5.0 Coyote vs LS3/LT1 GM engines - how do they compare?

[lazarus870]

Engine only comparison.

GM has more cubic inches but single-cam and physically more compact of an engine.
Ford has 1.2 liters less but is a larger 4-cam engine.

The LS3 and LT1 engines seem to put out more power. The 5.0 seems "higher tech".

What advantages does the 5.0 Coyote have over the bigger GM engines? How does it being a 4-cam engine, etc. help it?

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[Process]

If you stuck a LT1 or LS3 in a S550, the S550 would accelerate faster.

 

[Hack]

GMs engines are basically a modernized small block Ford from the 60s. They have the disadvantages of not being able to independently control the cams, so they have to be undercammed for emissions purposes. This makes them in my experience - great truck motors with lots of torque but a dead top end. Cylinder deactivation is used by GM to get better MPG. From what I've been told, the NVH of cylinder deactivation really sucks. When cruising you get a 4 cylinder sound and a struggling engine with no torque. But hey, gas mileage is good! I would be concerned about cylinder wall glazing when the engine is run with cylinders deactivated.

The Coyote can handle huge power adders in stock form and it is very reliable. GMs engines have been known to fail - they even had more than one failure of an engine in a car meant specifically for magazine testing! The crank and pistons in the LS motors are good for about 450 hp - at least the older versions are that way. I get a little confused because it seems almost every year GM comes out with a new redesign. I see that as another positive for the Coyote - only slight changes since its release means Ford actually got it right the first time.

 

[legendary mustang]

GMs engines are basically a modernized small block Ford from the 60s. They have the disadvantages of not being able to independently control the cams, so they have to be undercammed for emissions purposes. This makes them in my experience - great truck motors with lots of torque but a dead top end. Cylinder deactivation is used by GM to get better MPG. From what I've been told, the NVH of cylinder deactivation really sucks. When cruising you get a 4 cylinder sound and a struggling engine with no torque. But hey, gas mileage is good! I would be concerned about cylinder wall glazing when the engine is run with cylinders deactivated.

The Coyote can handle huge power adders in stock form and it is very reliable. GMs engines have been known to fail - they even had more than one failure of an engine in a car meant specifically for magazine testing! The crank and pistons in the LS motors are good for about 450 hp - at least the older versions are that way. I get a little confused because it seems almost every year GM comes out with a new redesign. I see that as another positive for the Coyote - only slight changes since its release means Ford actually got it right the first time.

your not the only one that says the gm motor is really a FORD motor.a friend of mine in ohio that works for SVT said that years ago.he has said alot of things over the years and it has been right on.FORD makes better engines than gm.:ford::cheers:

 

[Strokerswild]

GMs engines are basically a modernized small block Ford from the 60s.

This. Even a buddy of mine, who is as diehard a GM fanboy as it gets, admits it. Pull one apart once, and the similarities are amazing (some more than others).

Eventually GM will be forced to come up with something more efficient. I'm amazed and impressed at how far they have taken pushrod architecture, but the writing is on the wall when it comes to fuel economy/emissions. They could control the cam, but it won't make a ton of difference since there's only one. I'm a cubic inch fan, but they are going away.....

Originally the C7 Z06 was supposed to be naturally aspirated, but GM couldn't meet their horsepower goals while meeting emissions and fuel economy targets. Enter the supercharger.

Forced induction on smaller, more complex and efficient engines is becoming the norm.....

 

[ZaneWayne]

GMs engines are basically a modernized small block Ford from the 60s. They have the disadvantages of not being able to independently control the cams, so they have to be undercammed for emissions purposes. This makes them in my experience - great truck motors with lots of torque but a dead top end. Cylinder deactivation is used by GM to get better MPG. From what I've been told, the NVH of cylinder deactivation really sucks. When cruising you get a 4 cylinder sound and a struggling engine with no torque. But hey, gas mileage is good! I would be concerned about cylinder wall glazing when the engine is run with cylinders deactivated.

The Coyote can handle huge power adders in stock form and it is very reliable. GMs engines have been known to fail - they even had more than one failure of an engine in a car meant specifically for magazine testing! The crank and pistons in the LS motors are good for about 450 hp - at least the older versions are that way. I get a little confused because it seems almost every year GM comes out with a new redesign. I see that as another positive for the Coyote - only slight changes since its release means Ford actually got it right the first time.

Some of what you said is true. AFM is not ideal for a performance car. But in the LT1, you barely tell its there compared to the L99 in the 5th gen. Also, GM does not come out with a new small black every year haha. The LS3 was introduced in 2008, LT1 in 2014.


If we are talking about which engine is better out of the box, its the LT1. The HP is pretty close, but the torque is not. Having driven a S550, the torque of the LT1 is leaps and bounds better. Mod for mod, however (especially forced induction) seems to narrow the gap or even make the coyote better.

 

[bluebeastsrt]

If you stuck a LT1 or LS3 in a S550, the S550 would accelerate faster.

No! Only the LT1 would be faster. Its a simple matter of looking at how much HP and torque a motor makes. The LS3 doesn't hold up to the Coyotes numbers just as the Coyotes doesn't hold up to the LT1s . By the way this thread is just asking for 4000+ posts of non sense. Both motors rank as some of the best performance motors ever built IMO.

 

[ZaneWayne]

This. Even a buddy of mine, who is as diehard a GM fanboy as it gets, admits it. Pull one apart once, and the similarities are amazing (some more than others).

Eventually GM will be forced to come up with something more efficient. I'm amazed and impressed at how far they have taken pushrod architecture, but the writing is on the wall when it comes to fuel economy/emissions. They could control the cam, but it won't make a ton of difference since there's only one. I'm a cubic inch fan, but they are going away.....

Originally the C7 Z06 was supposed to be naturally aspirated, but GM couldn't meet their horsepower goals while meeting emissions and fuel economy targets. Enter the supercharger.

Forced induction on smaller, more complex and efficient engines is becoming the norm.....

The fuel efficiency of the LT1 is actually fantastic. Yes it has AFM, but I can easily get over 30 MPG at 70MPH. I actually saw has high has 33.2. And my car is not broke in yet.

Emissions on the other hand is going to be the bitch to meet. Harder to meet those with higher cubes.

 

[ZaneWayne]

NO!

How would a more powerful engine not make it faster?

edit: I only saw NO! haha

 

[Process]

No! Only the LT1 would be faster. Its a simple matter of looking at how much HP and torque a motor makes. The LS3 doesn't hold up to the Coyotes numbers just as the Coyotes doesn't hold up to the LT1s . By the way this thread is just asking for 4000+ posts of non sense. Both motors rank as some of the best performance motors ever built IMO.

Ls3 also has a better torque curve than the coyote.

 

[bluebeastsrt]

Ls3 also has a better torque curve than the coyote.

But runs out of breath much more quickly.

 

[ZaneWayne]

But runs out of breath much more quickly.

I would agree that the S550 with a coyote or LS3 would be very very close with the nod to the coyote.

 

[bluebeastsrt]

I would agree that the S550 with a coyote or LS3 would be very very close with the nod to the coyote.

Yes. And that's all im saying. S550 Coyote over LS3 by the SMALLEST of margains. Coyotes wont hold up to the LT1 currently. I wont speculate about future engines because I think there is a lot left on the bone for both GM and Fords offerings.

 

[Glenn G]

But runs out of breath much more quickly.

yep no way a 2 valve head can ever flow as much as 4 valve head. which is why an Lx needs so much more displacement to make the same power as the Coyote.

On the other hand less flow area around the valves promotes intake velocity at low RPM which boosts torque, That combined with larger displacement is what makes those OHV motors torque monsters.

 

[ZaneWayne]

Yes. And that's all im saying. S550 Coyote over LS3 by the SMALLEST of margains. Coyotes wont hold up to the LT1 currently. I wont speculate about future engines because I think there is a lot left on the bone for both GM and Fords offerings.

Word! Although I think there is more left for the coyote. DI. Whether or not some people here want it.

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