New GTD Ring Time - Your Move GM

[9secondko]

"Dude, WTF, we weren't even close to that time" LOLOLOL

LOL

M betting it’s VERY close. Maybe a few milliseconds better or worse.

That said, this seems like a development R&D run. Ford appears to have upgraded the car and possibly offering a new track package if some sort.

they’ll dial it in further and return to the ‘Ring.

can you even imagine if this thing gets into the 6:30’s? It’s a lo shot, sure. But nice to see they’re stepping up their game s bit.
With the gt500 replacement coming out, GTD power upgrades will put some distance between them without having to nerf the DHSC too much. It’s probably why we haven’t heard power ratings for the latter yet. They didn’t go all out with a turbo system, but looks and sounds like they went red hot with the supercharged setup. Wouldn’t be surprised to learn a big Whipple is sitting on top.

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[SnowFox]

actually we do. Comparing a number of tracks as an aggregate of performance tells the story. Not one single target.

My "nobody cares" was a more of a weighted exaggeration, I know their are people that care, and I'm one of them.

However In my very humble opinion, cars like the GTD, though definitely awesome probably are more about brand marketing and recognition than share driving profits. And though, some people will care about American tracks. It's undeniable the Nuremberg will carry more heft, even for marketing, it's ripe with potential story lines. Add The fact the Ford Mustang officially went on sale across Europe for the first time as a S550.

 

[SheepDog]

So put slicks on a ZR1X and run it again.

 

[WItoTX]

I'm still not convinced they are slicks. If these wheels are 19s, the world of street legal slicks opens up.

I didn't realize how limiting the GTD 20s were for tire selection.

 

[9secondko]

My "nobody cares" was a more of a weighted exaggeration, I know their are people that care, and I'm one of them.

However In my very humble opinion, cars like the GTD, though definitely awesome probably are more about brand marketing and recognition than share driving profits. And though, some people will care about American tracks. It's undeniable the Nuremberg will carry more heft, even for marketing, it's ripe with potential story lines. Add The fact the Ford Mustang officially went on sale across Europe for the first time as a S550.

Agreed. That's why it's important to win in a variety of comparisons, not just one.

The GTD is a ridiculously expensive proposition, so it MUST justify that. Getting its butt kicked all around town by a car that's over 100k cheaper makes it look REALLY bad. And that's coming from a once-GTD-fanboy. I hyped the car so much, but when the ZR1 was announced, it was clear Ford did not do anywhere near enough. So there is a lot of hope riding on this updated version. It needs to have way more firepower. The ZR1 is as aerodynamic as it gets. The GTD... it's doing what it can, but is still kind of a brick. It looks awesome, but it's pretty thick. 800+ crank HP and 600+ tq is nothing compared to 1000+ HP and 800+ tq AT THE WHEELS. Ford needs to at least match the ZR1 power output and go further with the suspension. The GTD needs to be competitive or better in a straight line as well as at various American tracks.

Ford.Multimatic can do it, but they just keep cutting corners. It's annoying. they still haven't gone twin turbo, which would put the GTD far ahead of the ZR1. But let's see what the upgraded supercharged engine can produce. The GTD simply needs to do more than everyone else. We all have been trained since birth to expect half million dollar price tags for lambos, etc. But for a Mustang? That thing had better earn it and then earn it some more,

There is so much to criticize about the GTD that could have been avoided with a more honest price tag, better performance, more honest marketing, or any combination of those. "Race car made street legal" was a lie. "Factory Mustang upgraded for the 'Ring" would have told the story. Ford overpromised and underdelivered. Now we hope they have done the opposite.

I don't view the removal of the video from social as a bad sign. I view it as a good one. The unofficial time is likely accurate, if not off by a milisecond or two better or worse. And the fact the euro car did better than the USA car shows how much is left in the USA car, even without dialing it in. They don't want to tip off the competition and they don't want to reveal numbers until they have everything dialed in and have gone as good as they can. I expect another 'Ring run or two and a reveal shortly thereafter. We have seen two specs of the car now. perhaps there will be another. But even if we don't, there is room to get more out of the two cars presented.

All this upgrading of the GTd will be for nought though if they don't do enough. WE all know GM will respond with an upgraded ZR1/X and with the lengths Ford has already gone to with the GTd, it may be that the c8 has more room to grow. Come on Ford. Get serious.

 

[Ewheels]

I still say the price of the GTD is irrelevant. If you're comparing it to other cars in terms of value, you were not the target audience.
Buyers are paying for the history and exclusivity of it. Hell, Ford could have slapped any price tag they wanted on it and every single one of them still would've sold.

The goal of this car was to make the craziest, blank-check Mustang ever and beat the Germans on their home turf.....with this newest lap time, they've achieved that.

The comparisons with Corvette are logical but was not the intended purpose of the car.

 

[lo-fi]

I still say winning the driver experience battle is a far better achievement than having the single best lap times. Not only that they produced a very fast car which looks far better than the Corvette. Consumers don't buy rare cars because of track times, never have, and never will. At this price range exclusivity, appearance, and feel will drive sales. There is a reason the GT3 Touring package is the top selling GT3 trim and not the track oriented trim levels.

 

[9secondko]

I still say the price of the GTD is irrelevant. If you're comparing it to other cars in terms of value, you were not the target audience.
Buyers are paying for the history and exclusivity of it. Hell, Ford could have slapped any price tag they wanted on it and every single one of them still would've sold.

The goal of this car was to make the craziest, blank-check Mustang ever and beat the Germans on their home turf.....with this newest lap time, they've achieved that.

The comparisons with Corvette are logical but was not the intended purpose of the car.

at that price, it’s incredibly relevant. Especially when it’s beaten by cheaper competition. There no way around it.

 

[9secondko]

I still say winning the driver experience battle is a far better achievement than having the single best lap times. Not only that they produced a very fast car which looks far better than the Corvette. Consumers don't buy rare cars because of track times, never have, and never will. At this price range exclusivity, appearance, and feel will drive sales. There is a reason the GT3 Touring package is the top selling GT3 trim and not the track oriented trim levels.

move never bought a car for the ‘Ring time. But I have cross shopped and bought the faster car with more potential, despite originally thinking of something else. If someone isn’t a brand loyalist or a fan of a specific car, it is everything. Those who hsvr bought GTDs so far are a mix. I can only imagine the crush some felt after buying in only to be leapfrogged before the car hit the garage. Sure some sint care becsuse it’s a high level mustang and that’s ehst they want st any price. But a great many will.

there care more than a few who’ve cancelled orders in favor of the zr1. It’s simply a reality. That’s why ford needs to do more. They can’t build an slso-ram snf expect to be treated like the belle of the ball. Thsys just fantasy land.

 

[lo-fi]

Sure some sint care becsuse it’s a high level mustang and that’s ehst they want st any price. But a great many will.

This is the crux of our disagreement. I think very very few are going to care as very very few will be at the track. It's rare, it looks great, and by all accounts is civil on the road.

 

[9secondko]

This is the crux of our disagreement. I think very very few are going to care as very very few will be at the track. It's rare, it looks great, and by all accounts is civil on the road.

Of course very few will care. Because Thsys how many will own one. The only bragging rights to the current Gtd are how much you can sell it for down the road? Sad sad thing.

compare that with the msny more zr1 owners who will spank the Gtd owners should they dare to let their protected baby into the wild

“hey look! My car is way more expensive snf I never drive it, but at least there are less of it so that way there will be less victories for the zr1 to have over it.”

Thats so not the flex you think it is.

that said, it could all be restored to proper order if Ford did enough this time around.

 

[Ewheels]

at that price, it’s incredibly relevant. Especially when it’s beaten by cheaper competition. There no way around it.

Disagree. You're thinking like a value buyer (myself included). These people are buying a GTD without even looking at their bank account. The price means nothing to them. They buy a GTD because they want a GTD. Hell, they are probably buying a ZR1 at the same time because why not.

I know a few people with GTD allocations and they already have several cars faster and more expensive than a GTD.

 

[WItoTX]

First off, no one is going on record saying what they paid for their GTD. Ford has a non-disclosure agreement with owners on that topic. So let's just assume $325k, based on what Ford has claimed. Pricing for the Carbon or Spirit of America hasn't been released. So we are left to guess on that.

Once GM dealers mark up the ZR1X, you are looking at just shy of 300k. Been multiple postings showing window stickers.

So now you are 25-35k difference in price. If I am in a position where I am deciding between the two, and especially if I just saw what the GTD did at the ring, albeit potentially with slicks, I'm taking the GTD all day. It's prettier, way cooler, obviously can handle it's weight well, and looks American. The Corvette just looks like every other mid engine car out there. And the Z06 sounds the part too.

This is coming from someone who really respects the ZR1X for it's capability. Strictly performance as my decision maker, ZR1X all day. But once I factor the things that make a car interesting, like looks, powertrain, exclusivity, driving experience (Front engine rear drive), ability to turn off nannies, the GTD wins all day. The GTD feels familiar. The ZR1X looks like an exotic, without the good looks. This assumes I have more than enough money to buy either. And I certainly don't.

 

[9secondko]

Disagree. You're thinking like a value buyer (myself included). These people are buying a GTD without even looking at their bank account. The price means nothing to them. They buy a GTD because they want a GTD. Hell, they are probably buying a ZR1 at the same time because why not.

I know a few people with GTD allocations and they already have several cars faster and more expensive than a GTD.

InCorrect I’m thinking like a common sense person. A 330+k sports car should not get its behind whooped by a car costing half as much.
Likewise, a car that was custom built by a specialty house should not lose the ONE thing it was meant to win to a commodity car made in-house for the mass market (as niche as that is for a sports car).

trying to twist and turn every which way in order to avoid a direct comparison between two clear direct competitors is next level mental gymnastics.
The fact is GM won this round. Let’s do the grown up thing and give them their props for the win. It’s indeed impressive. At the same time, let’s see what ford cooks up for round 2. Exciting times.

 

[ihasnostang]

trying to keep the shit slinging going

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