/c right now it sure looks like a daunting task. But you're never too old to learn new tricks and this is something I've always wanted to know how to do. It's the math that scares me...that's why I need all the automated tools. For me, spreadsheets are what you use to catch oil dripping from the car. LOL!

Well, the physical install is 100% done. Trunk floor supports are in place and it's very solid. In fact, I"m going grocery shopping today and will be throwing all kinds of stuff into the trunk. I have no worries about the floor caving in.

Shot of one set of threaded inserts installed.

One tool that I've found invaluable over the years is this hand-held drill guide. It helps you drill straight holes when you're free-hand drilling. I use a drill press whenever possible, but sometimes the work piece doesn't fit in the drill press, or you need to drill straight holes in an inconvenient location b/c you were too stupid to do it beforehand, when the amp rack wasn't in the car. It even has a v-groove on the bottom for drilling into dowel rod or pipe.

And here we have a nice, clean trunk. Stereo system? What stereo system?

Awesome work Mike! Clean install.
The tuning process sounds complicated right now because you haven't done it. Once you start, take it in small bites. If I can do it, you can. I am no audio engineer! All I can offer for advice is to get familiar with REW. Most of your time is going to be spent using the overlay feature where you will use EQ filters to alter your frequency response on screen to match your preferred house curve. Auto EQ feature comes in handy here. The measurements don't take much time and if you save a set of baseline responses of all your speakers, you are going to be able to go back to these for every tune.

 

[mikes2017gt]

Thanks! I'm certainly glad the physical install is done and everything's working. I will do my best to learn the tuning basics; I'm very glad I've got you guys to hold my hand!

 

[NotMarc]

I just read through this whole thread, and to @mikes2017gt, I'm truly impressed with the build. Earlier in the year I did my own 3 way active system (plus sub) and wrestled with the amp rack, sound deadening and all of the other idiosyncrasies you've encountered along the way. I still have not gotten back to the tune as I've been busy with work but this thread is a huge motivation. Your attention to detail is spectacular. If the timing had matched up, I would have been happy to pay you for those speaker adapters and the trunk floor supports (which I still haven't gotten around to).

Full speed ahead!

edit: p.s. The cool idea for the remote turn off quick disconnects using those barrel connectors made me say "are you kidding me" out loud. Why didn't I think of that?

 

[mikes2017gt]

Thanks very much, @NotMarc ! It's been a long haul to get to this point. I actually bought most of the equipment many months ago, but work and family have to come first. I finally had some time over the summer, but then it's literally 110 degrees in my garage and no matter how motivated you are, you can't last long in that heat. At least I can't. I had to wait until it "cooled off" and was only in the 90s in the garage.

I'd like to see some pics of your install, particularly the amp rack and sub box. I've been playing with WinISD and mulling over two 12TW3s in a sealed box or a single 12W6 in a ported box. Both boxes would be about the same size. The W6 subs are absolute monsters and the 600W I have to feed it would be a perfect match. I might even pay Mark at CAF to design a box for me that would wedge up against the back seat so I wouldn't lose that airspace like I would with box that has a straight back.

 

[Qu8Storm]

A W6 is a very nice sub. I have the 10w6v3 in the high output box that I got for a very good deal and I really like it.

 

[mikes2017gt]

I got itchy. I miss the depth of a ported sub. The Stealthbox was awesome supplementing the stock system, but now it's getting trampled by my front stage. I just bought a 12W6V3-D4 and a grill.

I kind of wanted triple 10's, just to be different but they're tuned too high (47Hz) in JL's recommended sealed box for my liking, and I'm unwilling to give them the airspace they really need to breathe. That, and three 10W6s would've been double the cost of a single 12W6.

BTW, JL doesn't specify what the Mustang Stealthbox is tuned to, but putting two and two together, I'd say about 47Hz.

Recommended sealed box size for the 12TW3-D4 is .80CF. I'd say that's about the internal volume of the Stealthbox. Keep in mind that the 12TW3 series has a super-small driver displacement of .03CF, which is positively tiny. So the Stealthbox gets to keep most of its airspace. It really is a bar-setting product, but it has its limits.

So a 47Hz tuned Stealthbox vs. 32Hz tuned 12W6: Not a fair fight at all. Additionally, I set the TWK-88 sub output to -6dB (default is -12dB) and while the bass response is much better, I really think I'd be running the 12TW3 in the Stealthbox at the ragged edge with the volumes I like to listen at. I can hear it crying at what I'd call "stupid volume" which I tend to enjoy from time to time.

The 12W6 models so well in the JL-recommended ported box, tuned to 32Hz. It should seriously thump in the 40-70Hz range, which is Kick Drum city. That's what I like. I modeled it with 500w and a 30Hz, 4th order highpass.

By my rough calculations of the space I'm willing to give up (directly behind the back seat) I've got roughly 1.3CF of airspace which is exactly what JL recommends for a ported box. I'm going to try and design a box myself and see how that looks. If I start banging my head off the keyboard, I'll hit up Mark at CAF.

*edit*
I just caught that I had the box tuned to 30Hz and JL specifies 32Hz. I corrected it in WinISD. Doesn't change much at all.

 

[Cathul]

Use the cone movement graph to find the highpass frequency in WinISD. And i would just give the 12TW3 another shot in a larger enclosure, maybe ported. Boxes are cheap to make compared to getting a new W6 sub. Because I guess with the power of your amp and the size of the stealthbox you’re not bringing the 12TW3 to it’s limit with its 15mm of excursion.

 

[StangTime]

I cheaped out on my subs and impulse bought during a clearance sale. I got a pair of JL 10W0v3 subs and of course I am second guessing my purchase. I should have spent more and bought something better. The Mustang doesn't really have the space for a ported pair of 10W0v3's. So to use them, I have to go sealed which will fit just like a Zenclosures box behind the rear seat blocking the passthrough. Not to distract from Mikes's build just throwing ideas around. I have a rough box design as per JL's recommend sealed box volume (just need to verify the corner radius for a good fit) @mikes2017gt if you need any help with a design.

 

[mikes2017gt]

I am happy to share the thread with you @StangTime . We all learn together. Thank you for offering design help. I may take you up on it. I still don't know how to use SketchUp.

I'm sure the pair of subs will sound great in properly-sized sealed box and the placement behind the seat should also help performance.

I've always had my doubts about the Stealthbox firing away from the far corner of the trunk. It looks fabulous, but I've always wondered if that corner was the best or even a good place for a sub. I've not been able to test different placement obviously, since the Stealthbox is oddly-shaped and won't stand up on it's own.

 

[Cathul]

Technically that place is good due to the corner loading.

 

[mikes2017gt]

@Cathul Yes, very true on corner loading. But I do think the Stealthbox is significantly undersized.

My original intention was to go the economical route and put the TW3 in JL's recommended ported box. I was surprised to see how well it models in WinISD and honestly very close to the 12W6.

Going that route would've been way cheaper up front but it would have some consequences, and that was the deciding point for me.

Going that route would've left me with an empty Stealthbox, which would be more difficult to sell, and I'd probably have to let the empty box go for very little money b/c the new owner would have to shell out $350+ for a new TW3. At least this way I have a fully-functional Stealthbox to sell, and can recoup part of the cost of the 12W6.

I figured if I was going to buy another TW3 to put in a ported box, I might as well step up to the next model in the JL food chain and "future proof" myself a bit. While not a shallow mount like the TW3/5, the W6 is a beast that does many things well and will handle more power than it's rated for. Should keep me happy for a long time. The Stealthbox did until I got itchy for a real system again.

 

[chowman90]

Hey Mike, just thought I'd post this as you inspired me to work on my project.

 

[mikes2017gt]

@chowman90 Wow! Very clean-looking and I love those LED floor supports! What a great idea. You kill two birds with one stone; floor supports and LED lighting. Would be interested in knowing more about them.; how are they mounted and the LED lights themselves.

I actually thought about installing some LED-strip lighting around the amp rack, but just got burnt out on the install process. It was 95+degrees every day in the garage during the install and it took me longer than I thought it would. The LEDs will have to wait. LOL!

I still haven't gotten around to tuning the system. Work picked up big-time shortly after I finished the install, so I've just been running it as-is. Good timing, I guess, that I finished it right before I wound up having very little spare time again.

I'm very happy with amplification I choose; more power than I'll ever need and the Morel components sound great, but the mids can be grating on certain songs. I'm just living with that part until I can get around to tuning.

It took more than a month but I finally got my hands on a 12W6d3-D4 sub. I sat on Crutchfield's waiting list for a while before deciding to just pay $20 more and get it somewhere else. The sub and the Precision Port are sitting in the garage, waiting for me. I've got my box design done. 2.0cf net, with a 4" Precision Port. Tuned at 30Hz and WinISD shows ruler-flat down to 40Hz. Should be a nice sounding box.

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