Boosted Timing Info

[BlownOne]

Timing tapers off up top because you're making more boost up top. More boost means less timing usually governed by octane. The tune will also lower timing according to load which can be adjusted in the tune.

If you're on e85 and methanol, even with 17psi I would expect more than 16* up top. I would talk to your tuner to see if it can take more timing. Like I said, the tune may be limited to how much timing it will add with the knock sensors based on boost/load. I've read boosted E85 coyotes can do 22*+, depending on boost level of course. It's possible that you've reached the limit of timing at 17psi but only your tuner could tell you.

That being said, at a certain point you will reach the maximum timing that makes more power, after that you're just putting stress on the engine for no gain. I'm not sure what that is for our motors though.

Here's my stats with my last nozzle. Knock reading wont really matter since timing is telling you what the knock sensors are doing. But it will tell how much timing is commanded in the tune versus how much is being added with the sensors.

Year: 17 GT
Fuel: 93 with 60/40 meth/water 625 ml/min Snow nozzle
Max Boost: 13.5psi
Total timing: 18* at the hit, climbed to 22*, tapered to 21*
Knock: -1.25* Knock on the hit and -3.89* knock up top
Ambient Air temp: Dont remember
Iat: 28* starting 54* ending iat swing during 3rd gear pull from 2500-7400rpm

Good info brotha!

That’s what I thought about timing tapering as boost increases too, but even with just e85 (meth isn’t doing anything above 5k rpm) I would think timing should be higher up top. It looks like it holds great timing at first when the meth is hitting then goes back to how it’s been once the r’s start climbing. I’ll be able to test my therapy after I install the new nozzle and if timing pops up in the 19* area that will be perfect. If not then it’s something limiting in my street tune, which has less timing commanded, but has the ability to add enough to bring it to 19-20*.

Another variable is horsepower level since a motor making 600hp would have less cylinder pressure and should want more timing than a 1000hp motor, all other things being equal. Guess I would need timing info from more guys making 1k+ horsepower to confirm tho.

I’ve talked to Jon@Lund about it already and he’s saying that the car is just happy with that timing and doesn’t seem to want more, which he said from the start when we were initially tuning. I have a race file that commands more but I’m waiting to test it after in get the 1200ml nozzle in and see what timing does on the street file.

Damn bro the meth must be soaking the iat sensor to get you down to 28* lol.

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[BlownOne]

Hahaha posted in wrong thread.

 

[RoadCone]

I was trying to attach a log, but it won't let me... any advice?

 

[Killswitch16GT]

My WOT pull to 7.5k. Twin Turbo E85 Sai Li. This is just 6 psi though

https://datazap.me/u/killswitchv1/bwtt-saili-75k

 

[RoadCone]

Ok... here is a street pull on mine.... Please feel free to evaluate and make comments, as I'm no expert.

Zmap and Zuser is boost and Fuel pressure logged.

 

[dubster99]

23ish up top on e85, 10psi for now

 

[ahl395]

sorry, how do i see the timing in my logs. Thank you

Open your log in excel, the "saftot" column is timing. You can look at the RPM and Pedal columns to correlate your timing with your actual pull.

Good info brotha!

That’s what I thought about timing tapering as boost increases too, but even with just e85 (meth isn’t doing anything above 5k rpm) I would think timing should be higher up top. It looks like it holds great timing at first when the meth is hitting then goes back to how it’s been once the r’s start climbing. I’ll be able to test my therapy after I install the new nozzle and if timing pops up in the 19* area that will be perfect. If not then it’s something limiting in my street tune, which has less timing commanded, but has the ability to add enough to bring it to 19-20*.

Another variable is horsepower level since a motor making 600hp would have less cylinder pressure and should want more timing than a 1000hp motor, all other things being equal. Guess I would need timing info from more guys making 1k+ horsepower to confirm tho.

I’ve talked to Jon@Lund about it already and he’s saying that the car is just happy with that timing and doesn’t seem to want more, which he said from the start when we were initially tuning. I have a race file that commands more but I’m waiting to test it after in get the 1200ml nozzle in and see what timing does on the street file.

Damn bro the meth must be soaking the iat sensor to get you down to 28* lol.

Interesting. Report back after trying the new nozzle, I think it might be the street tune limiting it.

Ok... here is a street pull on mine.... Please feel free to evaluate and make comments, as I'm no expert.

Zmap and Zuser is boost and Fuel pressure logged.

Log looks awesome. Steady 23* timing pretty much the whole pull. I'm jelly :lol:

 

[r1lovin]

I was 17* on pump. On e85 getting 22* up top. Knock sensor ids adding 5*

 

[ProChargerTECH]

Mine peaks at 19º at 8100 on 93
Zero knock, 4" pulley makes 13lbs when you rev it to the moon(the moon is 8k)

Shouldn't ever really be "0"
Unless they have been turned off, limited, or desensitized.

99% of the time if your foot is down, they are adding or removing.

 

[BlownOne]

Ok so it looks like I was limited by octane at my hp and boost level I guess because after adding the 1200ml nozzle my it’s giving me 21.5* on the hit tapering to 19* all the way into 4th and still holding! This was with a similar ambient (same testing location) as my last log with the only differences being double the nozzle and 50/50 water/meth blend. Iat’s stayed in the low/mid 80’s the entire hit. I’m on 5.5 gain so I still need to play with the setting to see if it helps or hurts turning it up. My car is a meth addict offically lol

 

[RoadCone]

Log looks awesome. Steady 23* timing pretty much the whole pull. I'm jelly :lol:

Thank you... I think I was getting tire spin, but having a fuel system and oversized injectors with E85 doesn't hurt.

 

[ahl395]

Ok so it looks like I was limited by octane at my hp and boost level I guess because after adding the 1200ml nozzle my it’s giving me 21.5* on the hit tapering to 19* all the way into 4th and still holding! This was with a similar ambient (same testing location) as my last log with the only differences being double the nozzle and 50/50 water/meth blend. Iat’s stayed in the low/mid 80’s the entire hit. I’m on 5.5 gain so I still need to play with the setting to see if it helps or hurts turning it up. My car is a meth addict offically lol

Awesome results!!

 

[ahl395]

I figured I'd post this here since it's semi-related.

I asked Lund their opinion on running more boost vs more timing while tuning my meth. I alwasys thought more timing is better to evacuate heat out of the cylinder and off the rings but apparently it's the other way around. This was their response. Just food for thought.

its actually opposite form the testing I've seen we typically like to run more boost before cramming in more timing. both create more heat but timing seems to heat up the cylinder more so then boost. which makes sense. if you think about. igniting the fire sooner keeps it burning longer in the cylinder longer then retarding timing with more boost in the cylinder. also more boost in the cylinder calls for more fuel in the cylinder which would act as a cooling agent to a degree.

 

[whatsup62]

I figured I'd post this here since it's semi-related.

I asked Lund their opinion on running more boost vs more timing while tuning my meth. I alwasys thought more timing is better to evacuate heat out of the cylinder and off the rings but apparently it's the other way around. This was their response. Just food for thought.

Yeah...Im with you on that. Learned myself a couple of weeks ago on a short road trip ( i almost never road trip this car so it was a new experience). Was cruising along in 6th gear and noticed the cylinder head temp and coolant temp was higher that normal. It was 50f outside and i normally see 192/182 respectively. Temps were at 205/195. Got on a long stretch of flat road and the temps started to come down. Then the road had a slight rise to it and I could see on my Nguage it started to add some timing and the temp immediately started rise again. I played around more with it. Shifted to 5th which raised rpm and ran cool from that point on.

 

[ProChargerTECH]

Yeah...Im with you on that. Learned myself a couple of weeks ago on a short road trip ( i almost never road trip this car so it was a new experience). Was cruising along in 6th gear and noticed the cylinder head temp and coolant temp was higher that normal. It was 50f outside and i normally see 192/182 respectively. Temps were at 205/195. Got on a long stretch of flat road and the temps started to come down. Then the road had a slight rise to it and I could see on my Nguage it started to add some timing and the temp immediately started rise again. I played around more with it. Shifted to 5th which raised rpm and ran cool from that point on.

When you hit the rise a few things happened.

1) Load went up which create heat
2) Load finally hit the point to allow timing to be added
3) Rpm was low, so water pump isn't moving a lot of fluid.

Once you downshifted you changed everything.
Less load
More rpm = more water pump flow
Etc.


So really kinda what you would expect, unrelated to timing.

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