Another Edelbrock E-Force Supercharger Thread

[Burkey]

Using some other car for any comparison is your first mistake. I don't know anything about what PBD is doing, they do a great job but I can tell you what we know. They did one the other day that did 540/710 so you can't compare that car to your car.

Here's an example of an 18 here while we were doing air box testing. Plenty of low end torque. These are PD devices, they pump more than enough air at low RPM, its all about cam control, timing, lambda to optimize low end torque.

Um...with all due respect, that chart starts at 4500rpm...
I’d hardly call that “low rpm”
Even if you’re spinning to 8k, that’s still more than half way through the rev range.
Bottom end or low rpm would be from around 2000 rpm.
PLEASE produce sheets comparing the Gen 2/Gen 3/ Gen 4, same tune, same boost (say 10-12psi) from 2k to 8k so that people like myself (stock block/pump fuel) can make an informed decision on whether the upgrade suits us.

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[Platinum_5.0]

Mine don't...

 

[Burkey]

Mine don't...

Don’t what? Not sure what you’re saying sorry

 

[Platinum_5.0]

Don’t what? Not sure what you’re saying sorry

Oh you quoted my pic and Whipple's saying that the RPM's start at 4000...lol...I was just saying that it doesn't on my graph.

 

[Burkey]

Oh you quoted my pic and Whipple's saying that the RPM's start at 4000...lol...I was just saying that it doesn't on my graph.

Lol. My bad. Somehow it had me replying to two posts. Had to edit.

 

[Platinum_5.0]

Lol. My bad. Somehow it had me replying to two posts. Had to edit.

....lol...no worries.

 

[Brent Davis]

Bottom end or low rpm would be from around 2000 rpm.

Burkey that’s a good statement. I don’t have my initial tuning sheet handy because they were all low RPM pulls to make sure the fuel, timing etc was good before we took it to the moon BUT with the 3.75” pulley it was 520’s at 2000 and over 600 at 2000 with the 3.625”. Of course you are asking for the Gen2,3 &4 options but that was my observation for the Gen5 since that’s what I have. If the Edelbrock makes the same or more bottom end, I’ve said earlier that it is almost unmanageable that low of RPM and ove 500+ TQ without a street drag radial.

 

[Kona 18]

I’ve said earlier that it is almost unmanageable that low of RPM and ove 500+ TQ without a street drag radial.

if you have a boosted coyote and you can hook on street tires from a dig or <60mph rolls then you want to re-evaluate your choice of boost. Even my 700whp/501wtrq 2200SL would blow the tires off from anything less than 50 roll.

 

[Burkey]

if you have a boosted coyote and you can hook on street tires from a dig or <60mph rolls then you want to re-evaluate your choice of boost. Even my 700whp/501wtrq 2200SL would blow the tires off from anything less than 50 roll.

EXACTLY! Couldn’t agree more although I’d keep going....should be able to do it in third (MT82) at >60mph too.

 

[Brent Davis]

Kona 18, can you share what your torque was at 2000 RPM’s? Not to compare with mine but I just wanted to know what your combo did at that range.

The comment about unmanageable low end is because I know more people than I can count that go with a PD blower first and then complain about not being able to hook on the tires they bought the car with. And as you stated they shoulda re-evaluated their choice before purchasing while also at least getting a set of drag radials too. In my case if the Edelbrock indeed makes about 100 more ft lbs of torque mod for mod, equal to equal, I couldn’t imagine more than what I got now. Looks like the Edelbrock is indeed a good choice from that opening video though.

 

[Burkey]

Kona 18, can you share what your torque was at 2000 RPM’s? Not to compare with mine but I just wanted to know what your combo did at that range.

The comment about unmanageable low end is because I know more people than I can count that go with a PD blower first and then complain about not being able to hook on the tires they bought the car with. And as you stated they shoulda re-evaluated their choice before purchasing while also at least getting a set of drag radials too. In my case if the Edelbrock indeed makes about 100 more ft lbs of torque mod for mod, equal to equal, I couldn’t imagine more than what I got now. Looks like the Edelbrock is indeed a good choice from that opening video though.

Not sure if this helps but the Edelbrocks I’ve seen here in Oz running e85 are typically making 1100Nm (810ft/lb). And, they’re doing it VERY early in the rev range.
Fourth gear low rpm wheelspin (MT82) is a genuine thing.
Needless to say, the stock clutch doesn’t stand a chance if it actually hooks.

 

[Brent Davis]

Not sure if this helps but the Edelbrocks I’ve seen here in Oz running e85 are typically making 1100Nm (810ft/lb). And, they’re doing it VERY early in the rev range.
Fourth gear low rpm wheelspin (MT82) is a genuine thing.
Needless to say, the stock clutch doesn’t stand a chance if it actually hooks.

Thanks Burkey. Yeah man 810 ft/lbs and early is ton and especially early. I mean with my 600 early in the 2000 rpm range it is all I want and more. The stock MT82 and stock clutch are holding up still pretty good and to my surprise. I’ve been seeing a few people do Gen5’s on S197 cars though so I can’t imagine why it can’t be fitted to the ‘15-‘17 cars too.

 

[Burkey]

Thanks Burkey. Yeah man 810 ft/lbs and early is ton and especially early. I mean with my 600 early in the 2000 rpm range it is all I want and more. The stock MT82 and stock clutch are holding up still pretty good and to my surprise. I’ve been seeing a few people do Gen5’s on S197 cars though so I can’t imagine why it can’t be fitted to the ‘15-‘17 cars too.

Without having any knowledge of the DI system I can’t say how difficult it might be. I’ve certainly seen it done.
The stock clutch on mine held up absolutely fine on a tune from one of the BIG companies over there in the US. I then went and got a dyno tune that gave 10% more power across the board and the stock clutch shat itself within weeks. I presume the 18/19 clutch is more resilient than the 15-17

 

[Platinum_5.0]

I never really hit the car on the dyno below 2500 but I was just over 500TQ at 3100rpm on my 2.9, 536TQ at 4200 and 500TQ at 7100 on the stock whipple calibrationon my 17. Like mentioned above, the only time I could hook on the street was most times in 3rd at 50mph which put me at about 35-3700rpm. I have 3.73 rear still stock 275 tire with a Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 tire.

 

[Burkey]

Thought I might just add this to the conversation. Feel free to discuss/dispute any of my findings. I’m always happy to learn something new.

Whipple Gen 5 with all the gear at 16psi vs Edelbrock E Force modular inlet/103mm TB at 16psi.
The Whipple car is manual, the Edelbrock is auto. You can read into that whatever you want.
Yes, different dynos vary on different days etc. We all know this and that’s why we don’t race on dynos.
The numbers I’ve provided aren’t intended to be “perfect” but they do provide some food for thought and hopefully some discussion.

3k - *read below* Edelbrock 480hp (20-40% gain, read below)
4K - Whipple 525hp Edelbrock 625hp 19% gain
5k - Whipple 710hp. Edelbrock 810hp 14% gain
6k - Whipple 840hp Edelbrock 935 Hp 11% gain
7k - Whipple 920hp. Edelbrock 950 Hp 3% gain
7.5k - Whipple 960hp. Edelbrock 961 Hp
8k - Whipple 978hp. Edelbrock ????

* I predicted the Whipple’s output based on the shape of the torque curve which would suggest approximately 600ft/lb at 3k (342hp), giving a 40% gain to the Edelbrock.
Even if we were to assume that the Whipple was making 700ft/lb at 3k (it isn’t), this would give 400hp, a 20% gain to the Edelbrock. The truth of it is somewhere between those numbers.

Now, even if we were to assume that the dyno was favouring the Edelbrock by 10% (I cant comment on that), It’s still abundantly evident that the Edelbrock is still in front all the way to 5k and basically level at the 6k mark.

@Brent Davis I borrowed your dyno sheet, hope you don’t mind.

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